Deezlodawg, that’s deep man. 
Sniper have you ever jerked off? That’s also a no no. Ever cussed? Ever yelled at your neighbor? Ever took the lord name in vein? All no no’s. Point being I belive in god and if so understanding he’ll understand why people do what they do these days.
Another Christian signing in…2nd Tim. 3:16 tells us "All scripture is literally “God breathed”, or authored by God through men.
I agree that we shouldn’t push Christ on all men but advocate looking at Christ, investigating Him in the Bible. Having said that though, man is totally accountable for accepting or rejecting Christ as the way to heaven. He is a gentleman, so to speak, but speaks with extraordinary clarity.
As for sex outside marriage, it’s wrong. As for frequent recreational happiness within marriage, its right! Christ really is gracious, He means for us to have a meaningful time in life, if we’ll give Him a chance.
Scipio Africanus
I must not be a good Christian then because I’ve jerked off twice today, said “God damnit” at least 3 times, yelled at my neighbor, ate vast quantities of sushi for lunch making for a $30 lunch tab, and I’m currently drinking to excess. This isn’t even including all of the sexual thoughts, foul language, and violent videogames. And what about the porn?
I’m all about the Salt and the Light.
How is pre-marital sex immoral? I would think that sexual promescuity is immoral from a responsibility standpoint. Marriage didn’t always exist, were people sinning and condemned to hell then?
What about people who are decent and aren’t Christians? Back in the Crusades you were killed for that. The only place you will find information about the acceptance of Christ being the only way to salvation is from Christians or the Bible. If this was a universal thing it would be everywhere. Of course, it is everywhere but not when you take things literally and close yourself off to different ideas. Every single major religion on planet earth is based on the same fundamental abstract concepts; human truth through an understanding and acceptance of moral behavior.
Religion is about control, power, and money. Morality is about accepting basic responsibility; both to yourself and other people. Basic responsibility probably has a lot to do with not engaging in activities that are going to create children, cause you to get diseased, or damage yourself or other people physically or emotionally.
Now for another beer…
Hey guys, or knowing now that not only are many of you fellow TMen but Christians as well I should say “Brothers.”
For ANY Christian struggling with lusting/sexual temptation, etc., check out a book called Every Man’s Battle. It’ll really help to set you straight. Sex won’t even be a temptation any more, jerking off and eying girls either… that’s the truth that this book speaks to you.
Also remember:
Flee from sexual immorality.
(1 Corinthians 6:18)
Just a thought to all those ,“I’m sinning all the time but it’s okay cus I’m going to Heaven” posters… yes the Bible tells us that once you accept Him as your Lord and Savior that you are saved, and no sin can take that from you, but also consider that the Bible also teaches us that once you are saved you are filled with the Holy Spirit, and that you will be “convicted” from then on to live a life after Christ. If you feel no conviction to direct your life in His direction, I would spend some time alone considering your salvation…
I also want to point out that there is a difference in “knowing” and “loving” Christ. I was saved after “knowing” him, and led a Christian rock group and was a Christian speaker for many years, but when I came to “love” Him I realized the difference. I beleive a large majority of Christians “know” him (usually the ones who struggle the most) and are saved, but fewer “love” Him and actually seek His face.
Just some thoughts, I’m really brushing up on my Theological studies now as well, lots of readings by Christian apologist like Pascal, Lewis, Augustine, etc. as well as studies on how exactly the Bible came to be. If anyone had questions like this it’d be cool for me to have find some answers…
Question to Deezledog,
I found your posts, especially regarding morality, very thought provoking. However I remembered that morality, power, control, etc. these are all things concerned with life. We have to remember that Christianity, as well as other religions, is concerned not only with aspects of life such as living moraly but with life after our deaths as well.
Having pointed that out I want to bring up a point to all non-beleivers from Blaise Pascal (a favorite apologist of mine).
Pascal wrote, “You beleive that after death there is nothing, while I beleive that after death their is eternal life. If you are right, then we both loose and have nothing to gain. If I am right however, you still loose while I gain everything.”
You see, Pascal was a logical thinker and mathmetician, you can say that he’s playing the odds in such a way that he does at least have a chance for something, as opposed to never dealing with the question of “what’s after this…?”
Just thoughts.
Amen deezlodawg!
First off, whoever said us Christians don’t “enjoy” sex has the wrong impression of the situation - I know I |“want” and would “enjoy” sex as much as the next guy, but I believe God wants me to wait until I am married so I plan to.
Regarding masturbation, yes I do it, I do it fairly frequently - show me a man who honestly doesn’t and I’ll be pretty amazed. However, I am also unaware of anywhere in the bible that says masturbation is a sin - it can be if it leads to lust, but in and of itself, it is as far as I’m concerned not a sin - in fact many men I know, myself included, masturbate at least in part because it keeps ones head “clear,” relieves sexual tension, and makes it easier to do the right thing when opportunities for sex present themselves. The only possible reference to masturbation in the bible I can think of is in Leviticus, but that is very open to interpretation, plus it is significant that Jesus specifically released us from much of the old law. I am unaware of any reference to masturbation in the NT, unless you want to throw it in with sexual immorality, but I dont - how can something which you do alone and that effects no one and has only positive effects on you be immoral?
As for the other things mentioned (Lord’s name in vain, etc), of course I have done them on occasion - everyone is a sinner - thankfully we are forgiven. It does NOT follow however that you just do whatever you want because you are already a sinner and will be forgiven. We are called to do our best to avoid sin, not give into it all the time and ask for forgiveness later.
Just adding my name to the list of believers here. There is no reason being a T-man is at odds with being saved. I work with our youth department and being a T-man gets me more respect from the kids. This is a forum that will try to beat you down for NOT having as much sex as possible, but it sounds like you will remain strong. I’ve only been a Christian for 4 years, so I sinned a lot before that and since I’m not perfect I’ll sin again, unfortunately. Stick to your guns; you know right from wrong. Just 'cause everybody else does it don’t mean it’s the right thing to do. We as Christians are called to be “set apart” from the world and should be happy when people call us freaks, prudes, or whatever. It takes much more strength to swim against the current. Be strong.
Another Christian signing in here!
FWIW: The orginal translation of “sexual immorality” is “fornication” which means extramarital sex or given most contexts pre-marital sex (since “adultery” and “fornication” would be redundant).
Some one asked about denominations. Well, I often attend a Southern Baptist Church; however, I consider myself a Pauline Dispensationalist rather than a Baptists. Since there are no PD churches nearby, I attend the next best thing (a SB church).
I generally agree with Goldberg’s sentiments re: churches, however, I find it good to get to know other Christians in your area so you can have some good Christian fellowship and lean on each other when needed (per Paul’s directions to the Church).
ADDING MY NAME TO THE LIST- as for the pre-marital sex thing- nobodys perfect!
I’m all for that; I’m sure that when people die they aren’t just gone. Energy is neither created or destroyed, it is merely transferred. What does that mean? Maybe your afterlife is the recycling of molecules and atoms to create more life. Maybe there is a soul. I think my main point here is the path to life isn’t necessarily Christianity; it could be anything. Basic morals have a lot to do with survival; the most basic human instinct. There are probably a lot of people out there with a sound understanding of the world and their own spirituality who lack a belief in mysticism or “special powers” or powers beyond what they can understand through experimentation and science. I guess at the end of the day you have to do what works for you. Christianity works for a lot of people, as does Buddhism, Muslim faiths, or even atheism.
I believe in creation and look at the universe like its one big living thing. Its as if the entire thing is meant to support all forms of life. I’m not sure if there’s some white guy up there with long hair in a robe commanding to me to live a certain way. Jesus was of middle eastern decent, where did the white skin come from? It came from white europeans interpreting the writings of men before them and applying it in a way that was acceptable to the white europeans of the time. I went to a Christian school and one of the requirements was Theology; 4 years of it. I have even read the Bible in my own time for greater understanding of myself. I find that the core values of Christ’s teachings to be good; I really don’t know what to make of the rest of it.
Greg, you made me think of this one:
Matthew 5:13
"You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled by men.
Sniper99, I have some thoughts for you.
First off let me go ahead and start with the big announcement…
I don’t. Masterbate that is.
………<what’s wrong with him!?>…<See what happens to natural T levels when you don’t cycle off Mag10>…
The truth is this. The average male body is physically built to “get off” at least every 72 hrs. or so on average because we often jerk off so often for so many years, if you don’t get off in this time your body will do its job to convince you to (need I explain?) but what many men don’t realize is that just as they’ve trained their bodies to get off, you can train them not to. For me it took weeks of not being able to sleep, sitting on my hands, not watching TV, etc. But the truth is that you CAN get by w/out doing it, it’s just hard to. I used to think like most and thought it was impossible.
The question is why? Jesus asks you to be pure in your heart and your mind as well as physically.
Christ himself said: “But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.” (Matthew 5:28)
Yes! This means that to lust after a woman even in your mind is a sin!
Now Snipes I ask you, “When you do the big M, what are you doing in your mind!?” you’re not dividing fractions, or calculating your daily caloric intake are you? No, you’re lusting in your heart and mind, you’re sinning.
HOWEVER, at least you’re not risking babies, diseases, or worst of all banging someone you regreat and your buddies giving you a hard time… but that next step after no sex is to begin tweaking and fine tuning your sexual morality.
But I’m guessing that you already know that masturbating is wrong though don’t you, otherwise you wouldn’t have been convicted to seek out the answers and prepare an explanation like you did right?
Read “EVERY MAN’S BATTLE” by Arterburn. It’ll explain better.
Right on, Agathos. Very right indeed.
Could someone please tell me what is to happen to the other two-thirds of the 6 billion people on this planet when they die? The non-Christian ones? Not being a smartass; I am very curious about this. When I’ve posed the question before (not necessarily here), the only response I’ve gotten is a condescending “the Lord works in mysterious ways”-type of answer. Please don’t just quote scriptures; tell me what you believe happens to them. Are they sent to hell? Spend an eternity in Purgatory? What?
This thread absulutely baffles me. I don’t think I know ANYONE who takes the Bible as seriously as even the more easy-going of you guys.
It’s extremely shocking and sad to me, really.
As for Pascal, both he and others seem to think believing in God is a choise open to anyone. It isn’t. I cannot believe in God, anymore than I can believe in Santa Clause or unicorns. What Pascal said makes sense, but it simply isn’t an option.
It really makes me sad to see grownup people seriously talking about masturbation as a sin.
If there was a God, and he is such a loving character as he is supposed to be, there is no fucking way he would make life so hard on those who followed and loved him.
Well, At least none of you claim “proof” that the Bible is 100% correct, or 10% for that matter.
If I find myself in Hell after I die, I’ll only regret my life choices because of that. I feel I am a good person, I make decisions to help people when possible (and practical to some extent) I try to do anything I reasonably can to be the best man I can. I do so with absolutely no expectation of reward.
If Christian love is “love me or burn forever” I say fuck it. If God existed and loved us, he would certainly not punish us for not accepting a weird-ass story about him, written thousands of years ago.
Another thing. With all your “the bible is the unadulterated truth”-stuff, am I to regard you all as creationists as well, or do you manage to get evolution in the mix somehow?
Please do not take this as an attack, it’s just my take on things.
/Jacob
Tyler,
To be honest with you I get, and am not really satisfied with, the same responses you seem to get. I think some of the reason most dodge that question is that many Christians, even some pastors, theologiests, etc., are more of the mediocre type and are hesitant to anger or scare people away or are doubting themselves, CS Lewis has referred to as hyphenated Christans, but thats another topic…
Anyway, I give you a quick summary of my beleifs, research, etc. and try to avoid scripture (which I personally think is the best way to debate spiritual topics with non-Christians, I just don’t think that automatically quoting the Bible to someone who doesn’t believe in it to be the best way to get them to see your side…).
First I want to point out that I beleive in the rapture, or Christ’s return to earth, etc., and that I divide this topic into two areas. Non-beleivers who die before the rapture and those after.
In both cases I beleive that Christ, for lack of a better word “pardons” some, this would include children/teens not old enough to be responsible, as well as possibly, possibly, individuals who never received exposure the Christ’s truth.
But I also strongly beleive that many if not all non-beleivers will at some point in their life, at least once if not many times, be exposed to Christ and allowed to make a decision. Examples would be your posting here and seeing replies that start you thinking, etc. Once you’ve been givin the truth and allowed chanes to commit to Christ and confess that you are a sinner and you die I beleive that yes, your soul is seperated from those who enjoy everlasting life in Heaven. Whether this seperation is Hell, Purgatory, possibly just blinked out of existence, is another topic.
I’m sure we’ve all been exposed to theories of the Rapture and have the basic premise down (Left Behind series is a good start, but by no means a defenitive study of the topic) but going on all beleivers will be taken and non-beleivers be left to a period of tribulation (call it a second choice) and many theories beleive that during this time 1/3 - 2/3s of the remaining populatino will turn to Christ, which isn’t hard to beleive if you’ve seen millions blink away and the other events of the tribulation.
Basically I don’t beleive, in fact I know, that being a “good person” or “moral” is not enough for salvation. Don’t fool yourself it isn’t. However I beleive everyone will get a chance to make a decision, maybe several chances. Bible versus take over really well here, but I degress…
The Bible is 100% accurate and truthfull, I really don’t get people who beleive some of it and not other portions…
And there is lots of proof that the Bible is accurate, who said there isn’t?
As far as “love me or burn”, nah, I stand up for and back up a fellow Christian Tman just as I would a non-beleiver TMan. I want to get along with everyone truth be known, which is why I try to be careful with my responses on this topic.
I hate to answer your, “if God loved me then why the threat of hell” question because I’m sure you’ve heard all the “typical loving Christian” responses to that, and I imagine they just get laughable and annoying to you after a while.
Also, thanks for responding the way you did, that’s cool, very few Christians will back me up on those ideas even and I was expecting a lot of attacks… so far so good…