I hope you put those handcuffs on real tight on anybody who is rioting, burning, looting… I am against police brutality, most of the time. However…
I do have a question though. Say you live in like Oregon, NY, NJ or Chicago, where the authoritarian nutbag, loony governor or mayor requires their unconstitutional edicts regarding gatherings of more than 6-10 people (depending on which banana republic you live in) and someone calls the cops on their neighbor for having say 11 people over at their house for dry turkey and bland potatoes. Do you go to the call? Do you enforce said unconstitutional edict?
Or say a church is having a service thus violating a governor’s executive order. Do you break up\ possibly arrest those who are gathered together in prayer? I want a cop’s perspective on this.
Pretty soon, Xi is going to demand that all women be inseminated with only his sperm and demand 2 children. If the girl is pretty he will do his duty and inseminate them the old fashion way. If they are trolls, we will require artificial insemination.
Or they are pandering and trying to ‘look cool’ to their friends who also live their life one virtue signal at a time. It’s great to be against racism, but lets be honest about the scope. There are very few ‘white supremacist’ kinds of racists. BLM is racist by definition, but they are hiding behind the narrative of critical race theory which dictates that by virtue of the color of your skin, you cannot be a racist. Which itself is a racist narrative. But in the real world, where words have meaning they are a racist organization. If you flip the races in the BLM narrative, it would sound like a KKK handbook.
Yeah, no. I was their age once too and I managed to have enough common sense to be able to discern right from wrong, communism vs. capitalism, fake race baiting from real racism.
It’s kinda funny. In 1991 in my poly-sci class we had to do a presentation on current events. My topic was how the media is responsible for driving the racism narrative, in effect making people believe it is worse than it actually is, in order to create strife where otherwise it would not be. My teacher was black. And when I say black, I mean BLACK, not brown, not racially black, like the color black. Black as the tires on my car black. He was from west Africa. He loved my speech, I was the only person in my group to get an A. I got that class hotter than a steel mill, too. But discussions were had.
I asked a simple question, how many people would even think about race on a day to day business if they never interacted with the media? That left the class briefly silent, but then they went on arguing with each other. My extremely black teacher had a hard time bringing the class back to order.
Point of this story, is that the media driven narrative of racism has been prevailing and infecting our society for decades now. And I was 19 when I made that presentation. Nobody told me about it, I came up with the topic all on my own. There was no ‘conservative media’ back then. At least none that I was aware of. I didn’t know who Rush Limbaugh was or Sean Hanity or any such people. There was cable TV and networks. That’s all I knew and I still could see through the bullshit. So sorry, no. I give these young kids no quarter for their abject stupidity. They have a responsibility to know things and find things out on their own. Even back then, I bothered to look things up on my own. It wasn’t as easy, I spent a lot of time in libraries. Further, I was one of those youngin’s that would brag that I hardly watched TV. Mainly because I was partying most of the time. But I somehow managed to keep a pulse on reality. So if I can do it, anybody can do it. I am the least talented person I have ever met.
I think there are a lot more radicalized people than you think. You have to be radicalized to think that kind of way. There is no way rational people could all come to the same nonsensical conclusions individually based on nothing but the facts. This is a narrative that has to be preached in order for a mass of people to all think the same way. Nobody, in isolation, processing just factual information, would come up with something like critical race theory, on their own. Its virtually impossible to come to critical race theory based on a distillation of fact processed through a reasonable mind. I am not saying people would all come to the same conclusion at all, they all may come up with different conclusions, but I don’t see how anybody could come to the conclusions of critical race theory based on facts.
Or they have really low self-esteem and just adopt the notions of any group that will accept them.
Stalin and Mao agree.
Do we have a qualifying figure to go along with this statement? Islam has to want to reform and I am certain a good many Muslims would like to see this badly needed reformist theology take root. But this type of radicalization can only be mitigated from the outside by force. These convictions run deep and are not easily changed. This is way different than critical race theory, which basically just needs to become unfashionable. Few are willing to die for critical race theory, though sadly some are willing to kill for it.
en masse? Good luck. I am not a fan of gulags or punishment for having bad ideas. As long as they stay on their side of the tracks and leave me alone, I am cool.
I have never been an extremist, so I don’t know. But they do seem to have an answer for everything. And the answer to any question is… Racism! Of course.
The first and last word in metal: Pantera
Im on the SWAT team so we wouldn’t have to address those issues but overwhelmingly we are against supporting or enforcing that bullshit.
As regards rioters, looters, etc… Our coward leadership keeps us on a tight leash. We have a ton of pending lawsuits from prior protests. I was in the middle of the June 2 riots when Dave Dorn was killed by looters.
Im in this picture
How so? You’re allowed to excise adequate force
Pepper spray, rubber bullets, flashbangs etc seem adequate for large crowds. What more could you possibly need to defend yourself from unarmed protesters?
If someone were to open fire on you I’d assume you’d be allowed to fire back.
Not even close. We don’t use rubber bullets. Unarmed ? Bro… 4 guys 50 feet behind our team were shot. All lived but one nearly bled out. Dave Dorn was shot and killed. They throw bricks, chunks of asphalt, incendiary devices, explosives, chemicals, etc… Mobs of people aren’t exactly open to return fire. We only used chemical munitions. 15 straight hours of sustained fighting.
Ill try to link a video from downtown that looked and sounded like Ramadi.
A bike unit was literally pinned down by gunfire. We had to extract them with our BEAR. This riot was violent as fuck and resulted in 5 officers shot with one dying.
Interesting to hear multiple perspectives on this issue
Footage has surfaced of unarmed, purportedly legitimately peaceful protestors getting shot in the face with rubber bullets. There’s also footage of unarmed people being apprehended off the streets by federal officers within unmarked vehicles, footage of cops using the “ok sign” towards right wing militias present at protests (proud boys/white supremacist symbolism), footage of officers talking about how they’re looking forward to beating up protestors etc. Telling a female protestor “shut up bitch” surely isn’t going to de escalate a situation.
On the other hand, footage also exists of mobs running up at law enforcement, incendiary devices (as you’ve specified) being thrown at law enforcement. Protestors chanting for violent outcomes towards officers of the law etc.
I’ve heard multiple narratives, both contraindicating one another. I’ve heard “fuck the police” from those who were caught up in the riots and I’ve heard “fuck the protestors”. I’m not picking sides, I wasn’t personally there and I haven’t seen an adequate body of literature of which has come to a conclusion regarding who is/was at fault for the escalation to violence.
The most probable narrative to me seems as if multiple political factions clashed. Extremist left wing groups/extremist right wing groups fronted up against one another. Resulting tension/irritation boiled over and violence/rioting ensued. Who was culpable regarding the first brick thrown, who took the first punch, who chuckd the first Molotov cocktail through a window… I don’t know.
I’m sorry to hear about the casualties/injuries incurred within your base. My hesitancy towards believing a certain narrative stems within
- political bias present within the media. Numerous sources reporting different outcomes
- sampling bias: a member of SWAT is obviously more likely to encounter the brunt/most brutal, uncivilised and violent aspects of an event. A protestor/individual caught up in the middle of a lawless riot is obviously more likely to have an unpleasant encounter with members of law enforcement given the situation at stake. The officer has to fend for her/his own safety as well as attempt to keep riots proportionally ‘in control’
I’ve also had friends who have encountered law enforcement in a context wherein power has been abused and/or situational penalisation has been overkill. Spending a night in jail over a gram of cannabis seems ridiculous to me… let alone having to go to court afterwards. I have nothing against police, rather I have an issue with the laws officers at times have an obligation to enforce. I think people don’t understand this ought to be taken up with parliament… not the police.
Given my anecdotal experiences with law enforcement I tend to be weary when a narrative is pushed by law enforcement. Same goes for the protestors. One person complaining to me about police conduct is in my opinion an individual of questionable morale. If law enforcement was interacting with this individual I wouldn’t be surprised if he/she was culpable in some way, shape or form as opposed to the narrative/story I was given.
Dude, I’ll tell you something that the others here who have served in any military or similar unit can verify. If the SWAT Team, or any military squad were to REALLY go full out on engagement tactics designed for actual combat, there will be a fucking bloodbath with the majority of people dying from being trampled to death while running away pissing themselves.
These protestors don’t know HOW MUCH THEY’RE HOLDING BACK.
They aren’t just hitting people with kid gloves. They’re hitting kids with kid gloves with 1 arm. You take out the few crazy fuckers willing to engage along with some collateral damage and everyone else will run like the wind.
You gotta keep this in mind when you think about all this.
Disclaimer: I know balls about normal cops and their training.
I can’t even tell you if I would have the self restraint not to royally fuck any of the guys apprehended up if I were in your situation. The odds are that I wouldn’t. The very fact that you guys don’t lose it in situations like this is commendable in itself.
Only used chemical munitions lol. Shit I just can’t image it.
This is why psychiatric evaluation and/or situational training occurs before putting an officer, let alone a SWAT member out in the field.
I don’t know how rigorous the vetting process is, but I’d damn well hope it’s thorough as fuck for riot squads, SWAT etc. In Victoria an omnibus bill was recently passed allowing for civil servants to be used/implemented as full fledged officers of the law in times of crisis. Extended detention powers within the bill were dropped following immense public backlash, but immense, far reaching powers for law enforcement were kept.
I’m not comfortable with this, particuarly relating to the protests that have been/were occurring in relation to restrictions enforced. The average civil servant/healthcare worker hasn’t been trained regarding situational de-escalation/riot control. Now he/she’s got a horse, pepper spray, potentially rubber bullets, a baton, a firearm and hasn’t received adequate training for the role. All against unarmed protestors (this is Australia).
One can be professional in accordance with his training if the objective is crowd control. That’s not what I’m saying. AFTER THAT is when the real rage starts lol.
Perhaps, but a thorough psychiatric vetting process should and probably does disqualify candidates who display certain characteristics/personality traits that indicate a potential penchant towards anger, violence or sadism.
It isn’t foolproof, but as a generalisation i’d expect/hope for officers within a riot squad to be relatively grounded individuals who have a reputation for staying calm in tense situations.
You’re not getting what I’m saying. A TRAINED PERSON can follow procedure in these situations. You will not see any one going nuts DURING such situations unless you put in a completely inexperienced team, which would be highly improbable.
It’s AFTER all the shit has settled that the rage kicks in.
I understand what you’re getting at. I’m stating this
Is possible as training differs in context compared to real-life application. But a thorough vetting process mitigates the chances of shit hitting the fan/an officer going apeshit with excessive force.
I’d like to think it’s less likely for the demographic prepped for deployment as a riot squad wouldn’t have the same penchant for rage in comparison to the average joe.
Following procedure during training and a thorough psychiatric evaluation are two entirely different entities.
I don’t know much about the riot squad in the US and what sort of psychiatric evaluations they go through. All I’m saying is I probably wouldn’t have such self-control after the dust has settled and there are a couple of apprehended fucks who just tried to physically harm one of my men in front of me.
And these rioters have to appreciate the fact that they are fucking with people who can REALLY fuck you up when given the orders to. It’s like taking kindness for weakness. No, not really, it’s just politics, but you get my point.
I don’t think this crosses the mind of someone rioting/looting.
A similar rhetoric can be put in place towards those arguing about gun ownship for protection in the event of a tyrannical government developing.
Fat chance they can hold their own against the military… or the government for that matter. Cut power, access to food/supplies, Internet etc, then bring in the millitary. See how long a resistance lasts
Or it does and they’re taking advantage of the fact that politicians don’t have balls to lay down the law and find courage in the number of useful idiots rallying along with them.
Come on, man. They can’t be claiming they’ve suffered REAL police brutality before and not know how badly they can fuck them up if they want to lol. This is something only someone who has never been fucked up by a bad cop(s) would think. (EDITED for clarity)
I’ve never suffered police brutality, when did I say I had.
I’ve never provoked an officer of the law and never would. Rather I’ve been subject to treatment of what I believe was a breach in conduct/what would be deemed acceptable by law.
NOT YOU. I was talking about the rioters.