Hello Guys . i need your guys oppinion about this Anavar or Dianabol Topics
Im 30 years old - been lifting since i was 24 (but started to have serious one at age 26)
Im (Asian) 165cm / 60kg (not a big build, since i have small body frame)
The 6 years training give me quite result , used to be 53kg (very scrawny)
and since last year ive been seeing very very slow progress (which i think i hit the plateu)
Thats why i wanted to use the AAS
i started my first cycle
it was Test Enanthate only ( starting dose from 250mg/week - and raise until 500mg/week for 10 weeks + 4 weeks of PCT ) , which gave me quite good result and been “resting my body” from AAS for 12 weeks
now im thinking about to do the 2nd cycle,
my goal is to add for about 5-7lbs of lean mass, whether i have to choose Dianabol or Anavar
Based on what ive been studying both have ying-yang :
DIANABOL -
PROS:
Rapid muscle mass growth in short amount of time
Short half-life 4 hrs which is faster removed by body just in case Dbol reacts in negative way
CONS :
Hepatotoxic (17alphaalkytaled compound) - im gonna need NAC/Milk Thistle/antioxidant
It Aromatizes - im gonna need AI
Cause Water Retention - does this mean the gain is mostly water and will gone after cycle (?)
-ANAVAR-
PROS :
Little Aromatization : so less chance of getting gyno
It metabolism is in Kidney(primarily) and Liver : so as i know its not as hard as Dbol for the liver
CONS :
It has reputation in increasig strength (not size) - is it true(?) since my goal is to increase size
-still increasing the liver enzyme (but less than dbol)
It is easily faked
nb : i know ppl reacts differently to AAS and to know which one is work , everything is about trial and error in ur own body
What would you guys choose for the 2nd Cycle ?
My preference is ANAVAR with Test Cycle
but my concern is im afraid it will give me no muslce mass
or should i just do the dbol cycle for 4-6 weeks ? but im afraid my liver would get damaged so bad
what do u guys think ?
It would seem, based strictly on your goals of wanting to add mass that Dbol would be your go to. However, I imagine it would be hard to keep much if any of the mass if you are not eating an adequate amount.
I believe nutrition is too often under valued (I learned this the hard way as I had “plateaued” for years due to not eating enough quality protein) and just eating a good, semi-clean diet in a caloric surplus (+500 calories over maintenance is sufficient) is much more likely to put on mass that you can keep long term. Don’t get me wrong, I am not opposed to you using AAS, but even on gear, you’ll be spinning your wheels if you aren’t eating enough. The scale is only one tool to measure progress, and adding 10-15 lbs of water/glycogen is not the same as adding 5 lbs of muscle.
So based on what you said, I think dbol is your answer, but you still won’t gain mass eating too little.
Dude… stay away from the needle until you learn proper training and nutrition. Six years of training sounds alright but clearly something is off. I too have a small frame and I’m not much taller than you but even when I had low T I was able to work up to 175lbs. Thats with a T rating half the lowest range. You need to learn to EAT first. This is not a jab. AAS will only take you so far and you’re going to lose what you gain from them without the proper training and nutrition.
All that aside, adding an oral to your next test cycle makes sense. Keep in mind that dbol adds rapid weight but also you will lose that weight quickly upon cessation. You don’t necessarily need an AI in dbol if your dose is reasonable. Did you have any issues on 500mg of test solo? If not, adding say 30mg / daily of Dbol isn’t something I would immediately jump on an AI for.
They are different. Tbol has advantages in that it doesn’t convert to E2, and is lower for androgenic sides, but it isn’t as anabolic. It is also more expensive than Dbol, and therefore faked more. I see it being about 3X the cost per mg compared to Dbol.
For a powerlifting meet Dbol is superior. For not looking like the Michelin Man Tbol is superior.
6 years of training and you added 7 kg? That is the same as my first 4 years of training. Which both is way too low and screams of a very very lackluster diet. With my first real good Organized bulk I gained 6 kg in a winter and with my second 5 kg the next winter, both after dieting down again (so nearly all lean mass).
Learn to eat. You got no business using AAS. But if you do, eat!
Aside from what’s already been said, you also need more time off between cycles. The bare minimum is time off = time on + pct, which in your case is 14 weeks. But give yourself some added time to train and eat without being on for a while.
As to your question, the answer lies in what you really want. If you want to be temporarily big then dbol is excellent. If you want to add real muscle mass then four weeks of dbol-only will absolutely not do it.
Anavar will add muscle, period. Anyone who says otherwise is lying to you. It’s great for adding small but meaningful amounts of muscle if you’re training and eating properly. Dbol will do the same, but give you the temporary appearance of gaining a lot more.
You need to get your programming in order first. After that I’d say test 500/w for 12 weeks and six weeks of anavar at 59mg/d would give you great results. But you’ll get nothing out of it if you’re not eating for size.
Lol no, you’re so wrong. You have to take exactly 59mg/d or else it doesn’t work. It helps if you time it up with the lunar cycles, but that’s not strictly a requirement.
Thanks for the answer
I had no problem at all using T. Enanthate
I did it without using any Serm / AI
(But i hv both serm/AI with me just in case i needes it )
And my plan for Dbol is gonna be
15mg ED for the first 3 days , if i got no issues
Gonna raise it max to 30mg ED - for 6 weeks
: do i need to take AI whenever any symptomp of Gyno or should i just take it just for prevention ? ( since Dbol will aromatize)
Allright ill keep in mind to be caloric surplus if im gonna try the gears
And do u have any experience in using dbol ? Im really really curious about whats gonna happend to my liver
(I know it WILL raise the liver enzyme but how bad will the damage done to the liver)
Yes
I started working out when i was 22 actually
Im 30 now
2 years training i learn how to do proper technique
And 6 years of proper training
Ive tried once being on super caloric surplus
And i look so damn fat ( around 4000Cal A day)
Maybe it was bcs i add rice for more calorie ? I dunno
(Since in my country rice is so cheap and easy to find )
Yes i would never run any oral solo
I read alot of anedoctal experience that they oral wthout Test base with execellent result
But im not tempted to do Oral solo
Have u even tried Anavar ? Would love to hear how’s the result and does it still make us gain some noticeable muscle mass ?
Eh 59 like fifty-nine ? I thought it was typo
I never heard about exact dose to be 59 (even in Medical Journal)
I Would be grateful very much if u could give me the referneces of it
It was indeed a typo, but I decided to lean into it.
As far as my experience with anavar, I have to say that it’s my favorite drug available. I get zero side effects, it helps me get stronger, and I don’t get bloated or visibly fatter while using it (unless I eat like shit, obviously). I’m using it right now. Since the gyms have been open for about two months I wanted to get back into things slowly the first few weeks and then add the anavar to my regular trt. I’ve gotten my strength above where it was when the lockdown started, and at that point I was the strongest I’d ever been. Even though I’m still carrying some unfortunate COVID weight I look leaner just from five weeks of anavar. Now I’m not in the building phase right now, so I cannot say that I’ve added appreciable mass, but I look better (extra belly fat notwithstanding) than I did when lockdown began.
And when i take anavar +Test E
Should i do the anavar on the first day ?
Or on the 14th day aftee first Test shot ?
(Since Test.E will work 2 weeks post injection)
You can start at the beginning if you’d like. But I would say (self-servingly) look up a post I put on here a while back arguing that orals are best used at the end rather than the beginning of a cycle. Read it and see if it makes sense to you and for your goals.
Hello T Nation Resident
I would like to have ur guys oppionion
Do u guys think running Deca Durabolin (Nandrolone) as the 2nd cycle is a good choice ?
: as i want to avoid the oral AAS ( due to hepatotoxic effect )
i hv been training for 6 years. Im 30 years old
And im (Asian) 163cm/60kg
6 years training give me quite gain of lean muscle mass, but lately (1 year) ive seen very slow progress : which i think i hit the plateu and thats why i wanna try to use abit of gear to help me increasing my size
My Goal is : to add abit of noticable mass (not like hulk)
Nb :
I have run my first cycle with Test. enanthate only
Dose start from 125mg / week raise till 500mg/week
(I didnt use any AI or Serm, but i hv them in my pocket just in case any side effect occurs)
And im quite satisfied with the result
My concern is :
Deca durabolin has very very long time detection (18 months) . Im afraid just in case bad side effect occurs i will hardly take if off from my body. Is it still gonna affect my body even after the half life time passed ? (4.5 hrs)
Deca will cause increasing in prolactin (which is have the same effect of exceeding Estrogen ; Gyno). Do u guys know how to handle this ?
(Since AI wont affect anything to Prolactin issue, and i read a drug named Carbegolin could decrease the amount of Prolactin ; but it is soo damn expensive)
and i heard about deca dick ! Which can be countered by using Test shot while on cycle. Is it true ?
I could not agree more with this. I very rarely go beyond TRT plus Anavar, these days. In the past I have tried pretty much everything in all sorts of combos and dosages except Tren. TRT Test plus Anavar is, IME, gives the best results with the least sides overall. It WILL add lean muscle, no question.
I did not work our for 4 months of covid and went back at the same weight I left with, albeit a little fluffier, so the gains did not disappear. I attribute this, mainly, to lean mass gain due to Anavar.
As for Dbol, I’ve tried it a few times at 30mg and just felt bloated and sore most of the time. I didn’t “feel it” like I do with Anavar. It also gave me lower back pain.
As for how I looked on Dbol vs Anavar, there’s no confusion. Bloated and watery vs hard and lean.
Hello. I am turning over a new leaf and avoiding long winded answers. Do not use nandrolone decanoate. Continue to focus on your diet and training and prioritize the important and value added aspects of life. As a very large gentleman who didn’t fit in the automobile I was driving once said, when you get older you should try to downsize and carry functional weight (lean gainz homie). The potential long term consequences with nandrolone far outweigh any short term improvements in lean body mass.
Seldom does the introduction of AAS lead to a long term positive outcome when the objective function is sustainable health, well being, happiness, functional member of society, etc. Very few people (as a percentage of the using population ) can do it correctly and response to the drugs both positive and negative are not entirely under your control. Genetics and response to drugs especially are underappreciated.
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