An Example of Non-T Behavior

So first she spits in a person who works there face, then she starts poking the guy on the cell phone in the face, and stands so close shes touching him (which in MA can be considered assualt) and he gets the shit beat out of him and this whole time from beginning (yelling) to end no one did nothing? No one kicked the loud mouth piece of fat trash out when she started running her mouth? Or maybe the dude on the phone needed to be kicked out for instigating it… What a bunch of wussies! Either way, I don’t think anyboby ever needs to be assualted over words.

Im a girl, Im half if not less the size of each of those fatties & even I would’ve stepped in/said/or did something regardless of who started what. I have in the past stepped into situations like that before where I have gotten really hurt, but at the end of the day horrible physical pain is minute compared to the pain my conscience would have if I done absolutely nothing.

I can’t even believe people stood around for so long like it was some sort of show then when it was over went back to their greasy pizza needs and just ignored the body on the floor. Sickening…

In the end of the day, he should have realised this big guy was gonna bang him in the chops and downed him. In that situation with a fella MUCH bigger than him, that is the best option, to pre emptive strike right on the chin.

worst ways, be watching for the “haymaker” blow.

As far as everyone else, this is exceptionally common as people don’t want to get hurt, and unless there were 2 guys that were friends and would know that they would have each others backs, this is to be expected.

In sayin “i woulda this and that…”
tends to show that you have not been in many “live” situations. The adrenelin is going and all you want to do is not be there. Morally, they were pussies, but they are none the less alive, well, go back to their children in 1 piece pussies.

The problem is the location. If this happened in the ghetto in somewhere like detroit, then I definitely would not have intervened. But if this happened anywhere in Canada, with that many people standing there, I would have jumped in for sure. In the US people are shot daily, so you have to be a lot more careful in these situations.

[quote]mindeffer01 wrote:
You can dismiss it all you want. Put your head down and keep your mouth shut and be a door mat. Just don’t be surprised if one day for no good reason, your orbital socket gets busted.[/quote]

There’s a difference between being a door mat and choosing your battles. Waiting for a pizza is not worth getting killed over, as far as I’m concerned.

The link that was posted originally is not working, at least not on my computer. But I searched Google and found this clip.

http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/10947882.htm?1c

From what you guys are saying, about not knowing what happened before or after, this clip shows the girl bitchng at him and finally he SLAMS down his phone and the buts chests with her. Then the gorilla pushes her aside and just knocks the guy out.

totally fucked up.

[quote]Vegita wrote:
I think one of the overlying factors that we seem to be forgetting is the direction our society is taking. 2-300 years ago when this country was at it’s infancy, bitch makes a scene like that and bullets start flying. Anyone remember the wild west? You cut in line in front of me? you got 10 seconds to flee town or you’ll have a bullet hole up your ass.
[/quote]

That’s exactly why we don’t have concealed carry laws, or at least in most places. Here in Missouri, except in the city of St Louis, you can carry a firearm.

I am against that for this reason. I don’t want the wild wild west for the exact scenario you just described.

[quote]pookie wrote:
mindeffer01 wrote:
You can dismiss it all you want. Put your head down and keep your mouth shut and be a door mat. Just don’t be surprised if one day for no good reason, your orbital socket gets busted.

There’s a difference between being a door mat and choosing your battles. Waiting for a pizza is not worth getting killed over, as far as I’m concerned.
[/quote]

I don’t know what world you live in, but I grew up pretty much expecting anything anywhere. It boggles my mind that there are people like you who think they are “safe” simply because they went to Pizza Hut. This world has never been that safe. It is like those at Columbine High School screaming, “I never thought anything like that would happen here!!” Well, gee, maybe if you HAD suspected that something like that could happen anywhere, you may have been able to prevent it.

I grew up in a pretty rough neighborhood, even though it was no where near as bad as I have heard from some who grew up in Brooklyn or on the west coast. I have been shot at but not shot and all of this was before high school. I expect for things to pop off EVERYWHERE. In this situation, I would have helped. I know I would have because I have been in very similar situations and I am not the type to stand there and freeze. I am often the person who is the first to respond or the first to go against “group mentality”.

I think it is sad that anyone would stand there and watch this and not make a move. No one even screamed. No one even yelled for the police. No one even looked for a large object to hit the guy with. It’s a Pizza Parlor…there was a fire extinguisher somewhere.

If you are the type who thinks the world is “safe” or that you can wander around with your head in the sand thinking that because you don’t want to fight that you will never have to, I think you are blind to the world around you. I am beyond greatfull that I grew up in rougher conditions. I would hate to be the type who walks around thinking they aren’t a part of the world, but somewhere above it avoiding all conflict. I can only say, “wake the fuck up”.

This society seems to hate testosterone until a war pops off. Then the momma’s boys run for cover and hope all of the meanies go to war to save their asses. It has gotten sad and quite pathetic. For any man to see a situation like that pop and not do ANYTHING is the largest reflection of pussy-itis I have seen caught on tape…aside from Jenna Jamison.

I think several things should have happened here…

1)As soon as the 300lb idiot leaves the first time, the manager should have slammed the door and locked it- easy enough.

  1. The guy on the phone should have started apologising as soon as he saw the massive black dude coming in. Its pretty fricking clear that the girl has an attitude problem and is used to acting like a complete idiot. You see her boyfriend and you know why.

  2. The guy with the cellphone should have never taken his eyes off of the maniac. Fuck looking at/arguing with the girl. At that point she would have been nothing but background noise.

Its the same as when someone pulls a knife on you. Thats what you pay attention to…thats what is causing the life or death bit of this argument. In this case, the guy is the knife.

Also, he wasnt “sticking up” for his g/friend. He was beating the fuck out of somebody just because he could.

I have witnessed a thing like that when I was a lot younger, I can understand people not helping DURING the fight. But after? Thats another matter- it doesnt take any courage to do that, just simple human empathy.

I am not defending the people who did nothing but I am not sure that I would have been quick enough either.

Its a big commitment to take on a dude like that unless you r a pretty good fighter. If i was getting a pizza, at 2.30am, probably a little drunk, with my girlfriend to watch out for and I saw some bitch mouthing off and then some dude get his ass kicked I dont know what I would do.

Of course this is all subjective watching a video…i am just not sure how many people would have had the experience to know what they were seeing. As i say, this refers to during the fight. And I am not trying to say that it is difficult to see the guy getting beaten…just that when you see something like that it can be shocking, as far as being paralysing.

I’ve seen people look shocked when some guy punched another, once, and didnt even draw blood- some girls who were there nearly cried!

I would hope with the benefit of experience nowadays I would help more, but even now I know I will let someone push pretty far before I’ll react. I know it would be better to drop someone the minute a threat was posed but to tell you the truth, I’d be knocking people out all day there is that much attitude flying about.

I once avoided a fight with a gang of 15 by apologising! Lucky that time definitely but I’d always try again. I’d have said anything, and sounded 100% truthful, if I thought it would have made that enormous piece of shit walk back out.

Its the same in martial arts. You can kick your own arse in training, or have it kicked in a fight. The guy could have lost his “dignity” as it were by apologising profusely and backing away- even looking shit scared if he though the bully would like it…or he could lose his dignity the way he did, by getting seriously fucked up.

If nothing else, at least put down the phone and pretend to be apologetic whilst you feel behind you for a nice solid steel chair.

Article from today’s paper (copied from ohio.com:

Woman says she’s served her jail time

Accused pizza shop agitator says trial shouldn’t follow plea bargain

By Phil Trexler
Beacon Journal staff writer

The Akron woman who prosecutors say triggered an ugly videotaped beating at a downtown pizza shop says she is sorry but doesn’t deserve any more jail time.

Prestina Sims, 31, met with reporters Friday, a week after a judge released the videotape that helped to convict her boyfriend of felonious assault and propel local debate on social conduct.

In the tape, Sims is seen entering DaVinci’s Pizza on South Main Street last July. She soon confronts a customer who complained she was cutting to the front of the line. Sims spat on a store manager who tried to throw her out and then pointed to the customer and ordered her boyfriend, Mark Jones of Akron, to ``take care of this white mother (expletive).‘’

Jones, who is 6-foot-4 and weighs 320 pounds, pummeled the customer, Joseph Scarpino, 28, drilling him with seven unanswered blows to the head as a lobby full of customers looked on in shock.

Scarpino, 6-foot-2 and 220 pounds, suffered a broken nose, a chipped tooth and a concussion. Jones, 35, was sentenced to four years in prison after his conviction last week in Summit County Common Pleas Court.

Sims, a mother of five, told reporters she is sorry about the incident and wishes the case would go away. She denied making the racist remark about Scarpino, although her words are clearly captured on the videotape.

She also said she felt the matter was put behind her last August when she agreed to a plea bargain with Akron city prosecutors. Sims agreed to serve six months in jail after pleading guilty to misdemeanor assault, disorderly conduct and criminal trespassing.

In October, however, county prosecutors brought a felonious assault indictment against her. She is scheduled for trial March 14 and faces two to eight years in prison, if convicted.

Prosecutors are expected to argue that in essence, Sims used Jones as a deadly weapon in order to cause serious physical harm to Scarpino.

I would like to apologize... to Joseph. I didn't expect that to happen,'' she said. Every day I think about this incident. It hurts me and I know it affected (Scarpino).‘’

Scarpino could not be reached for comment.

Sims’ attorney, Walter Madison of Akron, would not allow her to comment on what is seen in the videotaped beating.

Madison filed a motion Thursday asking Judge Brenda Burnham Unruh to dismiss Sims’ case, citing the previous plea and claiming the new charges violate double jeopardy protections.

A similar motion filed by Sims’ former attorney was denied Feb. 2, when Unruh agreed with prosecutors and ruled the plea deal with city attorneys does not prevent county prosecutors from bringing felony charges.

Madison said if the county officials were acting in good faith, they would have commuted Sims’ sentence when the indictment was first brought, months before she finished serving six months in jail.

What we have here is a person who had accepted responsibility now finding herself facing punishment a second time,'' Madison said. What I’m doing now, I’m asking the court to dismiss it because of constitutional issues that the state has acted in bad faith. We believe a case brought with an evil eye should not see its day in court. Ultimately, a deal is a deal.‘’

The tape has been played repeatedly on local and national TV, but Sims said she has not watched it. She said she can’t change public opinion that blames her for the attack.

I'm living this day by day. I do wish it would go away. I wish I could have my life back,'' she said. It’s a scary feeling that my freedom is still in jeopardy.‘’

Ironicly, if the person being beaten had been a minority, homosexual, or Jewish, this would have been labeled a hate crime and not only would it have been made a bigger deal of, it would have also resulted in stiffer sentences then a few years apiece.

[quote]Bodhisattva wrote:
The tape has been played repeatedly on local and national TV, but Sims said she has not watched it. She said she can’t change public opinion that blames her for the attack.

I'm living this day by day. I do wish it would go away. I wish I could have my life back,'' she said. It’s a scary feeling that my freedom is still in jeopardy.‘’[/quote]

Bullshit.

I hate how the word freedom is used.
Freedom to bring in one fat dude and start something? She was obviously looking to cause at least some trouble. Some people just live for that. I hope she gets put away 6 years.

If you hire someone to beat the shit out of others, you can go to jail for life. How is this different? She used her boyfriend to beat up the white man. The white man did not do anything. Hell, this is the racism that makes me feel so annoyed.

Just to chime in, I live in a pretty rough area. In the past month we had a girl abducted from the Wal Mart parking lot, a man kidnap and strangle another woman, and just this week a man stood outside of our courthouse shooting people including his own son over child support. In the last incident a 50 yr old man stood between the gunman and had his life taken to save a young man. Why is it that younger males, who seem to be more “bad ass” in their own minds, not even attempt to step in when a n older male knowingly stood between a gun and another human to save his life? Seems like some stupid shit to me.

[quote]chtdrmn wrote:
In the past month we had a girl abducted from the Wal Mart parking lot, a man kidnap and strangle another woman, and just this week a man stood outside of our courthouse shooting people including his own son over child support. In the last incident a 50 yr old man stood between the gunman and had his life taken to save a young man.[/quote]

More reasons to carry a gun.

[quote]violentvegan wrote:
Ahh, the pussification of America continues. I’m really getting tired of the “mommy taught me not to hit back” crowd.

This is why someone is going to come and take our country away from us. [/quote]

Not true, because there will always be people like that big black dude that other countries will fear.

This happens everywhere, whether it be America or Canada. I have yet to witness things like that. But i’m not ignorant I know they happen.

They happen more often in American because well it’s got a larger population. You’re going to find more bad apples.

Canada’s population is 35 mil, approxamitely the population of California. Most of us live in ignorance. We don’t experience these things so we think it doesn’t happen. Yet murders are occuring constantly, people are getting beat all the time, and abuse is very common.

But i’m at home at my computer, i’m at work at my computer. I’m sheltered from the world. I can’t be everywhere to witness everything. The news tries to inform me of these things. I rather not know and pretend the world is great. But I guess to stop it we have to identify it.

Disturbing.

Those idiots are indifferent. I hope she gets the extra time. That prick should have got more then 4 yrs.

Couple of take aways. You see a guy that big starting some shit. Act first. No way around that.

Second always carry if your local laws prevent it. I have stopped more then a few confrontations by displaying a weapon, in it’s holster, with my hand on it. Weapons can stop a fight if you are smart. Second a weapon is designed to stop a thug like that if you are not big enough to take him on physically.

[quote]Moon Knight wrote:
Ironicly, if the person being beaten had been a minority, homosexual, or Jewish, this would have been labeled a hate crime and not only would it have been made a bigger deal of, it would have also resulted in stiffer sentences then a few years apiece.[/quote]

Reading the newspaper account just above your post that same thought occurred to me.

[quote]jaimeo wrote:

Its the same as when someone pulls a knife on you. Thats what you pay attention to…thats what is causing the life or death bit of this argument. In this case, the guy is the knife.
[/quote]

Tim Larkin, who wrote “Knife Fight!” which is in the T-Nation archives, disagrees: “Since you understand that your danger comes not from the knife itself, but from the brain of the attacker holding the knife, then you have an advantage.”
http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=461563

[quote]hedo wrote:
Second a weapon is designed to stop a thug like that if you are not big enough to take him on physically.[/quote]

this would be the basis for the old saying “god made man; Sam Colt made them equal.”

I backed 2 guys down once just by reaching around my right hip like I had a gun. One guy grabbed the other and they left, I heard one guy saying “what” and the other says “dude, he’s got a fuckin gun”.

[quote]Moon Knight wrote:
Ironicly, if the person being beaten had been a minority, homosexual, or Jewish, this would have been labeled a hate crime and not only would it have been made a bigger deal of, it would have also resulted in stiffer sentences then a few years apiece.[/quote]

I think that is a fine line to cross. First, she went off on everyone before she focused in on one person. I think a hate crime would be defined as her intentionally going after him first because of his skin color. There is no doubt that she was off in the head. There is no doubt that she needs to be punished, embarrassed and possibly spit at on a regular basis…however, her being a crazy bitch doesn’t equal a race crime. Anytime I have seen this come up, it was clear that race was an issue. Rodney King’s case was a direct result of intentional abuse past the point of subduing the perpetrator and a race influenced hate crime. In that video, the 300lbs guy hesitated before he hit the guy. My personal opinion is had the guy seemed like he would have been a threat, he would have thought twice about hitting him. He took advantage of what he saw as weakness. It was mentioned by another poster that had he been black that this wouldn’t have happened. I disagree with this because I have seen similar things happen with both people being the same race. If you are dealing with a thug, they will take advantage of weakness. Period.

For the record, I know bouncers that work at some night clubs around my area who go on and on about how many confrontations they get…and most of the guys starting trouble in this area are white. Mind you, most of the bouncers are HUGE with one about to compete in this year’s NPC nationals. Some people are looking for a fight everywhere. You can either be ready for it, or act surprised when it happens. Either way, the chances of you waltzing through life without ever having to defend yourself are pretty damn slim. I personally would rather be ready for anything.

On another note. I agree that I rather have my dignity taken away peacefully than through violence. I used to go clubbing a lot and stopped because I had nothing but guys trying to pick fights with me. I’m a magnet for fights. Some guy tried to start a huge fight with me saying I “wanted to steal his girlfriend” because she kept staring at me.

I have avoided pretty much every violent situation that has approached me. I always make the person think they are right and that i’m wrong. ANd I apologize. Even if it is not the case.

I see some messed up shit. All the crimes committed in the Toronto area are coming from kids. Kids who don’t know any better. I’d say a good 80% of our murders in 2004 were by 16-21 year old kids. There’s a mall around this area where in 2 cases 2 different groups of 16 year old kids, stabbed or shot someone.

There was a few 16-19 year old kids doing home invasions, killing people off and brutally torturing them.

Either way, I don’t think I would have jumped in. I might have tried to calm the person down. I have been in situations where I managed to calm some big angry dude down. You just have to say the right things to him. But I would not in any way get too close to him.

Most of you are trying to give reason as to why these people didn’t do anything. It has nothing to do with them thinking about all the scenarios that could possibly happen. It’s called natural instinct. Your sub-conscience takes over and you don’t think what so ever. You just want the situation to be over. And it does end fast for you. As soon as your insticts are off and you’re back to your normal self, it feels like a split second. If your sub-conscience didn’t take over, you’d probably do something even dumber and end up hurting yourself. Your body’s natural instinct to survive won’t allow that.

I bet most of those people regained their regular conscience and started thinking up of things that they could have done.

Everyone on the board is thinking about what they would do. But our sub-conscience would control otherwise.

Now in a situation where a guy is beating on a girl and you see it from afar. You are in full control. Your not thinking about your own safety at that moment. Your cosncience is fully aware. Especially if the guy doesn’t look threatening (Wow i’m bigger than him, I can take him). So you think “i’m going to help that girl”. It’s not until something unexpected happens that gives off threat that your sub-conscience kicks in.