America Bashing

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
101

[quote]ephrem wrote:
hedo wrote: Sounds like you weren’t really looking for an answer. It appears you already made your mind up and were simply looking for a sounding board.

I’m going to guess you are a young person with idle time on your hands. I could be wrong. You make the mistake of assuming those who are accomplished in life have some sort of skewed value system. Therefore I’ll assume you are just starting out. Big mistake. Sometimes those who have accumulated a lot and built things just try harder. Not just in business but in life. That’s why most Americans reject socialism and prefer to rise and fall on their own merits. It’s a fundamental difference.

And by the way. The US has been “told” things by other countries who assume they know better since it was founded, on an ideal, rather then a geopgraphic coincidence. Simply because someone tells you something doesn’t mean you should follow it. (remember pyramid training)Europe has a long history of diplomatic duplicity and self interest. The EU has only served to solidify this and added a collective bent to it.

The crux of the problem is that the US doesn’t derive it’s credibility from the EU. That’s difficult for a somewhat educated and politically active population to come to grips with so they lash out where they can. Hikers in the mountains, political forums on US bodybuilding sites etc. In the end it means nothing to me, most of the vets who post here or ultimately the leadership of the country.

…you hit the nail on the head, but for the wrong reasons, Hedo. I own a house, have a steady job, average income and used the affluence available to me to, during my 20’s, resolve childhood issues, find peace of mind, and subsequently uncovered an indepedant inner freedom. Independant from nationality, individuality, material possessions, peer pressure and society in general. At 36 all that is life is worth living, fearless…

…the chest beating that americans tend to do is foreign to me, and to many i know. Western Europeans’ nationality in general only defines a common background, but does not determin ones self-image [in general] the way being american appears to be vital to an american’s self-image…

…what constitutes ‘making it’ anyway? What does it mean to you personally, Hedo?

…the sad fact of the matter is that the USA has no credibility left anymore. It just hasn’t sunk in with most americans yet. The principles america valued have been dismantled by circumstance and deliberate intent, but somehow that does not seem to matter to most. Could you consider that some of the america bashers hate to see that, and because of that criticise the US?

…all nations fall. Every society in history ended, and ours will end at one point too. What is there really to get all excited about?[/quote]

Like I said I don’t think you were looking for an answer so much as a forum and your answer was really a rieteration of what you already said. Suffice to say I don’t agree with most of the premises you are building your argument on. In as much as it is a narrow socialist type of view it really doesn’t matter to me, as an American.

I seriously have to ask, since you seem to be obsessed with the concept of credibility, why do you think it is for the world to bestow upon the US. Particularly why do you feel that posters on an a US Bodybuilding forum have sufficient clout for their vote of credibility to mean anything. As the leader we would be in a postion to bestow credibility not seek it. Perhaps that explains the outrage of the chattering classes around the world.

To answer your question. What constitutes “making it”? To me it’s self worth and determination. Happiness in all facets of my life and the ability to change what I dont’ like and do what interests me. Right now it’s coaching a youth football team. Next year who knows?

102

[quote]lixy wrote:
…

From personal experience, most people would pick Canada over the US.
[/quote]

Good, we don’t want your terrorist friends here. Besides it’s probably easier to wage jihad from Canada any how.

What the fuck do you think promotes quality of life? You either make it on your own, steal it, or stand there with your hand out.

Now I have a question, why do you even come here? All you do is promote devision and hate. You contribute absolutely nothing but hate. I guess it goes right along with what you believe in your radicalized version of Islam. Here are your 5 pillars as been my experience in reading your slop:

  1. Hate America
  2. Hate Israel and Jews.
  3. Come on American websites and insult Americans.
  4. Support violence against the west.
  5. Support all oppressive regimes through out the world so long as they hate America too.

I think most of us would be happy if you just went away. You have every right to be here as long as T-Nation allows you to be. But you make intelligent conversations almost impossible when you interject your blind rage for us.

103

[quote]orion wrote:
hedo wrote:

Your jealousy shows once again since you have no hat or cattle not to mention a clue.

Thank you for being the first to tell me what exactly makes me jealous.

The fact that RJ will probably allways look more natural in boots and with a Stetson might make me a little bit jealous.

You are wrong though, my family has cattle.

[/quote]

Doubtful but who knows. I think they have ranches the size of Austria in Texas.

105

United States is the best country in the world. Foreign policy may be somewhat under Israel’s control but the American spirit is something that the whole world tries to emulate.

106

GREETINGS!!!

This is my kind of thread. Lots of mud and pummeling of the Anti-American snakes.

I wanted to commend Hedo for his excellent responses. Further, my Aussie brethren, Simon deserves some kudos.

Now, to europe. I read the weiners spewing their usual tripe.

Let me tell you about my own european experiences. I found the europeans very friendly. I did not have a single negative experience.

However, I did notice a few disheveled, physically embarrassing figures who scurried out of the way when they saw me. I can’t be sure, but, I believe they went underground. It made me wonder if these were the type of guys who are on this thread talking trash about the U.S.

I wanted to ask the bota/lixy/ss cabal, a question. Would you provide a map indicating where you weiners meet to have your little Anti-American bitch-fests? (don’t provide a map of Europe). I’d like to start up a Tour. I’m going to call it something like, “The U.S. Education Tour.” I will petition various health insurance agencies to cover the costs of the tour as “stress relief.”

The U.S. participants will have to pass a vigorous physical exam. Only physically imposing males will be allowed on the tour.
There will be some other qualifications. Among them, the participants will have to prove that they WOULD NEVER CLAIM TO BE ANYTHING BUT A PROUD AMERICAN.

I imagine there would be much less whining, moaning, wringing of hands, and gnashing of teeth if the afore mentioned euro-weenies were exposed to this type of American. Further, it would be a wonderful stress reliever for our more testosterone laden brethren.

JeffR

107

[quote]rainjack wrote:

Your spouting how many innocents the US has killed for starters.

That number is as made up as lixy’s diatribes. But you have held to it like a baby holds on to a security blanket.

But you will undoubtedly defend it, and ignore the number of innocents TARGETED by lixy’s little friends.

Please explain your “all hat - no cattle” remark. I have yet to see you offer anything resembling an honest explanation for your hatred of the US. Your pathetic attempts at wit don’t really count, since you have the wit of a used tampon. [/quote]

Well if you accuse someone of lying and have no way to back it up, you can swagger all you want but there would nothing behind it.

I`ve seen seen such people “swagger” and it is not a pretty sight.

The numbers I had are from the Lancet study, that tried to compare the death rate in Iraq before and after the war.

The number of 500000 children that died during the sanctions are undisputed, in fact Madelaine Albrigt commented that their death was worth it.

I am not expecting you to take my word for it:

http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140673604174412/abstract

http://www.zmag.org/lancet.pdf

Those were the 2003 numbers, of course we have 2007 now:

And a discussion of the Lancet Study:

So back to where you called me a liar.

I´d like you to show me one of my lies please.

108

[quote]hedo wrote:
orion wrote:
hedo wrote:

Your jealousy shows once again since you have no hat or cattle not to mention a clue.

Thank you for being the first to tell me what exactly makes me jealous.

The fact that RJ will probably allways look more natural in boots and with a Stetson might make me a little bit jealous.

You are wrong though, my family has cattle.

Doubtful but who knows. I think they have ranches the size of Austria in Texas.

[/quote]

About 30 milk cows as far as I can remember.

109

[quote]Chushin wrote:
orion wrote:

We do not do the same. I rant a little when I feel overhwelmed by the worlds stupidity.

No, you go on and on and on and on. Day after day. Month after month. Do you not? And not about “the world” (and certainly not about your own country’s shortcomings) but about the US.

In the end, all of your razzle-dazzle intellectual gymnastics are about satisfying some deep inadequacy somewhere or an inability to deal with some aspect of your life. Nothing else would explain such extreme behavior.

[/quote]

Let us try the alternative explanation that I work on my computer all day.

Be that as it may, maybe I am a deeply disturbed individual, maybe I hate America and all of this becuase my mommy did not love me enough.

That is as relevant as the question if Galileo Galilei was a betwetter, the earth still revolves around the sun, not the other way around.

Plus, if you compare what you wrote about Europe and what I wrote about America you are probably not in the position to analyze me or to diagnose me.

110

[quote]JeffR wrote:
GREETINGS!!!

This is my kind of thread. Lots of mud and pummeling of the Anti-American snakes.

I wanted to commend Hedo for his excellent responses. Further, my Aussie brethren, Simon deserves some kudos.

Now, to europe. I read the weiners spewing their usual tripe.

Let me tell you about my own european experiences. I found the europeans very friendly. I did not have a single negative experience.

However, I did notice a few disheveled, physically embarrassing figures who scurried out of the way when they saw me. I can’t be sure, but, I believe they went underground. It made me wonder if these were the type of guys who are on this thread talking trash about the U.S.

I wanted to ask the bota/lixy/ss cabal, a question. Would you provide a map indicating where you weiners meet to have your little Anti-American bitch-fests? (don’t provide a map of Europe). I’d like to start up a Tour. I’m going to call it something like, “The U.S. Education Tour.” I will petition various health insurance agencies to cover the costs of the tour as “stress relief.”

The U.S. participants will have to pass a vigorous physical exam. Only physically imposing males will be allowed on the tour.
There will be some other qualifications. Among them, the participants will have to prove that they WOULD NEVER CLAIM TO BE ANYTHING BUT A PROUD AMERICAN.

I imagine there would be much less whining, moaning, wringing of hands, and gnashing of teeth if the afore mentioned euro-weenies were exposed to this type of American. Further, it would be a wonderful stress reliever for our more testosterone laden brethren.

JeffR[/quote]

I agree, you would need lots of support.

111

[quote]orion wrote:
…

The number of 500000 children that died during the sanctions are undisputed, in fact Madelaine Albrigt commented that their death was worth it.

…[/quote]

If only the Europeans and Russians would have honored the Oil for Food program many of these deaths could have been avoided. Instead they bought oil at a cheaper rate by illegally funneling the money to Saddam instead of where it was supposed to go (feeding children).

Blame America!

112

[quote]orion wrote:
JeffR wrote:
GREETINGS!!!

This is my kind of thread. Lots of mud and pummeling of the Anti-American snakes.

I wanted to commend Hedo for his excellent responses. Further, my Aussie brethren, Simon deserves some kudos.

Now, to europe. I read the weiners spewing their usual tripe.

Let me tell you about my own european experiences. I found the europeans very friendly. I did not have a single negative experience.

However, I did notice a few disheveled, physically embarrassing figures who scurried out of the way when they saw me. I can’t be sure, but, I believe they went underground. It made me wonder if these were the type of guys who are on this thread talking trash about the U.S.

I wanted to ask the bota/lixy/ss cabal, a question. Would you provide a map indicating where you weiners meet to have your little Anti-American bitch-fests? (don’t provide a map of Europe). I’d like to start up a Tour. I’m going to call it something like, “The U.S. Education Tour.” I will petition various health insurance agencies to cover the costs of the tour as “stress relief.”

The U.S. participants will have to pass a vigorous physical exam. Only physically imposing males will be allowed on the tour.
There will be some other qualifications. Among them, the participants will have to prove that they WOULD NEVER CLAIM TO BE ANYTHING BUT A PROUD AMERICAN.

I imagine there would be much less whining, moaning, wringing of hands, and gnashing of teeth if the afore mentioned euro-weenies were exposed to this type of American. Further, it would be a wonderful stress reliever for our more testosterone laden brethren.

JeffR

I agree, you would need lots of support.

[/quote]

Huh?

Are you implying that your fellow teeth gnashers would be a match for a Red Blooded American male?

If so, allow me to laugh out loud.

You make the mistake of judging Americans by the hippie, voted for john kerry, I hate my Dad, backpackers that you see so often.

There’s a large difference between those weiners and a guy whose forearm is as thick as your trunk.

JeffR

113

[quote]Chushin wrote:
Plus, it is OUR country that is being attacked here. Defending it is only natural. [/quote]

Yeah. Those Iraqi jets flying over Los Angeles sure scared the hell out of a lot of people. Not to mention the warships they packed on your shores.

114

[quote]lixy wrote:
Chushin wrote:
Plus, it is OUR country that is being attacked here. Defending it is only natural.

Yeah. Those Iraqi jets flying over Los Angeles sure scared the hell out of a lot of people. Not to mention the warships they packed on your shores.[/quote]

I think he means in this forum. Maybe you misunderstood. It is Bush’s fault.

115

[quote]btm62 wrote:
Who’s dropping bombs on innocent peoples heads? This is like your mantra or something. [/quote]

Of all countries, the US is the only to have been dropped bombs on people’s heads all over the globe. If anything, that should be the US army’s mantra.

By all means. But here’s the thing: Did anyone blow themselves up [u]before[/u] you got to Iraq?

Curbing terrorism is police work.

My damn people? Who’s that exactly?

When I hear US soldiers getting shot at, I can’t help but think I would have done the same if they (or any other foreign power) were patrolling my soil. You would do just the same.

Iraqis are defending their country against a foreign occupier. Americans are building bases all across the region.

Which side should I fight on? The aggressor or the victim? If the latter, what chance do I stand with my pocketknife against the most powerful army the world has ever seen? And in the name of what should I fight? I’m not Iraqi. Heck, even Iraqis are fleeing the land that used to be theirs.

116

[quote]orion wrote:
So back to where you called me a liar.

I´d like you to show me one of my lies please.[/quote]

So - every person that has died since Gulf War I, OFF, 17 UN resolutions, and Gulf II that has not been directly attributed to terrorist murders is on the head of the US?

If you can’t see the lie - there is no helping you.

I know, I know, admitting to your bullshit propaganda would blow your entire shtick. I expect nothing less from you than your blind hatred.

30 milk cows is not owning cattle. Those are barnyard pets. But I digress.

117

[quote]lixy wrote:
btm62 wrote:
Who’s dropping bombs on innocent peoples heads? This is like your mantra or something.

Of all countries, the US is the only to have been dropped bombs on people’s heads all over the globe. If anything, that should be the US army’s mantra.

If you are referring to the US, I’d like you to give some equal time to the ragheads blowing themselves up on street corners every 5 minutes.

By all means. But here’s the thing: Did anyone blow themselves up [u]before[/u] you got to Iraq?

Curbing terrorism is police work.

Hold your own damn people accountable for a change.

My damn people? Who’s that exactly?

When I hear US soldiers getting shot at, I can’t help but think I would have done the same if they (or any other foreign power) were patrolling my soil. You would do just the same.

Failing that I suggest if you feel that strongly about it, then get off your dead ass and go to Iraq or Afghanistan and get in the shit. Get some boy!

Iraqis are defending their country against a foreign occupier. Americans are building bases all across the region.

Which side should I fight on? The aggressor or the victim? If the latter, what chance do I stand with my pocketknife against the most powerful army the world has ever seen? And in the name of what should I fight? I’m not Iraqi. Heck, even Iraqis are fleeing the land that used to be theirs. [/quote]

Facts mean nothing to you. It would almost be worthy of a response except you are full of shit.
Yes, you should join the fight. Hamas and Al Kayduh are always looking for more suicide bombers.

118

[quote]hedo wrote: I seriously have to ask, since you seem to be obsessed with the concept of credibility, why do you think it is for the world to bestow upon the US. Particularly why do you feel that posters on an a US Bodybuilding forum have sufficient clout for their vote of credibility to mean anything. As the leader we would be in a postion to bestow credibility not seek it. Perhaps that explains the outrage of the chattering classes around the world.

To answer your question. What constitutes “making it”? To me it’s self worth and determination. Happiness in all facets of my life and the ability to change what I dont’ like and do what interests me. Right now it’s coaching a youth football team. Next year who knows?
[/quote]

…remember the OP? He wondered why american bashing happens, and i gave you a reason why that happens. Credibility is gained by actions, not words. When actions contradict words, credibility is lost. I don’t care whether you believe you live in the greatest country of all time, and i couldn’t care less about what that does for your ego, but like it or not, america is looked upon by many with sad disbelief…

…i’m glad though that what you consider ‘making it’ is akin to my take on life. Notwithstanding our differences of opinion, i do wish you, and everybody here, well…

119

[quote]lixy wrote:
btm62 wrote:
Who’s dropping bombs on innocent peoples heads? This is like your mantra or something.

Of all countries, the US is the only to have been dropped bombs on people’s heads all over the globe. If anything, that should be the US army’s mantra.

We are? Can you give examples? No other countries have ever dropped bombs? must be your first day on the planet.

If you are referring to the US, I’d like you to give some equal time to the ragheads blowing themselves up on street corners every 5 minutes.

By all means. But here’s the thing: Did anyone blow themselves up [u]before[/u] you got to Iraq?

Why yes, I believe they did. 9/11 ring a bell? I’m sure you could look into the history if Israel. Or you could look at today when one blew himself up in India. Good post so far Lixy!

Curbing terrorism is police work.

Hold your own damn people accountable for a change.

My damn people? Who’s that exactly?

Muslims Terrorists. They’ve killed far more civilians than the US army.

When I hear US soldiers getting shot at, I can’t help but think I would have done the same if they (or any other foreign power) were patrolling my soil. You would do just the same.

Its not the civilians doing the shooting for the most part. Its the insurgents. Not a relevant statement at all.

Failing that I suggest if you feel that strongly about it, then get off your dead ass and go to Iraq or Afghanistan and get in the shit. Get some boy!

Iraqis are defending their country against a foreign occupier. Americans are building bases all across the region.

No, insurgents and the corruption and greed of the Iraqis in power are keeping the Iraqis from what they want.

Which side should I fight on? The aggressor or the victim? If the latter, what chance do I stand with my pocketknife against the most powerful army the world has ever seen? And in the name of what should I fight? I’m not Iraqi. Heck, even Iraqis are fleeing the land that used to be theirs. [/quote]

I guess from your posts you would go as an insurgent. Blow yourself up. Take a bunch of school children with you and people out buying food for their families or young men waiting in line for jobs.

120

[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
orion wrote:
…

The number of 500000 children that died during the sanctions are undisputed, in fact Madelaine Albrigt commented that their death was worth it.

…

If only the Europeans and Russians would have honored the Oil for Food program many of these deaths could have been avoided. Instead they bought oil at a cheaper rate by illegally funneling the money to Saddam instead of where it was supposed to go (feeding children).
[/quote]

Absolutely.