[quote]sapasion wrote:
InTheZone wrote:
joeblow wrote:
I used 1mg/day of arimidex when it first came around, in 1999. I was getting ready for the USA and my trainer sent me a bottle of arimidex, which I had never heard of at the time, and told me to stop the noveldex and start taking 1 pill(1mg) of arimidex a day.
Looking back now that was probably too much but for that contest I came in super dry and no gyno what so ever. He also had me stay on test and anadrol closer to the contest then I had in the past. The arimidex seems to eliminate water retention from these drugs.
Pretty good story Joe.
Yeah, I put the article up not only for what he conveys about it’s use as a stand alone with something otc like alphamale, but also to bring a little more attention to something that KsMans’s been talking about for a long time.
Which is, that it shouldn’t be thought of as something to run AFTER you get symptoms of high estro, but rather run it from the beginning of cycles to not only prevent gyno and other high estro yukky stuff, but as he’s been pointing out, to ENHANCE the cycle with regards to gains.
This is somewhat one recent camp of thought led by KsMan, and it’s in contrast to what some of our more experienced guys in the forum say. Which is, to wait until you get symptoms of high estro.
I am not saying any one side is wrong, but for me, I’m going to use it from the get go, since I am estro sensitive, with more confidence in the future, and not worry if I’m up to .5mg a day, or even 1mg if need be.
So, I would like to see some of that discussed if you guys want, on this thread also. I think it’s interesting and maybe we’ve been a little too skeptical of how much adex really does bring to the table.
Thanks for your thoughts Joe.
ToneBone
Tone in your case, especially since you know already you’re estrogen sensitive and you know from experience what dosage of gear produces what degree of sides then yes by all means the only way to fly in a case like yours is to use it. Everyone who needs it should use it; I have never waivered from that opinion. Where I and others might differ is does everyone on any supra-physioloigcal dosage need it and if so when. A lot of guys are favoring .25mg E3D of the adex and that’s a pretty reasonable compromise between minimal sides and maximal gains.
To address an issue you brought up about .5mg versus 1mg ED. Everything I have read suggests to me that .5mg ED is equally effective as 1mg in terms of estrogen suppression and reduction. Its hard for me to imagine a scenario where 1mg ED would be required. I’m 90% sure you are not using over 2G of highly aromatizable gear.
Finally, and this point overarches just this thread. I have noticed a tendency here in TNation’s Gear Forum and perhaps this is true elsewhere as well. The tendency is for an idea or concept to be asserted by someone who is respected within the community. Then a whole bunch of fence sitters jump onto that side. Two examples I’d use are World’s doctrine and protocol on higher dosed, shorter duration cycles and this new “fad” with adex. Throughout most of 2007 I was pretty regular here in TNation. During that time I cannot think of many instances where there was any, let alone widespread dialogue about a first or second cycle being 800mg for 8 weeks. I disappeared for a few months and when I returned the fad was the high dose and short duration protocol. What was ironic too was that people who had never in practice used this method were totally behind it. If there is a slightly disturbing phenomenom here it is the ability of people/members to totally get behind a concept they themselves have little or no experience with. I’m not saying its required to have tried a higher dose shorter duration cycle, but by the way some members write you’d think they had actually done it, when in reality they have not. Similarly the test taper protocol is now largely accepted much more so than even a year ago. What again is ironic is I know for a fact there are guys out there totally behind this method and endorsing it like gospel truth when in living practice they have not done it. Again, not saying you have to have experienced something to believe in its truth and effectiveness. But the point remains the same that many relative newbies or maybe people who just want to fit in just kind of go with the flow when it comes to ideas and concepts. This is not necessarily a good thing either.
Now this adex thing is starting to gain swelling popularity. Again I’m not saying you don’t need adex on cycle or don’t use at all. I’m just saying if people are making decision for their bodies and their personal gear usage based solely on the notion that a particular concept is in vogue on an Internet message board, something is missing and lacking.
Not trying to single one or any protocol out but knowledge is power and personal experience knowledge is even greater power. People need to make informed and educated decisions for themselves and not necessarily just get swept up in the current.
Sorry if that seemed like a rant. It was not intended to be. Merely a call for intelligent choices not just monkey see monkey do.
[/quote]
Saps,
You must remember that Ks has been talking about this for a long, long time now. I don’t think I’m jumpin off the fence or anything, cause I have thought about it for a long time, well, yeah, especially since I attempted a high dose shorty, but after the third shot,(1200mg), I got derailed pretty good, lol.
But that’s why I realized, wow, I should have run the adex out of the gate, but it was considered unecessary, and I agreed out of ignorance you know?
I’m not saying this thing is something to actually do on a regular basis, I’m intrigued by the article and Ksman’s posts, but basicly I’m tired of not being able to start my next run, and it’s like, it won’t kill me for a week or two to check it out, and then I’d have some of my own real feedback, which others could learn something from yada, yada.
I know and understand what you’re talking about, I know how long you were gone and remember the transition to some of the new guys and the crowds mobilizing on different subjects/ideas. Hell I’m sure I’m one of the crowd even.
I do see what you’re saying and I respect you.
later buddy,
ToneBone
And I plan on using aas sometime in my future with the whole bodybuilding bit. lol