So, I threaten the life of someone with the ability to defend themselves ie; tearing off their fucking head, and I’m an asshole (or extreme, or a zealot, or whatever) but you can not only threaten but DISMEMBER an unborn baby and it’s ok? By the way, Mr. Moose, Thailand is a long drive from here but I’d LOVE the chance to see you in person (if indeed you think abortion is o.k. or a grey area) and make you feel like you’ve been aborted. Human life is human life no matter what the stage of development the baby may be in. Newborns do not have kneecaps. That means they are not yet fully developed. Is it ok to kill him until his kneecaps grow in? When is it NOT ok to kill a baby? If you say 18 weeks of gestation, do you wait until midnight on the 17th week and then count the seconds until you rip the babies head off? If 18 weeks, then why not 19 weeks? OR 20? And we KNOW that 98% of abortions are for convenience and not a medical emergency or the product of rape. I really love the people (most that I’ve talked to) that ask me “since the mother is poor, destitute or has a promising tennis career what kind of life would the baby have? They don’t have the means or the desire to give the baby a quality of life it deserves right now”. Give me a fucking break! Let’s start killing the people that deserve it like rapists and murderers and stop killing the innocent victims of a someone who couldn’t seem to “keep it in their pants”.
And if that sounds “harsh”, too f-ing bad.
[quote]Mr. Moose wrote:
Derek
What would you tell a 13 year old rapevictim? That she can’t have an abortion and that she have to be reminded for next nine month (minimum) about the creep that did this to her?
BTW my address is
75/28 Soi 5, Moo 12, Nongprue Banglamung, Chonburi 20260
Thailand
You’re welcome to come and try to rip my head of anytime! Could be interesting 
[/quote]
By the way, I would tell the 13 year old that she has options such as keeping and loving the baby (the baby didn’t rape anyone ya know?) Adoption, you know CRAZY shit like that!
And I’m sure you’re not the only one here that would find it interesting ;^) (those smiley faces are QUEER! (and I don’t mean homosexual))
Timmeah:
Let me cut to what I feel the crux of the problem is:
-
Rape can be proven.
-
Incest can be proven.
-
A pregnancy that is endangering the health (life) of the mother can be proven.
Beyond these three points abortion has become the “convenient” method of birth control and that is hideous!
[quote]jahwarrior wrote:
T-chick wrote:
pat36 wrote:
No, murder is murder no matter who decides.
Wow that’s a very emphatic statement to make on such a grey area. Do you believe abortio to be murder at ANY point during gestation no matter how early it may be?
YES!
[/quote]
YES! Or, at the very least, in the case of a mother’s alternative being her own death, then we can call it self-defense.
[quote]Mr. Moose wrote:
Derek
What would you tell a 13 year old rapevictim? That she can’t have an abortion and that she have to be reminded for next nine month (minimum) about the creep that did this to her?
BTW my address is
75/28 Soi 5, Moo 12, Nongprue Banglamung, Chonburi 20260
Thailand
You’re welcome to come and try to rip my head of anytime! Could be interesting
[/quote]
The problem with the “13 year old rape” argument is that it holds little weight. How many abortions are performed because of this type of situation? Not many. In fact, less than 1%.
Long Live Abortion!
I love it when a bunch of sausages get together to talk about a woman’s right over her own body.
I find it quite comical.
[quote]MikeShank wrote:
Long Live Abortion!
I love it when a bunch of sausages get together to talk about a woman’s right over her own body.
I find it quite comical.
[/quote]
“A womans right over her own body?” You mean just because it’s a womans body she can do what she wants with it? Since when?
Can you legally become a prostitute (in most states) and make money with our “own body?” Can you legally put drugs inside of your “own body?” Can you even legally kill “your own body?”
Bad argument start again…
douche bag
n : a small syringe with detachable nozzles; used for vaginal lavage and enemas [syn: ZEB]
This leads nowhere. I’ve stated my point of wiew that there are times when an abortion is ok. To ban abortion would be wrong. As Jackzepplin pointed out, young rapevictims are maybe 1% but should we take away the possibility for them to get an abortion?
I leave this “discussion” to you guys now.
Derek; You’re actually amusing did you know that?
What was it now about arguing on the internet and winning the special olympics??
i agree with this view on the subject
Zeb, my arguement is not a bad argument. with all due respect you seem to look at things very black and white-or at least in this case.
you seem to easily discard my post as being a bad idea without providing much of a logical arguement.
Zeb-in most of your posts in the training forum, you seem to impart much wisdom. But with abortion I just don’t get you and the other guys on this forum, because as in most things in life abortion is not black and white, it exists in a world of gray.
No matter what your opinion is on abortion, you have a right to it as long as it does not infringe upon the right of the woman. you don’t want abortions-don’t get them and don’t pay for them. do everything you can to de-stigmitize young pregnancy, and financially support as many single young mothers as you possibly can. or better yet GO INTO THE POOR AREAS OF THIS COUNTRY AN IMPART YOUR WISDOM UPON THE WRETCHED MASSES. Since they know not of your perfect doctrine of self reliance and personal repsonsiblity (i am no longer talking to zeb here), teach it to them. and show them how in every aspect of your life, you never mess up or make mistakes or not take whole repsonsibility for your actions. better yet, go walk on water if you can honestly say you do all that.
the original purpose of the article that started this thread was to show that the anti-abortion “christian right” chastity/abstinence “thing” isn’t really working all to well.
So please don’t swing your dick around telling everybody else what they can and cannot do. who the heck says any of you “pro-lifers” are right anyway. YOUR GOD?
well what if I don’t believe in your god? what if I think jesus was just some cool rebel who got smoked because he pissed off the establishment. what if I don’t believe he is the son of god. then what. I am not allowed to live in this country, which by the way, was founded by a group of not very religious men anyway?
never once does jesus mention infantacide in the bible, and to take this a step further, he never once does he mention homosexuality either.
as far as the three things you mentioned, I feel strongly that prostitution should be legal as it is done in the city limits of las vegas. I believe that a person has the right to die with dignity if they so wish.
And I believe people have the right to use drugs (steroids included) as long as their use does not infringe upon the freedoms of others. it is society that is hypocritical with those issues, not me.
by the way-who give a crap what the bible says anyway. the last time I checked this wasn’t iran or the vatican, we aren’t an islamic state or a christian stat. so stop quoting the bible like I should give a damn. to me, that book is only a collection of stories anyway, some good, some pretty silly. I don’t believe it is the word of god, so stop trying to tell me how to live based on it’s teachings.
sorry for being so obnoxious, it makes me feel better and I can’t really be obnoxious at work, so this is my only outlet.
So abortion is illegal in America.
All that means is that poor people in America wont be able to get abortions if they want one.
You think there aint good Drs. in Latin America or canada?
I dont even care if it’s made illegal because if, heaven forbid, someone I know needs one, I would have problem taking a little mexico vacation.
You think the elite conservatives wont be able to get abortions when it serves their purpose?
So this arguement really is about not letting poor people get abortions. Lets not pretend its anything else.
Think about what you are saying.
[quote]MikeShank wrote:
Long Live Abortion!
I love it when a bunch of sausages get together to talk about a woman’s right over her own body.
I find it quite comical.
[/quote]
You are unbelievable. You need a man and a woman to create life. A man has every right to defend the life of the child that he helped create. Are you against men’s rights? Do you think men should just hang around, shut up and pick up the bill when told?
[quote]dude-dilly squat wrote:
So abortion is illegal in America. [/quote]
Not yet but eventually.
Hey, crank is illegal too.
Probably not.
Why does a person “need” one? What ever happened to wearing protection? Slapping on a condom? Taking the pill, using the sponge, or any number of preventative things?
[quote]You think the elite conservatives wont be able to get abortions when it serves their purpose?
So this arguement really is about not letting poor people get abortions. Lets not pretend its anything else. [/quote]
You have got to be kidding about this. What a load of crap. If the conservatives were for it, what would it matter if the poor, or anybody else got abortions to them? Really I want to know. How is preventing only the poor from getting abortions beneficial in any way to the conservatives?
I think this is taking culture war to an extremely new level of blindness.
Ditto to you.
Again does anybody realize that the pro-abortion people are getting abortions, while the anti-abortion people are having babies? That means that one group is growing and the other is not. It is mostly the children of liberals that are being aborted. What does this mean for future generations? A big growth in conservatives as compared to liberals, generation after generation.
That and the liberals moving to Canada.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
“A womans right over her own body?” You mean just because it’s a womans body she can do what she wants with it? Since when?
Can you legally become a prostitute (in most states) and make money with our “own body?” Can you legally put drugs inside of your “own body?” Can you even legally kill “your own body?”
Bad argument start again…
[/quote]
ANY law that limits what you can do to your own body (as long as it does not directly harm others) is a BAD law and should be willfully broken. I mean, isn’t it kind of silly that suicide is the only crime, that if committed successfully, you can’t be arrested for it?
Sorry, kind of OT
And, I know this is shitty nitpicking, but I can’t help myself. Derek, with all the head ripping and such. If the head has yet to develop, is it okay to have an abortion then?
tme:
I’ll say this about you: you don’t post as much as you used to, but when you do the posts are still as meaningless as ever.
[quote]MikeShank wrote:
Zeb, my arguement is not a bad argument. with all due respect you seem to look at things very black and white-or at least in this case.
Not at all black and white. I gave three exceptions to my anti-abortion stance.
you seem to easily discard my post as being a bad idea without providing much of a logical arguement.
Zeb-in most of your posts in the training forum, you seem to impart much wisdom. But with abortion I just don’t get you and the other guys on this forum, because as in most things in life abortion is not black and white, it exists in a world of gray.
No matter what your opinion is on abortion, you have a right to it as long as it does not infringe upon the right of the woman.
And I could easily claim that you have a right to your opinion as long as it does not infringe on the right of the unborn.
you don’t want abortions-don’t get them and don’t pay for them. do everything you can to de-stigmitize young pregnancy, and financially support as many single young mothers as you possibly can. or better yet GO INTO THE POOR AREAS OF THIS COUNTRY AN IMPART YOUR WISDOM UPON THE WRETCHED MASSES. Since they know not of your perfect doctrine of self reliance and personal repsonsiblity (i am no longer talking to zeb here), teach it to them. and show them how in every aspect of your life, you never mess up or make mistakes or not take whole repsonsibility for your actions. better yet, go walk on water if you can honestly say you do all that.
No life is perfect and I never claimed that mine is. I do donate money and time to our local crisis pregnancy center. They help young women who have made mistakes. However, they help them cope, they don’t do not help them get an abortion. Your other argument is quite poor. The said the same thing about slavery back in the mid 19th century: " If you don’t want a slave, don’t own one, but you have no right to tell us that we cannot own one." Bad argument huh?
I have no comment on your Godless remarks other than to say you are in a minority in this country as 90% do believe in a higher power. It’s not to late for you either, but that is another post…
as far as the three things you mentioned, I feel strongly that prostitution should be legal as it is done in the city limits of las vegas. I believe that a person has the right to die with dignity if they so wish.
And I believe people have the right to use drugs (steroids included) as long as their use does not infringe upon the freedoms of others. it is society that is hypocritical with those issues, not me.
My point was not to argue what you “believe” should be the law. I was merely pointing out that your original argument: “a woman can do what she wants with her own body” is indeed invalid based upon current law regarding other things. Understand?
[/quote]
Oh and thanks for the compliment regarding my training advice. This is a great!
[quote]ToShinDo wrote:
ANY law that limits what you can do to your own body (as long as it does not directly harm others) is a BAD law and should be willfully broken. I mean, isn’t it kind of silly that suicide is the only crime, that if committed successfully, you can’t be arrested for it?
ToShinDo:
Let’s take it a step further. Is any law that “indirectly” harms others a bad law as well? Would you also recommend breaking these laws?