I don’t like him or bonds or mcgwire for 2 main reasons.
They cheated. I know there was no testing or enforcement but it was still against the rules.
More importantly, they all acted like pussies when confronted with the truth. A-rod did at least admit it (after caught) though he played it off like they were the same as protein powder and didn’t help him in any way (once again like a pussy).
[quote]ADvanced TS wrote:
There will be no excitement around this and no one will really care, I guess thats his punishment.[/quote]
They will care if he gets to 800 home runs, which is a long-shot, but definitely possibly.
…and so starts the Red Sawx, gay-rod faggotry.
If you’re a baseball fan try to find the documentary Baseball:The National Pastime, The Sixth Inning. Not sure how many parts there are but the one I watched was about the 1941 Baseball season. The year Joe D had that ridiculous hitting streak, it was also the the year Ted W batted over .400…Then the war started. It was excellent imo.
Also, Jim Bouton:Ball Four is a must read for any Yankee’s fan. The shit those guys got away with back then would get them thrown in jail now lol.
Baseball was the funnest sport to play growing up by far. Remember 500 up and scrub? You guys from the US might call it something else.
[quote]SmilingPolitely wrote:
[quote]SickAbs wrote:
Jim thome is only like 20 homeruns shy of 600…You’ll see him in there soon. But I do have to still call him bonds, mcguire, sosa, etc cheaters. Still had to swing the bat and hit the ball…but cheaters none the less.[/quote]
I am constantly torn on this matter. A good majority of the population thinks that the physical act of sticking a needle in your ass is going to make you an amazing player. Most of us on this site recognize the insane amount of work that goes into training and see PEDs as a little boost. I’ve heard a few analysts even make the statement that amphetamines gave players a much bigger advantage than steroids.
All that said, while it is necessary for the player to still make contact, you have to wonder how many of those homerun balls would have died in the outfield were the players “clean”.
I think a lot of this is also just an excuse to hate on the players who you don’t like in the first place. Perhaps someone can explain to me why Bonds, Clemens, etc. are vilified while national broadcasters never think twice about counting Pettitte as a future HOF pitcher. But that could just be my personal pet peeve.
And this could just be my irrational desire to seek out conspiracies, but there seems to be a lot of talk about how dominant pitching has been this year. Certainly this cannot be argued, but many are contributing it to the fact that the hitters are no longer juicing. I call bullshit. Am I the only one watching games and wondering what the fuck is going on with the strike zone lately? The officiating has been atrocious this year![/quote]
Totally agree. Steroids don’t make a player great, bonds was already hitting 35-45 homers a year without them, something few players WAYYYY bigger then he was at the time can hardly seem to do anymore, despite their freaky appearance
And god damn I know officiating has been TERRIBLE this year, my dad even called me up and we talked about how shitty and inconsistent their calls have been. It’s surprising there’s been so many close-to perfect games and no hitters and actually a few perfect games (Braden)
[quote]bond james bond wrote:
If you’re a baseball fan try to find the documentary Baseball:The National Pastime, The Sixth Inning. Not sure how many parts there are but the one I watched was about the 1941 Baseball season. The year Joe D had that ridiculous hitting streak, it was also the the year Ted W batted over .400…Then the war started. It was excellent imo.
Also, Jim Bouton:Ball Four is a must read for any Yankee’s fan. The shit those guys got away with back then would get them thrown in jail now lol.
Baseball was the funnest sport to play growing up by far. Remember 500 up and scrub? You guys from the US might call it something else.
[/quote]
Thats ken burns documentary. All the footage he finds is amazing. Tells the story so brilliantly.
Goes from the creation of baseball through at least the 50’s thats as much as I’ve seen. Also pays due homage to the negro league players like satchel paige.
[quote]Eli B wrote:
[quote]bond james bond wrote:
If you’re a baseball fan try to find the documentary Baseball:The National Pastime, The Sixth Inning. Not sure how many parts there are but the one I watched was about the 1941 Baseball season. The year Joe D had that ridiculous hitting streak, it was also the the year Ted W batted over .400…Then the war started. It was excellent imo.
Also, Jim Bouton:Ball Four is a must read for any Yankee’s fan. The shit those guys got away with back then would get them thrown in jail now lol.
Baseball was the funnest sport to play growing up by far. Remember 500 up and scrub? You guys from the US might call it something else.
[/quote]
Thats ken burns documentary. All the footage he finds is amazing. Tells the story so brilliantly.
Goes from the creation of baseball through at least the 50’s thats as much as I’ve seen. Also pays due homage to the negro league players like satchel paige.
[/quote]
yup it’s amazing. I have the whole series of it. Early 1800’s to late 1990’s
[quote]ADvanced TS wrote:
Bonds comes off as a scumbag the way he played the whole thing out. He clearly juiced, just man up, admit it and move on.
A-Rod admitted it (in a half ass way), but he still came clean. Chances are without the sauzze he’d probably still be closing in on 500 instead of 600. There will be no excitement around this and no one will really care, I guess thats his punishment.
[/quote]
A-Rod admitted it after he was caught and proven to be guilty. Then upon admitting it, he blamed it on a supposed “cousin” in the DR.
I agree, the way Bonds and McGuire have handled has been very poor, but I would lump A-Rod right in their with them.
I think people just need to accept the fact that there was a “steroid era” in baseball, both pitchers and hitters used them, the numbers were altered, and it’s now mostly in the past.
Personally, I am against the use of steroids, but that doesn’t mean that I will judge others who use. Bonds used in order to be the best, at a time when there weren’t really any concrete rules against such practices.
Every elite athlete got to where they are because they did everything in their power to be the best and ultimately to win. It’s hard to blame players for utilizing every tool at their disposal in order to achieve such goals, especially when they are getting paid millions of dollars to do so (and when it wasn’t necessarily illegal or against the rules).
[quote]Eli B wrote:
[quote]bond james bond wrote:
If you’re a baseball fan try to find the documentary Baseball:The National Pastime, The Sixth Inning. Not sure how many parts there are but the one I watched was about the 1941 Baseball season. The year Joe D had that ridiculous hitting streak, it was also the the year Ted W batted over .400…Then the war started. It was excellent imo.
Also, Jim Bouton:Ball Four is a must read for any Yankee’s fan. The shit those guys got away with back then would get them thrown in jail now lol.
Baseball was the funnest sport to play growing up by far. Remember 500 up and scrub? You guys from the US might call it something else.
[/quote]
Thats ken burns documentary. All the footage he finds is amazing. Tells the story so brilliantly.
Goes from the creation of baseball through at least the 50’s thats as much as I’ve seen. Also pays due homage to the negro league players like satchel paige.
[/quote]
Speaking of negro league, Josh Gibson was, in Tim Kirkjian’s estimation, the greatest home run hitter of all time. He hit 84 in 1936 and hit close to 950 in his career. Kirkjian estimated that he would have hit well over 800 in the majors.
red sox suck… I mean baseball sucks in general but if there were degrees of baseball sucking the red sox would be the worst.
Pretty much boston fans in general are terrible people.
ARod and Bonds used steroids (admittedly) and so therefore they cannot be the best. their careers would have probably looked like Griffys if they hadnt been on gear.
oh hey did I mention baseball sucks?
[quote]gregron wrote:
ARod and Bonds used steroids (admittedly) and so therefore they cannot be the best. their careers would have probably looked like Griffys if they hadnt been on gear.
[/quote]
Why not? They played in an era when pitchers were using as well, and Bonds did so when it wasn’t necessarily against the rules.
so at that time steroids weren’t Illegal in the US without a doctors prescription?
doesnt breaking federal law = against the rules?
and why not? Other people are cheating so why shouldnt I cheat? Thats not very good reasoning
[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:
[quote]ADvanced TS wrote:
Bonds comes off as a scumbag the way he played the whole thing out. He clearly juiced, just man up, admit it and move on.
A-Rod admitted it (in a half ass way), but he still came clean. Chances are without the sauzze he’d probably still be closing in on 500 instead of 600. There will be no excitement around this and no one will really care, I guess thats his punishment.
[/quote]
A-Rod admitted it after he was caught and proven to be guilty. Then upon admitting it, he blamed it on a supposed “cousin” in the DR.
I agree, the way Bonds and McGuire have handled has been very poor, but I would lump A-Rod right in their with them.
I think people just need to accept the fact that there was a “steroid era” in baseball, both pitchers and hitters used them, the numbers were altered, and it’s now mostly in the past.
Personally, I am against the use of steroids, but that doesn’t mean that I will judge others who use. Bonds used in order to be the best, at a time when there weren’t really any concrete rules against such practices.
Every elite athlete got to where they are because they did everything in their power to be the best and ultimately to win. It’s hard to blame players for utilizing every tool at their disposal in order to achieve such goals, especially when they are getting paid millions of dollars to do so (and when it wasn’t necessarily illegal or against the rules).[/quote]
He admitted it within a reaonable time after he got caught. It may have been half-ass, but at least he dragged himself up in front of a worldwide audience and fessed up.
Bonds, McGwire, Sosa and Clemens all let that shit linger (or are still letting it) for way to long. Public opinion has soured, and they are the ultimate bottom dwellers of the Steroid Era.
[quote]Petermus wrote:
A cheating ass rod…wow. Red Sox forever.
[/quote]
Fuckin right buddy. Arods a faggot.
[quote]gregron wrote:
so at that time steroids weren’t Illegal in the US without a doctors prescription? [/quote]
I’m just arguing for the sake of it, but Bonds was working with doctors, so he had the scrips.
I agree with you, that because someone else is doing it doesn’t mean that you should. I am just saying that he was getting his hits off of players whose performances were being altered by steroid use as well.
As I said before, I am against steroid use in sports, but can clearly see how the pressures of the sport, the fans, the league, and the money could have made doing so logical.
[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:
[quote]gregron wrote:
so at that time steroids weren’t Illegal in the US without a doctors prescription? [/quote]
I’m just arguing for the sake of it, but Bonds was working with doctors, so he had the scrips.
I agree with you, that because someone else is doing it doesn’t mean that you should. I am just saying that he was getting his hits off of players whose performances were being altered by steroid use as well.
As I said before, I am against steroid use in sports, but can clearly see how the pressures of the sport, the fans, the league, and the money could have made doing so logical.[/quote]
Complete BS. He was using illegally. The baseball official drug policy at the time was “players must comply with all federal and state drug laws”.
What he and the others did was 100% absolutely against the rules. It was cheating. Trying to sell it was anything different is retarded.
But like I said, the pussies lied about it over and over and continue to lie and blame others.
Jun. 7, 1991 â?? Commissioner Fay Vincent Issues Memo Regarding Steroid Use
After the U.S. Congress raises penalties for steroid possession, Commissioner Fay Vincent sends a memo to each team indicating that steroids would be added to Major League Baseballâ??s banned list. The memo stated: “The possession, sale or use of any illegal drug or controlled substance by Major League players or personnel is strictly prohibited … This prohibition applies to all illegal drugs … including steroids.”
[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:
[quote]gregron wrote:
so at that time steroids weren’t Illegal in the US without a doctors prescription? [/quote]
I’m just arguing for the sake of it, but Bonds was working with doctors, so he had the scrips.
I agree with you, that because someone else is doing it doesn’t mean that you should. I am just saying that he was getting his hits off of players whose performances were being altered by steroid use as well.
As I said before, I am against steroid use in sports, but can clearly see how the pressures of the sport, the fans, the league, and the money could have made doing so logical.[/quote]
Complete BS. He was using illegally. The baseball official drug policy at the time was “players must comply with all federal and state drug laws”.
What he and the others did was 100% absolutely against the rules. It was cheating. Trying to sell it was anything different is retarded.
But like I said, the pussies lied about it over and over and continue to lie and blame others.[/quote]
If it was truly illegal at the time than I retract what I said previously, I was just under the impression that there was some “gray area” during the beginning of the era.
Do you think there is a direct correlation between the pitching performances that we have seen this year and the elimination of PEDs from the game? I think it seems like a pretty clear connection.