A Good Society?

what is your definition of a good society?

Regardless of ideology we all have an ideal soiety. A list of normative principles if you like,
who you can judge any society after.

So what are your basick principles and what is it that makes a society good or bad in your eyes?

no gingers

I think the better question is: What is society?

[quote]Dabba wrote:
I think the better question is: What is society?[/quote]

what is your definition on society?

[quote]florelius wrote:

[quote]Dabba wrote:
I think the better question is: What is society?[/quote]

what is your definition on society?[/quote]

I think it is far too general of a term to define specifically. I mean, are people society? Is culture society? Are cities or buildings society? Am I society? My point is that society seems to be some cover that people use in order to try to impose one view on all of the individuals within a given area. Clearly not everybody believes the same way or acts in the same manner, so “society” is quite misleading because it tends to ascribe similar features to people who may or may not have anything in common. How do you define society?

[quote]Dabba wrote:

[quote]florelius wrote:

[quote]Dabba wrote:
I think the better question is: What is society?[/quote]

what is your definition on society?[/quote]

I think it is far too general of a term to define specifically. I mean, are people society? Is culture society? Are cities or buildings society? Am I society? My point is that society seems to be some cover that people use in order to try to impose one view on all of the individuals within a given area. Clearly not everybody believes the same way or acts in the same manner, so “society” is quite misleading because it tends to ascribe similar features to people who may or may not have anything in common. How do you define society?[/quote]

yea its not a easy on, but to make as simple as possible. my definition of society must be: A collective who`s purpose is to make the members change of survivel the higest. I hope that made sense.

everybody lifts

I believe in the Kingdom Come
Then all the colors will bleed into one
Bleed into one
But yes I’m still running

You broke the bonds
And you loosed the chains
Carried the cross
Of my shame
Oh my shame
You know I believe it

[quote]florelius wrote:

[quote]Dabba wrote:
I think the better question is: What is society?[/quote]

what is your definition on society?[/quote]

What is your definition of ‘definition’?

An ideal society . . . the concept itself is based in the idea that there can be a perfect man-based ideal.

This concept is a bug smashed against the windshield of the speeding vehicle known as the entire history of mankind. A society can be no better than the individuals that constitute its membership. Since mankind is made up of flawed individuals across the spectrum, there can never be an ideal society. Man is not perfect, is not perfect-able and even if he was, we would all have different ideas of what constituted perfect . . .

So, the best possible society is one in which the members, recognizing the failings of man, bond together with shared values, shared principles, shared beliefs and shared goals while preserving their individuality. They establish a form of governance and a standard of conduct with enumerates punishments, a constitution with enumerated powers and responsibilities and live as best they can within the contract they have established free of the unwanted intrusion and input of those not a member of their society. It can be as small as family clan or as a large as a federation of nations.

The good society in my view is the one that meets the stated requirements, upholds the values and protects the rights of its members as they have defined them and preserves the most individual freedom and god-given rights that it can as it deals with flawed humanity. - - - that’s why I love America!!!

Do unto others as you would have others do unto you.

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
The good society in my view is the one that meets the stated requirements, upholds the values and protects the rights of its members as they have defined them and preserves the most individual freedom and god-given rights that it can as it deals with flawed humanity. - - - that’s why I love America!!!
[/quote]

Err…But America is hardly here anymore. We’re left with the United States, which has long since forgotten the values that the founders set forth in it.

[quote]GCF wrote:

[quote]florelius wrote:

[quote]Dabba wrote:
I think the better question is: What is society?[/quote]

what is your definition on society?[/quote]

What is your definition of ‘definition’?[/quote]

Lil Wayne’s picture is next to the definition, of definition, because repetition is the key to learning.

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
An ideal society . . . the concept itself is based in the idea that there can be a perfect man-based ideal.

This concept is a bug smashed against the windshield of the speeding vehicle known as the entire history of mankind. A society can be no better than the individuals that constitute its membership. Since mankind is made up of flawed individuals across the spectrum, there can never be an ideal society. Man is not perfect, is not perfect-able and even if he was, we would all have different ideas of what constituted perfect . . .

So, the best possible society is one in which the members, recognizing the failings of man, bond together with shared values, shared principles, shared beliefs and shared goals while preserving their individuality. They establish a form of governance and a standard of conduct with enumerates punishments, a constitution with enumerated powers and responsibilities and live as best they can within the contract they have established free of the unwanted intrusion and input of those not a member of their society. It can be as small as family clan or as a large as a federation of nations.

The good society in my view is the one that meets the stated requirements, upholds the values and protects the rights of its members as they have defined them and preserves the most individual freedom and god-given rights that it can as it deals with flawed humanity. - - - that’s why I love America!!!

[/quote]

well irish it was a reason I did not ask for the ideal society, but a good society.

not a bad answer, but what you did mostly was to paint a picture of how to set up an society. so to pick your brain a bit more( if its ok :stuck_out_tongue: ). could you explain a bit more on how life would be in what you would call a good society? would there be any hunger, would a good society go to war against others society etc. just some specific questions to get you going. You can and I hope, add in other points you find important.

[quote]florelius wrote:

[quote]Dabba wrote:
I think the better question is: What is society?[/quote]

what is your definition on society?[/quote]

A society is something that is a:

  1. Group of two or more individuals,
  2. With common characteristics, and
  3. With common purpose
  4. With the reason of having a larger power within that purpose.

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]florelius wrote:

[quote]Dabba wrote:
I think the better question is: What is society?[/quote]

what is your definition on society?[/quote]

A society is something that is a:

  1. Group of one or more individuals,
  2. With common characteristics, and
  3. With common purpose
  4. With the reason of having a larger power within that purpose.[/quote]

Society necessitates purpose?

Society can be one person?

Explain yourself.

[quote]florelius wrote:

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
An ideal society . . . the concept itself is based in the idea that there can be a perfect man-based ideal.

This concept is a bug smashed against the windshield of the speeding vehicle known as the entire history of mankind. A society can be no better than the individuals that constitute its membership. Since mankind is made up of flawed individuals across the spectrum, there can never be an ideal society. Man is not perfect, is not perfect-able and even if he was, we would all have different ideas of what constituted perfect . . .

So, the best possible society is one in which the members, recognizing the failings of man, bond together with shared values, shared principles, shared beliefs and shared goals while preserving their individuality. They establish a form of governance and a standard of conduct with enumerates punishments, a constitution with enumerated powers and responsibilities and live as best they can within the contract they have established free of the unwanted intrusion and input of those not a member of their society. It can be as small as family clan or as a large as a federation of nations.

The good society in my view is the one that meets the stated requirements, upholds the values and protects the rights of its members as they have defined them and preserves the most individual freedom and god-given rights that it can as it deals with flawed humanity. - - - that’s why I love America!!!

[/quote]

well irish it was a reason I did not ask for the ideal society, but a good society.

not a bad answer, but what you did mostly was to paint a picture of how to set up an society. so to pick your brain a bit more( if its ok :stuck_out_tongue: ). could you explain a bit more on how life would be in what you would call a good society? would there be any hunger, would a good society go to war against others society etc. just some specific questions to get you going. You can and I hope, add in other points you find important.

[/quote]

but that’s just it - at this point it becomes the values of individuals that determine the specifics of what you all want your society to be like. My society would be made up of people who share my values, beliefs, religion, etc . . . I would not impose “my” society on anyone who did not want to freely join and freely maintain their membership in “my” society. So there is no final answer for your question.

I will say that my society would contain free-market capitalism, agrarian based economics, absolute protection of private property, a classic Christian belief-structure, a strong emphasis on Education and Western Civilization and Military Preparedness, and an utter devotion to individual liberty. Within those topics are literally thousands of concepts and standards (i believe my posts hint at just a few) - and I will call it FIRe The Free Irish Republic - anyone else think it strange that I have mentally prepared my own civilization? ← - LMAO at myself!!

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:

[quote]florelius wrote:

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
An ideal society . . . the concept itself is based in the idea that there can be a perfect man-based ideal.

This concept is a bug smashed against the windshield of the speeding vehicle known as the entire history of mankind. A society can be no better than the individuals that constitute its membership. Since mankind is made up of flawed individuals across the spectrum, there can never be an ideal society. Man is not perfect, is not perfect-able and even if he was, we would all have different ideas of what constituted perfect . . .

So, the best possible society is one in which the members, recognizing the failings of man, bond together with shared values, shared principles, shared beliefs and shared goals while preserving their individuality. They establish a form of governance and a standard of conduct with enumerates punishments, a constitution with enumerated powers and responsibilities and live as best they can within the contract they have established free of the unwanted intrusion and input of those not a member of their society. It can be as small as family clan or as a large as a federation of nations.

The good society in my view is the one that meets the stated requirements, upholds the values and protects the rights of its members as they have defined them and preserves the most individual freedom and god-given rights that it can as it deals with flawed humanity. - - - that’s why I love America!!!

[/quote]

well irish it was a reason I did not ask for the ideal society, but a good society.

not a bad answer, but what you did mostly was to paint a picture of how to set up an society. so to pick your brain a bit more( if its ok :stuck_out_tongue: ). could you explain a bit more on how life would be in what you would call a good society? would there be any hunger, would a good society go to war against others society etc. just some specific questions to get you going. You can and I hope, add in other points you find important.

[/quote]

but that’s just it - at this point it becomes the values of individuals that determine the specifics of what you all want your society to be like. My society would be made up of people who share my values, beliefs, religion, etc . . . I would not impose “my” society on anyone who did not want to freely join and freely maintain their membership in “my” society. So there is no final answer for your question.

I will say that my society would contain free-market capitalism, agrarian based economics, absolute protection of private property, a classic Christian belief-structure, a strong emphasis on Education and Western Civilization and Military Preparedness, and an utter devotion to individual liberty. Within those topics are literally thousands of concepts and standards (i believe my posts hint at just a few) - and I will call it FIRe The Free Irish Republic - anyone else think it strange that I have mentally prepared my own civilization? ← - LMAO at myself!![/quote]

ok. when you say free-market-capitalisme and agrarian based economics, thomas jefferson pops up in my mind. are we talking about something similar to his ideal-society?

you can infiltrate IRA, and with them you can conquer Ulster and establish “the free irish republic” LOL

Well maybe I who started this tread should explain my perception of a good society.

well first I must say that I wiew society as an collective. and the collectives purpose is to increase its members ability of survivel. so first of a good society must be productive, it must be able to produce enough food and other needed things for the entire population. second the society must be able to redistribute the different needed products. in other words it needs an productive economy who all members of society benefits from. if a society fails on this on, its useless.

ok next its really how the collective treats the individual member. In a good society in my opinion an individual have rights and dutys. everybody should contribute to society. everybody are entitled to the collectively produced goods. everybody should have establisht rights ( human rights ). Society should be able to stop its members from doing some specific acts ( crimes ). acts like: killing, rape, fighting, corruption, robbery. basic crimes.

The same laws that apply to an individual should also apply to the society. The society should not be allowed to kill ( ecxept in selfdefence ). death penalty is not selfdefence, so a good society in my opinion does not execute members. A good society in my opinion does not punish its members in any “evil” way. It will give a criminal an fair and effectiv punishment. lifesentence is in my opinion stupid from an economical point of wiew and an humanitarian point of wiew.

and last power. In a good society its members rule collectively. a society with its own ruling class is not good. In other words democracy, but more direct than the form we have today. I guess thats it.

and offcourse I think socialisme would meet this standards best in an modern industrial context, but if its empirical proved that socialism is unable to meet this standards within a mile. I would stop bein a socialist. because I am more interressted in the content than the form. as an example: If we must have some form of market economy to be able to produce enough to feed all, then I would support that.

[quote]Otep wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]florelius wrote:

[quote]Dabba wrote:
I think the better question is: What is society?[/quote]

what is your definition on society?[/quote]

A society is something that is a:

  1. Group of one or more individuals,
  2. With common characteristics, and
  3. With common purpose
  4. With the reason of having a larger power within that purpose.[/quote]

Society necessitates purpose?

Society can be one person?

Explain yourself.[/quote]

Yes, a society is usually created with some purpose in mind, I am not talking about in the sense of the “American” Society that everyone throws around. I’m using the actual definition, I’m like that. (I messed up on the one or more thing it was supposed to be a two or more).

e.g. Society for Business Society.