I earlier created a thread after finding out my testosterone levels. Since then, I have started self-medicating. I am creating this thread to share my experience so others can learn from my mistakes and hopefully correct my mistakes as well.
Total T levels first week of Nov 2019: 291 ng/DL (reference range 164 to 800ish)
Total T levels on 29 Nov 2019: 85 ng/DL
Free testosterone first week of Nov 2019: 7.98 pg/mL
Other tests like TSH, LH, FSH, Lipid profile, Diabetes, CBC, Kidney Function Test, Liver Function Test, T3, T4 (total) were within normal range.
I am going to get tested again in the middle of Jan 2020, this time going to test free thyroid levels as suggested by members in my previous thread.
Current Protocol:
50mg (0.5ml of 100mg/mL) Testosterone Enanthate manufactured by Zydus Cadila
Administered EoD (every three days)
Aromasin - 25mg pills - have used only half of it (roughly, it was hard to cut such a small pill) with my first injection. Did not use with my later injections.
Nolvadex on hand
I know it is very early. I have only pinned myself twice, but my enthusiasm/energy levels seem to have already improved. I wake up feeling much better and work for slightly longer hours (i am a serial procrastinator).
Earlier I used to lack motivation to exercise for more than 15 minutes. Warmup was my entire workout lol. Yesterday I managed to workout for longer without having to mentally force myself to push. It could be a placebo, but I think not. I have experimented with lots of nootropics in my time and never felt this good of a placebo effect.
Questions
I am pretty thin chested and lean except for some (pot) belly fat. it could be a distended stomach, I have weak+tight psoas muscles + weak transverse abs + slight anterior pelvic tilt, working on fixing it.
Anyhow, since I started, I find my chest and the area around my nipples to be slightly more voluminous. It doesnât feel like muscle - most likely fat or water retention. I am worried since it is around my nipple area. Should I take aromasin? No lumps or spicy nipples.Although the nipples do get hard more than usual.
Youâll probably feel good for a little while since you had such low free-t and your body is getting a boost of it. Only thing is it likely wonât last. Youâll start feeling less good and eventually will likely feel really shitty. Remember, when you start a protocol, your body will feel good and bad, good and bad, as it sync up.
Iâd usually say stop and just focus on one thing like the testosterone ester, but probably best for you to see for yourself what happens on this protocol. Try to at least stick with it 8 weeks since the first month doesnât really count as you still have your natural hormone production for this time. And donât deviate from the protocol if you feel symptoms or youâll never get in-sync with your body and youâll never know if it could have worked long-term.
Thatâs the plan. Going to stick with it until end of Jan, and make changes if necessary.
I dropped the AI to minimize the number of drugs to get a better idea how my body is reacting. Didnât drop HCG because fertility is a concern (not rn, but in the future).
Unfortunately, I was still early in my research when I ran blood tests, so missed out on a few vital tests. SHBG is one of the things I havenât run. Also prolactin and freeT3 (I checked total instead).
If you think it is vital, I could get it checked this week instead of 4 weeks later? I am paying out of pocket anyhow, donât have to bother with a doctor.
Also, thanks for taking the time to share your experience/knowledge. Really appreciate all the help.
Yes, get it asap. It can save a lot of headaches down the road. Low SHBG people, for example, will usually need daily injections. Mid SHBG should start with 2x, then work their way down to dailies. High SHBG, same as mid, but will need the most T to feel good. Not knowing your SHBG is like Russian roulette when starting out.
Best of luck brother, seems like youâre on a great track.
Ears flushing, warmer than usual and red (I have light brown skin so not very noticeable). Last for a few hours, subside and then return to their flushed state.
My ears would sometimes get red naturally too, but this is more prolonged and occurs more often through the day.
Now, I know propionate is faster acting, but thatâs about it. So i have I been taking 25% higher dose all along.
Should I throw it away and buy just testosterone enanthate? Switch when supply runs out? Continue? This is so stupid of me. I have roughly 20 ampoules (1ml) of this stocked.
I shouldâve read the ampoules. In my defense, the font is way too small, and it says nothing about propionate on the outer box. Their testoviron Depot 250 contains only 250mg enanthate. I assumed this would be similar since itâs called testoviron depot 100.
It says 100mg test e + 25mg test prop per ml. Itâs a 1ml ampoule. So I have been taking 12.5mg extra in the form of test prop every injection (0.5ml EoD)
It just seems strange to me that they would dose it at 100mg when its actually 125mg. It just doesnât make sense. Im not sure how the dosing works with those derivatives but I know that that blend has been very popular with German manufacturers since the 50s. But I donât know how they dose it either.
Ran some tests. Itâs been approximately 6 weeks on TRT (7weeks between pre-trt and current blood tests).
Itâs good for the most part. I will save you the boring parts and share the more pertinent updates:
HDL reduced from 47.80 to 39.20 (40 being the low cut off)
LDL reduced from 93.80 to 87.80
Total cholestrol reduced from 159 to 148
Hematocrit reduced from 45 to 46.60
HBA1c reduced from 5.5 to 5.3
Fasting Glucose levels a bit high @ 102 (possible due to my very high carb diet)
Lymphocytes were high pre-trt at 48.40, reduced to 38.50 (within reference range), however now my monocytes are elevated - 12.50 (reference range is 2.0 to 10.0).
I donât have access to sensitive E2 test, CLIA is all i could find.
E2 level CLIA â 45.0 pg/ml â reference range <39
Still waiting for the T levels, this is only an interim report.
Also, as suggested by others and @marcus007, got my SHBG levels tested a couple of weeks ago. I have very low SHBG - 15
Current issues:
Cardio performance reduced, I get easily winded. This has happened in the last week, wasnât an issue earlier. It co-incides with my biggest issue till now: water retention!
The weird part about the edema / water retention is that it is worse at night when am sleeping or about to sleep. During the day, especially in the afternoon when I have been active for a while it is less severe. Itâs becoming increasingly uncomfortable to the point I had to stop injecting testosterone. Itâs mostly my feet and hands. They get puffy and weird itch, the kind you would feel if you spin you arms super fast and all the blood goes into your hands.
I am currently injecting 50mg EoD, but I skipped one dose today to see if things get better.
I am also low SHBG, so high total T isnât going to be well tolerated I think? Pretty sure I am going to have to reduce my dosage, 50mg EoD equates to 175mg/week. Bit high for my low SHBG?
EDIT: I also switched from (100mg enanthate + 25mg prop per ml) to (250mg enanthate per ml) couple of weeks ago. I kept my dosage the same, so donât think it should have that big of an impact since am pinning EoD.
Iâve had/have the same issue with cardio taking a hit when I get edema. I have some suspicions of the causes for the edema but nothing I can say for sure and donât want to speculate. Iâm working to figure that out.
But the cardio hit is very noticeable to me as well. It makes my legs feels heavy. And the heart is already being taxed with the extra fluids so it has to work even harder to maintain the cardio.
Iâd give it time since youâre just getting started. It may disappear on itâs own.
Yeah, I would try 15mg daily for 8 weeks and see how you feel.
You said you felt huge improvements when you started your protocol so this indicates somewhere between 291-1339, you will feel best at. 15mg should put you about in the middle of that range. From here, I would compare how you feel now and then to assess how to proceed next. If you feel worse, then you might need to go a little higher. If better but still not âgreatâ then go a little lower for 8 weeks.
Since you have low SHBG, youâre more sensitive to hormone fluctuations so dailies will make sure you have a consistent feeling. The only problem is you may feel consistently great or consistently shitty depending on the dosage.
After getting tired of my edema issues, I took one small dose of a diuretic HCTZ (hydrochlorothiazide) - 12.5mg.
I lost 1-2kg weight over night. I made sure I was eating healthy and getting enough potassium. I still have slight edema, though not as bad as before. Noticed slight cramping of muscles in my left leg, but nothing too bad. I did read in a few places that it can cause dangerous sides for your heart because it basically forces your body to lose a bunch of potassium.
Also, interestingly, I gained water weight within the first couple of weeks on TRT, but it got worse when I shifted to EOD protocol instead of ED (I have low shbg ~15), this was also the time when I introduced MK677 (have read GH can trigger water retention in some cases).
Since, I have lowered dosage and gone back to ED pinning and dropped mk677 entirely. I would also add that I was eating shit ton of carbs. Have cut back on those as well.
I am also working on raising my SHBG. This is what I have come up with, feel free to suggest changes:
Low carb diet (I already cut out sugar completely)
Quit smoking
Two large meals a day + snacks- metformin, digestive enzymes, probiotics, Withania Somnifera and flaxseed post meal (twice a day).
Himalaya Liv52 DS twice a day
ED testosterone injections
Stop lounging around on the bed all day (I work from home). Remain active by doing push-ups or prisoner squats randomly through the day.
Drink 3L water everyday
Drink lots of coffee/tea (I drink maybe two cups a week)
12 hour intermittent fasting
^ This is in addition to vit D3, ZMA, fish oil, melatonin, L-Theanine and a multivitamin I consume already.
@wts21
Please keep updating your thread so other people can see how bad these decisions turn out when you have no clue what youâre doing and just take random shit. The plus side is it will legitimately help someone in the future albeit at your own expense.
specifically which part sounds more idiotic than others? The attempt at raising my SHBG or using a diuretic for edema? I just took one dose yesterday and donât plan to take it again. I was just looking for temporary relief.
I have looked into the cause behind my edema before taking the diuretic. Cortisol can wrongly bind to a receptor which causes water and sodium retention. The kidneys have an enzyme which prevents this from happening, but testosterone is one of the substances that can mess with this enzyme, essentially allowing cortisol to bind to these receptors and cause edema.
" Mineralocorticoid receptors (MR) are âprotectedâ in epithelia by the enzyme 11ÎČhydroxysteroid dehydrogenase type 2, allowing selective activation by aldosterone in epithelia (kidney, colon etc .)" â The multiple actions of testosterone in men: nature knows best - PMC
âThe MR is a promiscuous receptor and has not only high affinity for aldosterone but it possesses also high affinity for glucocorticoid hormones; in particular, its affinity for cortisol is >10-fold higher than that of the glucocorticoid receptor.14 Mineralocorticoid receptors are also expressed in non-epithelial tissues, including the cardiovascular and central nervous systems and adipose tissue. In these tissues, glucocorticoids might represent the predominant endogenous ligand, given the absence of significant 11b hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase type 2 (11HSD2) activities.â â Possible Interactive Effect of Testosterone and Aldosterone Receptor Antagonists on Cardiac Apoptosis | Revista Española de CardiologĂa
âRecent epidemiological studies show that the incidence of metabolic syndrome increases across quartiles of aldosterone, implicating the MR as a central player in metabolic homeostasis, involving electrolyte, water and energy balance.â â Mineralocorticoid receptors in the metabolic syndrome - PubMed (couldnât find a publicly accessible version of this, besides, this is only a meta review).
