Bottom line: It’s all subjective. Do what you want to do and if it works for you, knock yourself the hell out. But since you asked, I myself would not marry a porn star and yes, it all comes down to a simple moral issue. Her morals are not what mine are. Simple. And yes, we ALL have issues…But it’s a pure fact that most women who get into the industry of porn, stripping, prostitution and the like, have a history of some type of sexual abuse when they were younger.
[quote]Mufasa wrote:
- Yea, Jana…like everything else, there probably is a “double standard”…think about it…“The Walrus”, Ron Jeremy, was one of the biggest male stars EVER!
[/quote]
Mufasa, I thought the same thing. Then I showed a female friend of mine a picture of RJ when he was younger (in his 30s, I’d guess), and she said “Woah, he’s HOT!” So I guess you never know.
Would you marry a former escort service employee? Streetwalker? Asian Massage Parlor girl?
They’re all prostitutes; it’s just that their chosen vocation is not as glamourous (fantasy wise) as that of the hypothetical pornstar.
And hypothetical she no doubt is. As others have mentioned, I have never met any sex “performers” who were not fatally dysfunctional. And this includes my skinemax actress ex, who was as looney as they come.
So, no, I’d rather not marry a former pornstar.
I’ll have a LOT more to say later on this “moral disconnect” game that people seem to play (some would call it pure and simple hypocrisy)…
Again…great discussion, guys and gals! Thanks for making it fun!
Mufasa
By the way (based on the PM’s I’ve gotten…)
This thread has no “right” or “wrong” answers…
It’s a matter of expressing what you feel…
Mufasa
Hi everyone…
First let me tell you that I have been in the gentlemen’s club industry as a stripper on and off for the past 12 yrs. I am 30 yrs old and started dancing at 18. I’ll have to say that a lot of responses to this are extremely interesting.
''I do not look down on those that do porn or those that watch porn. I do, however, believe that selling your sexuality for money (strippers, porn stars, etc.) will mess you up. I guarantee that it does - if it doesn’t, you were pretty far gone to begin with. I promise.
I am not ‘messed’ up from dancing. It’s a profession I chose at 18 to make the most money possible at that age w/out a college degree…which I now have and am a certified shorthand reporter(not practicing at this time.) I chose to get back into dancing after my first daughter was born so that I could be there w/her to raise her instead of leaving her at a daycare center for 8 plus hours a day for a stranger to instill ‘their’ qualities w/out any say from me. I have two daughters now and am a great mother who cares greatly for their upbringing. I choose my hours and work for myself making awesome money. It’s a business for me as well as 75 percent of other dancers…and porn stars. I’ll leave 25 percent for whatever you wish to believe.
"You know, this entire question boils down into a sub-question. Would you marry a former stripper? It’s potentially the same issue with respect to friends, family and so on.
If the person has the right qualities, now, then the past isn’t too important to me. Some people can change and grow – even though I’d have to agree the odds are low. The fact many don’t doesn’t mean it isn’t possible. "
I do agree w/this. There will always be a few in any profession that can call it into question. For example…what about the bad cops that beat suspects and steal drug money and rape women they’ve arrested or are already in jail. Should we look down on every police officer because of the actions of others? What about the teachers who molest children? The priests who molest boys? The doctors who kill or molest their patients? I could go on and on.
And as far as a woman raising children that have done this as a profession in her past or present, the teacher that is teaching her at school could be a dancer at night…her best friend’s mother could be a dancer and you not even know it…think about that. What I do does not define me. Much more important things define me. And I am extremely intelligent(we do exist.)
If my daughters were to ask me about this profession I would tell them it’s a very difficult profession to have and maintain the respect you deserve from others who are closeminded and hypocritical. You will not be looked upon in an accepted manner. You will be tested in more ways than one that will teach you and lead you to make the decisions necessary to maintain integrity and pride. And you will have to always demand respect from others instead of it coming automatically. You will have to always prove yourself to others and that you own the business and it does not own you and that you are much, much more than what society will ‘brand’ you. You will have a tainted view and opinion of men that comes from exposure to this industry. It will change you in some respects, and it’s up to you to control the change. If you can do all that and be responsible for yourself and your actions, then do what it is you want to do…if not, then absolutely never take the first step in that direction.
I am very passionate about this subject. If you are not completely able to make an educated opinion about the life decisions of someone else…then don’t. True love is something most everyone on this planet is in search for…most do not find it. If you find someone that brings you absolute happiness and you feel peace and contentment at the mere thought of them in your life and pure joy to share all that you have w/them…why wouldn’t you marry them regardless of their professional past…you would have already accepted their character as upstanding and have felt extreme pride in them to even get to the point of marriage in the first place.
Most of us are wonderful, respectable, intelligent, motivated, role models. I am me…and if you have been given the opportunity to really know me…marry me for that.
“…I am very passionate about this subject. If you are not completely able to make an educated opinion about the life decisions of someone else…then don’t.”
“True love is something most everyone on this planet is in search for…most do not find it. If you find someone that brings you absolute happiness and you feel peace and contentment at the mere thought of them in your life and pure joy to share all that you have w/them…why wouldn’t you marry them regardless of their professional past…you would have already accepted their character as upstanding and have felt extreme pride in them to even get to the point of marriage in the first place…”
Wow, Michelle…what a great post…I don’t have much more to add…
Mufasa
Ohhhhhhhhhh brother.
Welcome michelle.
You are beautiful. Inside out.
Well spoken Michelle…I’ll marry you for you.
-christopher
[quote]apwsearch wrote:
Ohhhhhhhhhh brother.[/quote]
Care to elaborate?
[quote] Wow, Michelle…what a great post…I don’t have much more to add…
Mufasa[/quote]
Thank you.
I posted this response because my bf and I have had many deep conversations many times on this subject. I was not a member of this site until my bf, who is a member, sent me the link to this thread. After reading through it, I felt very compelled to respond. Thank you for listening…
Thanks, Michelle…
I knew, after being on this site for sometime, that some hack was going to come on here and question the validity of who you were… just because of the your total number of post…
So…thanks for the “pre-emptive” strike…
This has truly been an “eye-opening” thread…and hopefully you’ve given others (at least the ones that are not so judgemental) a little something to think about…
Mufasa
[quote]michelle69 wrote:
Wow, Michelle…what a great post…I don’t have much more to add…
Mufasa
Thank you.
I posted this response because my bf and I have had many deep conversations many times on this subject. I was not a member of this site until my bf, who is a member, sent me the link to this thread. After reading through it, I felt very compelled to respond. Thank you for listening…;)[/quote]
Having read this, not to much to elaborate on. My response was based primarily on two things.
-
The fact that this is the internet and you can be whoever you want to be.
-
It seems convenient that Mufassa has been asking all these philosophical questions and promising some great insight, and here you come.
Kind of feels like a rope a dope.
That’s it. Carry on.
No WONDER Shugs often speaks of the “Internet Conspiracy Theorist” that seem to dominate the Internet…
Unbelivable…
Is the implication that…just perhaps…I’m michelle’s boyfriend…and that this whole thread was leading up to her post???
I WISH!!!
Sorry to disappoint you, Sherlock…I don’t know michelle…and she doesn’t know me…!
Mufasa
Oh…
And I’m not michelle posting under a different handle/ISP/whatever either!!!
(Ummmm…what other evil deeds could I possibly come up with?)
Geez…
Mufasa
[quote]ilive4fun wrote:
Well spoken Michelle…I’ll marry you for you.
-christopher[/quote]
Just to inform everyone…this is my bf and he sent me this thread.
Michelle
[quote]BostonBarrister wrote:
I find it difficult to accept the premises of the hypothetical – namely the fact that a woman who was perfectly normal in every other way got into the business for a short time and then got out. I just don’t see that as realistic.
With that caveat, I don’t know that I could. The woman finds herself in a Catch-22 situation, in that she is scared of revealing the information sooner in the relationship because she is scared of the reaction. However, she creates a large implicit trust issue by witholding that extremely relevant information for so long – and the trust issue would tip the balance for me in terms of whether I would want a long-term relationship.[/quote]
This would be the deal-breaker for me…given the original assumptions (which are possible but IMO not probable), over the time I’d gotten to know her the topic of work would’ve come up at some point. If she never gave me a straight answer I would’ve got suspicious fast and lost interest, which means prior to the porn revelation she lied to me about her work. Understandable, but not good. But if feelings are already in place and it’s serious, I don’t think her porn career itself would be a deal-breaker. Would I want my daughter doing it? In the unlikely event that I get married or have kids, absolutely not. Because I wouldn’t want my kid to be in a position where they had no better option.
Now dating/marrying a stripper…this question I can answer better through my own experience working at two here in DC, one very upscale club and one…not so great. Polar opposites in terms of clientele and girls.
As Michelle said, it’s a job, and it’s not quite as dirty as people think. Though it is one of the few professions I can think of where drinking or getting coked up is tolerated and seems to improve one’s performance. But regardless, it’s a job. The reason why I won’t get involved with a stripper is because of the scamming drinks and tips from drunk guys who’re easy to tease, or losers who think their favorite girl actually likes them as a person and not a wallet with legs. Clubs don’t pay that well (exception for the rare feature), the crowd does…so if you’re really tryin to make that money, there’s some degree of manipulation going on. I couldn’t be with a girl who made bonuses at work by being deceptive…to me a ‘whore’ is preferable to that.
(Note: Again…I want to reiterate that there are no “right” or “wrong” answers in this thread…it really has been an enlightening AND civil thread, don’t you think?)
After being a little thrown-off by the “conspiracy” stuff, I wanted to get things back on track with some thoughts that I wanted to throw around.
Thanks to Michelle and johnP for getting things back on track!
So…
“Moral Disconnects”
For those of you much smarter than me, there is probably a better term than this (some would simply call it “hypocrisy”)…but my problem isn’t so much with what people consider “moral” or “immoral”…
My problem is when people involve themselves in similar, like, and in some cases WORSE behaviors…then turn around and judge others for those same activities and behaviors…
To add insult to injury, they will then “elevate” themselves above that person that they are judging…
THAT bothers me…
I think that some of the examples that have been given on this thread sometimes missed the degree of “moral disconnect” that I was speaking of. For example, no…I don’t think that because someone likes to play Paint Ball or to blow up Aliens in a video game makes them hypocrites because they detest death and murder. The example I had in mind were much deeper…and far more judgmental.
Examples?
- One of my Boys! (Our discussions and the “Savannah True Story” is what got me thinking about this whole thread). He used some of the arguments that many of you have used against strippers (sluts, ho’s, raising my children, etc.), YET he doesn’t think TWICE about a paying for a good lap dance and a hand job…
2)The “Johns” elevating themselves above the hooker.
- The “respected” businessman and Deacon in his church, who preaches about, and against, all those “sinners”…and can’t WAIT to get on his business trips to hire an Escort and whack-off to Porn in his room.
4)And yes…the “Connoisseur of Porn”…whose computer memory is packed with more downloaded Porn than a Southern Preachers…whose keyboard is stickier than a Smucker’s factory…yet gets on a Forum and talks about the “immorality” of a Porn actress…and how they are much more “classy” then one of those “sluts”…
The list could go on, guys…
Hey…again…we all have our “moral boundaries”…but the next time you have a need to judge?
Look in the mirror…(or at your sticky keyboard!)
Thoughts?
Mufasa
Wow…
I’ve gotten quite the e-mails/PM’s on "What would I do? Is the fact that she was a Porn Actress be a “deal braker” for me?
Some thoughts a little later…
(Hey…post on the thread, guys!)
Mufasa