Leaned a lot from this article. Good read.
[quote]JEATON wrote:
Leaned a lot from this article. Good read.
[/quote]
Good, I would like to reciprocate, dump the Yuan and tell them to take our debt and shove it up their ass. That would be fine by me.
Dear Leader seems to be considering the same thing.
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]JEATON wrote:
Leaned a lot from this article. Good read.
[/quote]
Good, I would like to reciprocate, dump the Yuan and tell them to take our debt and shove it up their ass. That would be fine by me.[/quote]
I wonder what the bank would do if you did the same thing with your credit cards, mortgage papers and car loan documents.
Probably nothin’. After all, you lift weights and have guns and stuff. They’d be too scared to come after you.
I haven’t decided what would be more damaging to the United States: if the world’s petroleum-producing countries only started accepting gold for their oil, or only started accepting yuan.
“With their industrial base all but gone, the housing market bubble popped, and the Federal Resereve funding the majority of the government debt with printed currency, the American economy can ill-afford a new challenge to its currency’s reserve status. It is this very reserve status which has led to America being able to consume more than it produces for decades upon decades as foriegn countries were willing to trade consumer products for paper IOU’s. The Dollar’s reserve status came about naturally after WW2 as the U.S. was the world’s larget trading nation, exporter, and creditor. Today, China occuppies all of these slots.”
Not with a bang, but with a whimper.
I wonder what a 31st-century Edward Gibbon will write about our decline and fall.
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Dear Leader seems to be considering the same thing. [/quote]
That’s got to be a photoshop. Please to God tell me that’s a photoshopped picture!
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
I haven’t decided what would be more damaging to the United States: if the world’s petroleum-producing countries only started accepting gold for their oil, or only started accepting yuan.
“With their industrial base all but gone, the housing market bubble popped, and the Federal Resereve funding the majority of the government debt with printed currency, the American economy can ill-afford a new challenge to its currency’s reserve status. It is this very reserve status which has led to America being able to consume more than it produces for decades upon decades as foriegn countries were willing to trade consumer products for paper IOU’s. The Dollar’s reserve status came about naturally after WW2 as the U.S. was the world’s larget trading nation, exporter, and creditor. Today, China occuppies all of these slots.”
Not with a bang, but with a whimper.
I wonder what a 31st-century Edward Gibbon will write about our decline and fall. [/quote]
They might not be exchanging the Yuan for Dollars and then back into Yuan, but the Yuan is 100% backed by the US Dollar. That is how the Chinese have been able to hold the Yuan so steady. I will say if the Yuan is allowed to float in the open market the Yuan is going to get stronger vs US Dollar, and then their exports to the US will get really expensive. Look out America we might get some manufacturing jobs back if the Yuan is allowed to strengthen against the US Dollar.
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Dear Leader seems to be considering the same thing. [/quote]
That’s got to be a photoshop. Please to God tell me that’s a photoshopped picture![/quote]
Real photograph
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
I haven’t decided what would be more damaging to the United States: if the world’s petroleum-producing countries only started accepting gold for their oil, or only started accepting yuan.
“With their industrial base all but gone, the housing market bubble popped, and the Federal Resereve funding the majority of the government debt with printed currency, the American economy can ill-afford a new challenge to its currency’s reserve status. It is this very reserve status which has led to America being able to consume more than it produces for decades upon decades as foriegn countries were willing to trade consumer products for paper IOU’s. The Dollar’s reserve status came about naturally after WW2 as the U.S. was the world’s larget trading nation, exporter, and creditor. Today, China occuppies all of these slots.”
Not with a bang, but with a whimper.
I wonder what a 31st-century Edward Gibbon will write about our decline and fall. [/quote]
They might not be exchanging the Yuan for Dollars and then back into Yuan, but the Yuan is 100% backed by the US Dollar. That is how the Chinese have been able to hold the Yuan so steady. I will say if the Yuan is allowed to float in the open market the Yuan is going to get stronger vs US Dollar, and then their exports to the US will get really expensive. Look out America we might get some manufacturing jobs back if the Yuan is allowed to strengthen against the US Dollar.
[/quote]
When you say “backed by” do you mean “pegged to”? Because the yuan hasn’t been pegged to the US dollar since 2005. And since the Chinese are the largest holders of US debt in the world, one wonders whose currency is backing whose.
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
I haven’t decided what would be more damaging to the United States: if the world’s petroleum-producing countries only started accepting gold for their oil, or only started accepting yuan.
“With their industrial base all but gone, the housing market bubble popped, and the Federal Resereve funding the majority of the government debt with printed currency, the American economy can ill-afford a new challenge to its currency’s reserve status. It is this very reserve status which has led to America being able to consume more than it produces for decades upon decades as foriegn countries were willing to trade consumer products for paper IOU’s. The Dollar’s reserve status came about naturally after WW2 as the U.S. was the world’s larget trading nation, exporter, and creditor. Today, China occuppies all of these slots.”
Not with a bang, but with a whimper.
I wonder what a 31st-century Edward Gibbon will write about our decline and fall. [/quote]
They might not be exchanging the Yuan for Dollars and then back into Yuan, but the Yuan is 100% backed by the US Dollar. That is how the Chinese have been able to hold the Yuan so steady. I will say if the Yuan is allowed to float in the open market the Yuan is going to get stronger vs US Dollar, and then their exports to the US will get really expensive. Look out America we might get some manufacturing jobs back if the Yuan is allowed to strengthen against the US Dollar.
[/quote]
When you say “backed by” do you mean “pegged to”? Because the yuan hasn’t been pegged to the US dollar since 2005. And since the Chinese are the largest holders of US debt in the world, one wonders whose currency is backing whose. [/quote]
Pegged is a better word to use. The Chinese keep a lot of US dollars in reserve. Their currency is artificially low because they continue to buy dollars and invest in government bonds. They need us just as much as we need them. Symbiotic relationship.
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
I haven’t decided what would be more damaging to the United States: if the world’s petroleum-producing countries only started accepting gold for their oil, or only started accepting yuan.
“With their industrial base all but gone, the housing market bubble popped, and the Federal Resereve funding the majority of the government debt with printed currency, the American economy can ill-afford a new challenge to its currency’s reserve status. It is this very reserve status which has led to America being able to consume more than it produces for decades upon decades as foriegn countries were willing to trade consumer products for paper IOU’s. The Dollar’s reserve status came about naturally after WW2 as the U.S. was the world’s larget trading nation, exporter, and creditor. Today, China occuppies all of these slots.”
Not with a bang, but with a whimper.
I wonder what a 31st-century Edward Gibbon will write about our decline and fall. [/quote]
They might not be exchanging the Yuan for Dollars and then back into Yuan, but the Yuan is 100% backed by the US Dollar. That is how the Chinese have been able to hold the Yuan so steady. I will say if the Yuan is allowed to float in the open market the Yuan is going to get stronger vs US Dollar, and then their exports to the US will get really expensive. Look out America we might get some manufacturing jobs back if the Yuan is allowed to strengthen against the US Dollar.
[/quote]
When you say “backed by” do you mean “pegged to”? Because the yuan hasn’t been pegged to the US dollar since 2005. And since the Chinese are the largest holders of US debt in the world, one wonders whose currency is backing whose. [/quote]
I’ve wondered about this financial arrangement a good bit. Their strategy is to boost our dollar to take advantage of the difference in labor cost between us and them, but as they’ve added jobs and real assets, theirs rises- so they boost ours more. So we have a relative relationship of value being pushed forward by the yuan, right?
If that is right, then it looks like they are pushing us up a hill of mounting debt and off of a fiscal cliff once we reach the point of not being able to pay on the interest of the debt. Seems like a dangerous game, but from other things I’ve read, China has also been shoring up the yuan by accumulating gold, so when we tumble down, they will have a gold backed monetary system in place, and a relatively new industrial infrastructure in place to continue doing business while we have a relatively worthless dollar, very little industry, and a bunch of sore butts around the world who will be hesitant to do what little business we are capable of.
Does that seem about right or am I misunderstanding this?
Seems about right. The Chinese have always gone for the long con, which if you have a five-thousand-year-old civilization you can afford to do.
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
I haven’t decided what would be more damaging to the United States: if the world’s petroleum-producing countries only started accepting gold for their oil, or only started accepting yuan.
“With their industrial base all but gone, the housing market bubble popped, and the Federal Resereve funding the majority of the government debt with printed currency, the American economy can ill-afford a new challenge to its currency’s reserve status. It is this very reserve status which has led to America being able to consume more than it produces for decades upon decades as foriegn countries were willing to trade consumer products for paper IOU’s. The Dollar’s reserve status came about naturally after WW2 as the U.S. was the world’s larget trading nation, exporter, and creditor. Today, China occuppies all of these slots.”
Not with a bang, but with a whimper.
I wonder what a 31st-century Edward Gibbon will write about our decline and fall. [/quote]
They might not be exchanging the Yuan for Dollars and then back into Yuan, but the Yuan is 100% backed by the US Dollar. That is how the Chinese have been able to hold the Yuan so steady. I will say if the Yuan is allowed to float in the open market the Yuan is going to get stronger vs US Dollar, and then their exports to the US will get really expensive. Look out America we might get some manufacturing jobs back if the Yuan is allowed to strengthen against the US Dollar.
[/quote]
When you say “backed by” do you mean “pegged to”? Because the yuan hasn’t been pegged to the US dollar since 2005. And since the Chinese are the largest holders of US debt in the world, one wonders whose currency is backing whose. [/quote]
Pegged is a better word to use. The Chinese keep a lot of US dollars in reserve. Their currency is artificially low because they continue to buy dollars and invest in government bonds. They need us just as much as we need them. Symbiotic relationship.
[/quote]
I think we need them more than they need us.
They can always find another market to sell their cheap crap to.
Who else are we going to find to prop up our crappy economy with easy credit?
[quote]
I think we need them more than they need us.
They can always find another market to sell their cheap crap to.[/quote]
For now they have a few more pressing issues to solve :
the huge developmental gap between the hinterland and the coast
the greying of their population
an unbalanced sex ratio
the political integration of their new middle class.
But sooner or later, they will be able to sell cheap crap to their own national market.
Then we will live “interesting times”, indeed.
[quote]
Who else are we going to find to prop up our crappy economy with easy credit?[/quote]
Let’s see…
Africa will be too poor to be useful.
Latin America will be busy propping up the economy of Bresil.
East Europa will propping up the last remains of the UE economy.
Russia is Russia.
The most obvious candidates would be the emerging muslim countries, but for some reason, you keep bombing them.
Australia ?
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]JEATON wrote:
Leaned a lot from this article. Good read.
[/quote]
Good, I would like to reciprocate, dump the Yuan and tell them to take our debt and shove it up their ass. That would be fine by me.[/quote]
Isnt America too afraid of China to do that though?
[quote]kamui wrote:
[quote]
I think we need them more than they need us.
They can always find another market to sell their cheap crap to.[/quote]
For now they have a few more pressing issues to solve :
the huge developmental gap between the hinterland and the coast
the greying of their population
an unbalanced sex ratio
the political integration of their new middle class.
But sooner or later, they will be able to sell cheap crap to their own national market.
Then we will live “interesting times”, indeed.
[quote]
Who else are we going to find to prop up our crappy economy with easy credit?[/quote]
Let’s see…
Africa will be too poor to be useful.
Latin America will be busy propping up the economy of Bresil.
East Europa will propping up the last remains of the UE economy.
Russia is Russia.
The most obvious candidates would be the emerging muslim countries, but for some reason, you keep bombing them.
Australia ?[/quote]
If Europe is still somewhat of a going interest they could start buying up 'merican companies and taking advantage of the currency difference just like china did with the US.
Then we could still do business through European ownership with countries that we bomb.
[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
[quote]kamui wrote:
[quote]
I think we need them more than they need us.
They can always find another market to sell their cheap crap to.[/quote]
For now they have a few more pressing issues to solve :
the huge developmental gap between the hinterland and the coast
the greying of their population
an unbalanced sex ratio
the political integration of their new middle class.
But sooner or later, they will be able to sell cheap crap to their own national market.
Then we will live “interesting times”, indeed.
Oh, we already do business with them. The reason we bomb them is so that they will continue to do business with us on favorable terms.
No, the issue is who is going to keep lending us money when the Chinese decide that our treasuries are approaching junk bond status, and we are likely to default on our present obligations.
We would be like John Dillinger, wondering why we can’t get a loan from the banks we have been robbing.
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
I haven’t decided what would be more damaging to the United States: if the world’s petroleum-producing countries only started accepting gold for their oil, or only started accepting yuan.
“With their industrial base all but gone, the housing market bubble popped, and the Federal Resereve funding the majority of the government debt with printed currency, the American economy can ill-afford a new challenge to its currency’s reserve status. It is this very reserve status which has led to America being able to consume more than it produces for decades upon decades as foriegn countries were willing to trade consumer products for paper IOU’s. The Dollar’s reserve status came about naturally after WW2 as the U.S. was the world’s larget trading nation, exporter, and creditor. Today, China occuppies all of these slots.”
Not with a bang, but with a whimper.
I wonder what a 31st-century Edward Gibbon will write about our decline and fall. [/quote]
They might not be exchanging the Yuan for Dollars and then back into Yuan, but the Yuan is 100% backed by the US Dollar. That is how the Chinese have been able to hold the Yuan so steady. I will say if the Yuan is allowed to float in the open market the Yuan is going to get stronger vs US Dollar, and then their exports to the US will get really expensive. Look out America we might get some manufacturing jobs back if the Yuan is allowed to strengthen against the US Dollar.
[/quote]
When you say “backed by” do you mean “pegged to”? Because the yuan hasn’t been pegged to the US dollar since 2005. And since the Chinese are the largest holders of US debt in the world, one wonders whose currency is backing whose. [/quote]
Pegged is a better word to use. The Chinese keep a lot of US dollars in reserve. Their currency is artificially low because they continue to buy dollars and invest in government bonds. They need us just as much as we need them. Symbiotic relationship.
[/quote]
I think we need them more than they need us.
They can always find another market to sell their cheap crap to.
Who else are we going to find to prop up our crappy economy with easy credit?[/quote]
We consume 80% of all stuff produced.
Right. They lend us money to buy their crap, and we buy it. Once they decide not to extend us credit, we will no longer be able to afford their crap, cheap though it may be.
At that point, we will be looking for someone else to lend us money so we can keep buying crap, and the Chinese will be looking for someone else to buy their crap, who can actually pay their bills.
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Right. They lend us money to buy their crap, and we buy it. Once they decide not to extend us credit, we will no longer be able to afford their crap, cheap though it may be.
At that point, we will be looking for someone else to lend us money so we can keep buying crap, and the Chinese will be looking for someone else to buy their crap, who can actually pay their bills. [/quote]
But without us they will no longer be able to sell there stuff. They NEED us to buy their crap or their economy will be in the crapper.
Varq, we are on the same page, we need to get our house in order. We have to balance our budget and stop buying cheap crap we do not need.