[quote]physioLojik wrote:
Roy wrote:
physioLojik wrote:
I would refer to charles poloquin’s articles about paleo and neo carbs. If a cave man could’ve found it, eat it. It also refers to your subscap measurement to predict carb tolerance. Remember, our genetics have not evolved that much in the last 20,000.00 years. I personally do not eat grains, and I stay pretty lean (under 8%) year round at 6’ 216…
so…My fiber comes from nuts (almonds mostly). Compare a serving of grains and a serving of almonds for fiber content.
Uhh I don’t know if you’re still a caveman or not, but I’m not. Most bagels are simple carbs, low in fat, with about 10 grams of protein. Have’em after a workout with a shake if you really want them.
My favorite grains are oatmeal and fiberone cereal. Oatmeal is a no-fucking-brainer, and well I just love the massive amount of fiber in fiberone. It’s like shitting liquid.
I am of course not a caveman, but my genetics and yours still resemble theirs almost entirely. Their diet was comprised of left over kills from predators which contained mostly meet and epa and dha from brains and bone marrow.
And in case you have never seen a picture of a caveman, they were quite muscular. In fact, their strength ratio was substantially higher than their modern man equivalent.
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No one has seen a real picture of a caveman and the Geico ones look pretty scrawny.
Cavemen lived short lives and it is mostly guess work on how they ate. A few broken stones and some marks on animal bones and it has been interpreted that our ancestors thousands of generations ago ate as you suggested.
I’ll bet that some natural selection based on available diet has taken place in the last few thousand generations.
In fact I would venture that those that did well with grains were more succesful than those that needed to eat brains.
[quote]E-man wrote:
eengrms76 wrote:
E-man wrote:
I do agree however with the above poster that some people sweat their diet like they have an Olympia to win in a few weeks. Saddest part is the biggest diet worriers are 175 lbs.
Some people are just failing at their dieting so they need to pick out things they think are doing wrong (instead, of course, looking at the bigger picture). You may have you diet down pat, but I’m sure there are things in your life you treat the exact same way.
Give the guys a break just because there are wondering about bagels.
In no way was I insulting the original poster but there are A LOT of people that worry about small shit that is significantly less important dietary wise then many other choices they make. An example- “Is it bad to eat a banana in the morning?” when later that night they go out and have 10 beers and 2 tubs of chicken wings. [/quote]
Yeah but you have to admit with all those wings that banana could put them over the top…
[quote]physioLojik wrote:
I would refer to Charles Poliquin’s articles about paleo and neo carbs. If a cave man could’ve found it, eat it. It also refers to your subscap measurement to predict carb tolerance. Remember, our genetics have not evolved that much in the last 20,000.00 years. I personally do not eat grains, and I stay pretty lean (under 8%) year round at 6’ 216…so…My fiber comes from nuts (almonds mostly). Compare a serving of grains and a serving of almonds for fiber content.[/quote]
Poliquin can say whatever he wants, but there are plenty of great foods available today that do undergo some processing/manufaturing that cavemen weren’t lucky enough to have access to.
So I’ll pass on the whole paleo/neo carbohydrate thing. Let me just add that I love it when self-appointed experts make up terminology.
As far as evolutionary studies into diet/nutrition are concerned, the human metabolism IS evolved to consume carbohydrates. The major metabolic pathway is dedicated to processing all forms of carbohyrates. We’re also evolved to consume proteins and fats.
There’s no doubt that if you don’t eat a lot of carbohydrates, you’ll stay lean. But how much fun is that? You’ll never get the chance to eat a bagel. I’ll pass on the deprivation/obsession diet, thank you very much.
[quote]physioLojik wrote:
Roy wrote:
physioLojik wrote:
I would refer to Charles Poliquin’s articles about paleo and neo carbs. If a cave man could’ve found it, eat it. It also refers to your subscap measurement to predict carb tolerance. Remember, our genetics have not evolved that much in the last 20,000.00 years. I personally do not eat grains, and I stay pretty lean (under 8%) year round at 6’ 216…so…My fiber comes from nuts (almonds mostly). Compare a serving of grains and a serving of almonds for fiber content.
Uhh I don’t know if you’re still a caveman or not, but I’m not. Most bagels are simple carbs, low in fat, with about 10 grams of protein. Have’em after a workout with a shake if you really want them.
My favorite grains are oatmeal and fiberone cereal. Oatmeal is a no-fucking-brainer, and well I just love the massive amount of fiber in fiberone. It’s like shitting liquid.
I am of course not a caveman, but my genetics and yours still resemble theirs almost entirely. Their diet was comprised of left over kills from predators which contained mostly meet and epa and dha from brains and bone marrow. And in case you have never seen a picture of a caveman, they were quite muscular. In fact, their strength ratio was substantially higher than their modern man equivalent.
[/quote]
Where are you getting this information. And why are you assuming that we must eat as our cavepeople ancestors did?
[quote]disciplined wrote:
physioLojik wrote:
Roy wrote:
physioLojik wrote:
I would refer to Charles Poliquin’s articles about paleo and neo carbs. If a cave man could’ve found it, eat it. It also refers to your subscap measurement to predict carb tolerance. Remember, our genetics have not evolved that much in the last 20,000.00 years. I personally do not eat grains, and I stay pretty lean (under 8%) year round at 6’ 216…so…My fiber comes from nuts (almonds mostly). Compare a serving of grains and a serving of almonds for fiber content.
Uhh I don’t know if you’re still a caveman or not, but I’m not. Most bagels are simple carbs, low in fat, with about 10 grams of protein. Have’em after a workout with a shake if you really want them.
My favorite grains are oatmeal and fiberone cereal. Oatmeal is a no-fucking-brainer, and well I just love the massive amount of fiber in fiberone. It’s like shitting liquid.
I am of course not a caveman, but my genetics and yours still resemble theirs almost entirely. Their diet was comprised of left over kills from predators which contained mostly meet and epa and dha from brains and bone marrow. And in case you have never seen a picture of a caveman, they were quite muscular. In fact, their strength ratio was substantially higher than their modern man equivalent.
Where are you getting this information. And why are you assuming that we must eat as our cavepeople ancestors did?
[/quote]
Yeah seriously. Pictures of cavemen? I don’t think polaroid was around back then. Also- what is a “strength ratio”?
[quote]disciplined wrote:
physioLojik wrote:
Roy wrote:
physioLojik wrote:
I would refer to Charles Poliquin’s articles about paleo and neo carbs. If a cave man could’ve found it, eat it. It also refers to your subscap measurement to predict carb tolerance. Remember, our genetics have not evolved that much in the last 20,000.00 years. I personally do not eat grains, and I stay pretty lean (under 8%) year round at 6’ 216…so…My fiber comes from nuts (almonds mostly). Compare a serving of grains and a serving of almonds for fiber content.
Uhh I don’t know if you’re still a caveman or not, but I’m not. Most bagels are simple carbs, low in fat, with about 10 grams of protein. Have’em after a workout with a shake if you really want them.
My favorite grains are oatmeal and fiberone cereal. Oatmeal is a no-fucking-brainer, and well I just love the massive amount of fiber in fiberone. It’s like shitting liquid.
I am of course not a caveman, but my genetics and yours still resemble theirs almost entirely. Their diet was comprised of left over kills from predators which contained mostly meet and epa and dha from brains and bone marrow. And in case you have never seen a picture of a caveman, they were quite muscular. In fact, their strength ratio was substantially higher than their modern man equivalent.
Where are you getting this information. And why are you assuming that we must eat as our cavepeople ancestors did?
[/quote]
follow that link…and also to another poster…if you knew anything about reconstructive genetics, you would learn that you can build almost a 99% complete replica of a specimin based on genetic coding as well as bone length and density. Polaroid, no. Fairley perfect representation…yes.
[quote]disciplined wrote:
physioLojik wrote:
I would refer to Charles Poliquin’s articles about paleo and neo carbs. If a cave man could’ve found it, eat it. It also refers to your subscap measurement to predict carb tolerance. Remember, our genetics have not evolved that much in the last 20,000.00 years. I personally do not eat grains, and I stay pretty lean (under 8%) year round at 6’ 216…so…My fiber comes from nuts (almonds mostly). Compare a serving of grains and a serving of almonds for fiber content.
Poliquin can say whatever he wants, but there are plenty of great foods available today that do undergo some processing/manufaturing that cavemen weren’t lucky enough to have access to.
So I’ll pass on the whole paleo/neo carbohydrate thing. Let me just add that I love it when self-appointed experts make up terminology.
As far as evolutionary studies into diet/nutrition are concerned, the human metabolism IS evolved to consume carbohydrates. The major metabolic pathway is dedicated to processing all forms of carbohyrates. We’re also evolved to consume proteins and fats.
There’s no doubt that if you don’t eat a lot of carbohydrates, you’ll stay lean. But how much fun is that? You’ll never get the chance to eat a bagel. I’ll pass on the deprivation/obsession diet, thank you very much.
[/quote]
Calling Charles Poliquin a SELF-APPOINTED expert is about as condescending as you can get in reference to a man of such remarkable achievements in this field. Thats like calling Berardi a self-appointed expert. Phew
Calling Charles Poliquin a SELF-APPOINTED expert is about as condescending as you can get in reference to a man of such remarkable achievements in this field. Thats like calling Berardi a self-appointed nutrition guru. Phew
I also never said that the metabolic pathways were not evolved to process carbohydrates. I said they were not designed and/or evolved to process crap. Evolutionary genetics takes hundreds of thousands of years…not a couple of THOUSAND years of agriculture.
[quote]physioLojik wrote:
…if you knew anything about reconstructive genetics,
…
[/quote]
What is reconstructive genetics?
I have never heard of the term. I just googled it and found nothing.
[quote]
you would learn that you can build almost a 99% complete replica of a specimin based on genetic coding as well as bone length and density. Polaroid, no. Fairley perfect representation…yes.
I am only aware of fossils of cavemen not actual genetic material. Do we really have caveman DNA? I know the iceman they found in the Alps is only ~ 5000 years old and was a grain eater from the contents of his stomach.
By looking at bone length, density and attachment points you can certainly make an educated guess at strength levels. It is certain that our ancestors were, on average stronger than we are today because their lives required more physical activity.
That has nothing to do with eating grains.
In fact it appears that agricultural society with a diet heavier in grains has produced larger and stronger people than hunting/fishing societies.
The use of the caveman example to justify a diet just doesn’t ring true with me.
Humans have been eating grains for thousands of generations, maybe more. We are adapted to it.
The problems we have today as modern humans are the result of eating too many calories, eating crappy highly processed food and too little physical activity.
I also never said that the metabolic pathways were not evolved to process carbohydrates. I said they were not designed and/or evolved to process crap. Evolutionary genetics takes hundreds of thousands of years…not a couple of THOUSAND years of agriculture.
[/quote]
Man has practiced agriculture for at least 10,000 years and ate plants/carbohydrates for countless years before then.
It has been theorized that eating brains allowed mankind to evolve countless years ago but it is agriculture that has allowed mankind to thrive.
Of course we have not evolved to the point that eating Twinkies is good for us.
[quote]physioLojik wrote:
disciplined wrote:
physioLojik wrote:
Roy wrote:
physioLojik wrote:
I would refer to Charles Poliquin’s articles about paleo and neo carbs. If a cave man could’ve found it, eat it. It also refers to your subscap measurement to predict carb tolerance. Remember, our genetics have not evolved that much in the last 20,000.00 years. I personally do not eat grains, and I stay pretty lean (under 8%) year round at 6’ 216…so…My fiber comes from nuts (almonds mostly). Compare a serving of grains and a serving of almonds for fiber content.
Uhh I don’t know if you’re still a caveman or not, but I’m not. Most bagels are simple carbs, low in fat, with about 10 grams of protein. Have’em after a workout with a shake if you really want them.
My favorite grains are oatmeal and fiberone cereal. Oatmeal is a no-fucking-brainer, and well I just love the massive amount of fiber in fiberone. It’s like shitting liquid.
I am of course not a caveman, but my genetics and yours still resemble theirs almost entirely. Their diet was comprised of left over kills from predators which contained mostly meet and epa and dha from brains and bone marrow. And in case you have never seen a picture of a caveman, they were quite muscular. In fact, their strength ratio was substantially higher than their modern man equivalent.
Where are you getting this information. And why are you assuming that we must eat as our cavepeople ancestors did?
follow that link…and also to another poster…if you knew anything about reconstructive genetics, you would learn that you can build almost a 99% complete replica of a specimin based on genetic coding as well as bone length and density. Polaroid, no. Fairley perfect representation…yes.
Honestly, I’m not going to take Poliquin’s take on things regarding evolutionary biology. When he talk about the dietary habits of cavepeople and their physiques, I’m not inclined to take his word for it. No offense.
Poliquin can say whatever he wants, but there are plenty of great foods available today that do undergo some processing/manufaturing that cavemen weren’t lucky enough to have access to.
So I’ll pass on the whole paleo/neo carbohydrate thing. Let me just add that I love it when self-appointed experts make up terminology.
As far as evolutionary studies into diet/nutrition are concerned, the human metabolism IS evolved to consume carbohydrates. The major metabolic pathway is dedicated to processing all forms of carbohyrates. We’re also evolved to consume proteins and fats.
There’s no doubt that if you don’t eat a lot of carbohydrates, you’ll stay lean. But how much fun is that? You’ll never get the chance to eat a bagel. I’ll pass on the deprivation/obsession diet, thank you very much.
Calling Charles Poliquin a SELF-APPOINTED expert is about as condescending as you can get in reference to a man of such remarkable achievements in this field. Thats like calling Berardi a self-appointed nutrition guru. Phew
I also never said that the metabolic pathways were not evolved to process carbohydrates. I said they were not designed and/or evolved to process crap. Evolutionary genetics takes hundreds of thousands of years…not a couple of THOUSAND years of agriculture.
[/quote]
As a poster has stated above, agriculture’s been around for at least ten thousand years.
Not to degrade Poliquin, but I’ll rephrase my statement. I didn’t mean to imply that he isn’t an accomplished academic and trainer, but I’m always wary of the people speaking outside their areas of expertise. I’m skeptical if Poliquin is very familiar with evolutionary studies of metabolism and dietary habits. Hey, I might be wrong. But I’m not about to jump on the bandwagon stating that we’ve not evolved to process carbohydrates that have undergone any processing or refining.
The problems we have today as modern humans are the result of eating too many calories, eating crappy highly processed food and too little physical activity.
[/quote]
It’s also worth noting IMO that if you read the ingredients of many whole grain or wheat breads you’ll unfortunately find a high percentage of them have high fructose corn syrup(hfcs) or partially hydrogenated oils or both. I have committed myself to avoiding hfcs and partially hydrogenated oils.
Unfortunately hfcs is in so many things I was previously unaware of such as bread, ketchup, shrimp sauce, barbecue sauce, etc. I personally think this has been a factor in american obesity, one of many factors though. Europe and other countries have banned one or both of these. McDonalds(which I don’t eat)has about half the partially hydrogenated oils in their menu items in the Netherlands and it’s not just a recent turn of events there.