[quote]Deorum wrote:
Another fact that always disturbed me, while I’m throwing these off of my chest, is Steel’s melting temperature. It is ~1500 C for those who didn’t know. The odd part is that jet fuel, in its best conditions in Earth’s atmosphere, can only burn at ~ 800 C.
This is easy bullshit to address.
Steel gets quite plastic (deformable) at much lower temps. It doesn’t have to “burn” all it has to do is loose strength.[/quote]
Ya, they also put a protective coating on the steel beams to delay that in case of a fire and the one where it was actually aplied held out longer.
Since a government agency was responsible for those buildings gross negligence would not suprise me in the least.
I also find it hilarious that the “head” of the highjackers seems to have dropped Qurans left and right and that “his” suitcase with, well a Quran of course, and “death to America” pamphlets conveniently survived the crash and the destruction of two scyscrapers.
So, negligence and planting evidence seems likely but a succesful conspiracy of that magnitude?
There would have to be so many narcissistic pricks with giant egos NOT running their mouths, that this is highly unlikely.
[quote]Deorum wrote:
Another fact that always disturbed me, while I’m throwing these off of my chest, is Steel’s melting temperature. It is ~1500 C for those who didn’t know. The odd part is that jet fuel, in its best conditions in Earth’s atmosphere, can only burn at ~ 800 C.
This is easy bullshit to address.
Steel gets quite plastic (deformable) at much lower temps. It doesn’t have to “burn” all it has to do is loose strength.[/quote]
Ya, they also put a protective coating on the steel beams to delay that in case of a fire and the one where it was actually aplied held out longer.
Since a government agency was responsible for those buildings gross negligence would not suprise me in the least.
I also find it hilarious that the “head” of the highjackers seems to have dropped Qurans left and right and that “his” suitcase with, well a Quran of course, and “death to America” pamphlets conveniently survived the crash and the destruction of two scyscrapers.
So, negligence and planting evidence seems likely but a succesful conspiracy of that magnitude?
There would have to be so many narcissistic pricks with giant egos NOT running their mouths, that this is highly unlikely. [/quote]
The towers were an advanced design… Much of the strength was in the external skeleton, Massively damaged by the impact… and worse the damage was concentrated… Several floors destroyed which provide torsional rigidity … and it had to hold up much of an airplane (not exactly light)…
The REAL mystery is how they stayed up so long! Not why they fell.
I think the American people are done with this war. And any others in the near future, at that. The support isn’t there, and it won’t rematerialize. War’s over, folks.
The only decision Obama could’ve made, that would’ve been better, is to bring them home now.
So you kill the fanatic. Is that the end of our problems? How do we stop others from rising up and taking this fanatic’s position?[/quote]
No, you kill the next fanatic too. You go whereever you have to , across any border to do so. Fanatics are born from ignorance.
On top of that you must win the hearts and minds of those in the country that have been squashed by these fanatics. Educate the people. Bring them out of the stone age. Make it so that they are able to think for and express themselves without fear of the fanatic. Teach them to take some fucking pride and protect their own nation from said fanatics.
Although none of this can be accomplished until said fanatics are removed. Which takes us back to fighting the fanatics.
I think the American people are done with this war. And any others in the near future, at that. The support isn’t there, and it won’t rematerialize. War’s over, folks.
The only decision Obama could’ve made, that would’ve been better, is to bring them home now.[/quote]
I’m sorry, but even if a leader (general, president, etc.) makes an error that’s no reason to denigrate people who fought believing they were doing the right thing.
I know we’re a merry fraternity of Internet trolls around here, but military people have enough to deal with already. We shouldn’t be saying their sacrifices are useless.
The US has fought a number of unjust and unsuccessful wars. Even those involved acts of altruism and heroism on the part of individual soldiers.
All the soldiers that have died did so for nothing. [/quote]
I didn’t follow the whole thread but this is cruel and untrue.
[/quote]
How is it not true? We leave Afghanistan things will just return to the way they where before. If nothing changes then their deaths where for nothing.
If you think this is saying something negative about the soldiers, then you have to be one of the dumbest people I have ever had the privilege of responding too.
All the soldiers that have died did so for nothing. [/quote]
I didn’t follow the whole thread but this is cruel and untrue.
[/quote]
How is it not true? We leave Afghanistan things will just return to the way they where before. If nothing changes then their deaths where for nothing.
If you think this is saying something negative about the soldiers, then you have to be one of the dumbest people I have ever had the privilege of responding too.
Now let this thread die.[/quote]
Why do you want YOUR thread to die? What was your expectations of this thread?
Speaking of expectations…do you honestly think we are going to “change” Afghanistan??
If soldiers will be dying for nothing from this point on…what have they been dying for since '03?
I am thoroughly confused how any question, this “TRUTHER” thing you keep referring to, should end a thread. That said if that question really makes you that uncomfortable ill restate my other questions for the 3rd time.
Why exactly are we in Afghanistan? What is our goal to accomplish? And, Who is our enemy(specifically)?
If soldiers will be dying for nothing from this point on…what have they been dying for since '03?[/quote]
An uncomfortable question to ask, and one with an unpleasant answer, to say the least. [/quote]
I’ll say what I think it is. Our arrogance and unwillingess to admit we made a fucking tactical error. We used the wrong strategy to get this enemy and we are too fucking stubborn to say, Yea we fucked this up, lets pull out, re-group and hit these people smarter, faster and harder. Get the fucking boots off the ground. And for the umpteinth time so someone who just got out of thier labotomy procedure doesn’t accuse me of “giving up” or letting “the terrorists win” I want them dead too, I just think our current gameplan is retarded, way too costly in terms of human life, both ours and other innocents, and money wise. We can and need to do better. Smaller footprints, invisible agents, stealth. I think it’s highly possible we can do this. We are going deer hunting with a tank. How many deer are you going to see driving around the woods in a tank?
I’ll say what I think it is. Our arrogance and unwillingess to admit we made a fucking tactical error. We used the wrong strategy to get this enemy and we are too fucking stubborn to say, Yea we fucked this up, lets pull out, re-group and hit these people smarter, faster and harder. Get the fucking boots off the ground. And for the umpteinth time so someone who just got out of thier labotomy procedure doesn’t accuse me of “giving up” or letting “the terrorists win” I want them dead too, I just think our current gameplan is retarded, way too costly in terms of human life, both ours and other innocents, and money wise. We can and need to do better. Smaller footprints, invisible agents, stealth. I think it’s highly possible we can do this. We are going deer hunting with a tank. How many deer are you going to see driving around the woods in a tank?