[quote]kamui wrote:
three year olds should be able to form at least basic sentences.
they can confess they are terrorists, and should be waterboarded too. [/quote]
I see your point. but TSA employees are really not that well pais, so there have to be other incentives to but warm bodies into these positions.
Letting them fondle children and attractive women certainly takes care of that.
Sometimes a badge and a uniform does not attract the worst of the worst, you gotta be creative.
[quote]Cortes wrote:
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
I agree - them being afraid of being blamed for “profiling” is increasing TSA’s inefficiency.
The question is - would you rather let some TSA employee see everyone’s crack on an X-ray screen and maybe (lol) catch someone with explosives “in their underwear” or limit what TSA can do in favor of privacy vs. security ?
[/quote]
For every fancy new intrusive machine they create to solve the problem of people bringing “bad” stuff onto the plane, a new problem is simultaneously created via the law of unintended consequences. Think about it: Guns and knives were screened for, so what did the 9-11 hijackers use? Boxcutters. Well, they outlawed those. Not to worry, along came Richard Reid with C-4 tucked neatly into his shoes. Now we have to remove our shoes (only at American airports, ime). So then what, you think they’re gonna put it in their shoes again? Of course now. Next, we had the guy bringing separate liquid components and trying to mix them on the plane to create an explosion. What happened as a result of that? Do you remember? Yeah, I remember every time I have to go and buy a bunch of bullshit travel sized toiletries specifically for use on the plane and make certain they fit into my sandwich baggie. But wait, there’s more! After this, no one bothered with the liquid method anymore, the next guy (that I can think of) stuffed the C-4 into his pretty little Victoria’s Secret low-rise bottoms. The reaction: genital inspections.
The point is, none, not ONE of the attempted (thank God) terrorist attacks that occurred after the prior measures had been taken was anything like the one before. Now, you can take one point of view and say that it’s working. And I’ll say that it’s “working” about as well as crushing a single cockroach in your kitchen and saying, “There now, that takes care of that.”
The entire system is broken. Massively, preposterously broken. False dichotomies aside, I would “rather” the TSA looked for the people who are most likely to be terrorists, stopped them at their checkpoints, followed certain protocols to disinterestedly determine if each person deserved further screening or detention, and let the vast majority of the populace, many of whom clearly have no business being screened for anything but diverticulitis or seborrheic dermatitis, get to watching Everybody Loves Raymond and complaining about how they miss the peanuts. [/quote]
I agree with this to an extent, realistically though there’s nothing preventing terrorists from hiring someone to bring shit into the airport.
Case in point - non-Slavic looking subway passengers in Moscow are subjects to frequent and random searches, so Chechen terrorists hire locals to transport explosives.
[quote]kamui wrote:
three year olds should be able to form at least basic sentences.
they can confess they are terrorists, and should be waterboarded too. [/quote]
I see your point. but TSA employees are really not that well pais, so there have to be other incentives to but warm bodies into these positions.
Letting them fondle children and attractive women certainly takes care of that.
Sometimes a badge and a uniform does not attract the worst of the worst, you gotta be creative.
[quote]Cortes wrote:
[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
Searching for explosives (or toxins or whatever) is stupid. They are too easy to hide, and there are too many other ways to take down a plane.
If you want to take down a plane in the middle of the Atlantic, go buy a couple of bottles of high proof vodka at the duty free store on the other side of security, add some Ivory Snow soap chips, a rag, and ignite with a strike-anywhere camping match you jammed in your hoochie. Two or three guys come out of the Lavs in concert would take down any plane, smashing the Molotovs in concert.
In Israel we search for terrorists. It’s a much more effective screeening tool.
[/quote]
Jewbacca, yours was the exact country I had in mind as I was typing.
Would you mind letting us in on just a little bit about how airport security works in Israel? I’d love to hear it.
[/quote]
There are just layers and layers. It starts way before you get to security. You get a visa or buy a ticket, the process starts. Hotel reservations checked, etc. School you go to see if it preaches kill-the-Jews. Etc.
And yes, we look at a muslim going to arab-occupied Gaza differently than a Christian showing up to re-trace the path of Jesus during Easter.
It’s not politically correct security.
One thing that we also have is security for security lines, which is amazingly stupid set up in the USA.
Set up some dividers for G-d’s sake, so a blast is directed UPWARDS, and just kills those in the immediate vicinity.
Everyone is a complete sitting duck in those security lines – unarmed, crowded, open, exposed, and probably don’t even have shoes on. I’ve never seen anything so stupid in my life.
El Al does this in its ticket lines LA, BTW. We also have a hidden guy with a rifle looking at the crowd.
[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
El Al does this in its ticket lines LA, BTW. We also have a hidden guy with a rifle looking at the crowd.[/quote]
You have more than that.
When terrorists had a little fun at the Vienna airport practically the whole El Al counter opened fire.
Between them and Austrian special police forces, not one terrorist survived.
Kicks to the throat when you are already on the floor will do that to people.
if security was really their primary concern, they should start to seriously and regularly check baggage handlers.
i know a muslim guy who has worked as a baggage handler in an airport in the UK. He was an illegal immigrant and an occasionnal pot dealer back then.
security has nothing to do with this :
someone had a very expensive new gadget to sell.
someone else had a big budget to spend
et voila.
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
El Al does this in its ticket lines LA, BTW. We also have a hidden guy with a rifle looking at the crowd.[/quote]
You have more than that.
When terrorists had a little fun at the Vienna airport practically the whole El Al counter opened fire.
Between them and Austrian special police forces, not one terrorist survived.
Kicks to the throat when you are already on the floor will do that to people.
[/quote]
Pistols just make the person bleed. A person with a destroyed heart can keep going for 30 seconds. You just keep shooting until you are out.
[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
El Al does this in its ticket lines LA, BTW. We also have a hidden guy with a rifle looking at the crowd.[/quote]
You have more than that.
When terrorists had a little fun at the Vienna airport practically the whole El Al counter opened fire.
Between them and Austrian special police forces, not one terrorist survived.
Kicks to the throat when you are already on the floor will do that to people.
[/quote]
Pistols just make the person bleed. A person with a destroyed heart can keep going for 30 seconds. You just keep shooting until you are out.[/quote]
Interesting.
What do you think about a 9mm semiautomatic carbine?
Specifically, the Beretta X4 Storm?
Under Austrian law that is a pistol, snicker, so I could own that.
If this does not anger you…
The American Revolution was fought over a petty tea tax…just sayin’.
[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
If this does not anger you…
The American Revolution was fought over a petty tea tax…just sayin’.[/quote]
Ah, thats not true.
That bastards would not let them smuggle.
I think the impüortance of smugglers, prostitutes and and conmen in American history is not really appreciated enough.
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
If this does not anger you…
The American Revolution was fought over a petty tea tax…just sayin’.[/quote]
Ah, thats not true.
That bastards would not let them smuggle.
I think the imp�¼ortance of smugglers, prostitutes and and conmen in American history is not really appreciated enough.
[/quote]
Interesting point, although I wouldn’t single out the US of A in that respect lol.
Madame de Pompadour, William Owen, sir Francis Drake himself as well as a shitload of pirates of a lesser fame aren’t exactly american.
If you’re in Austria - why get a Beretta, go with a Glock I love mine 
It’s an exercise in futility meant to reassure fools so they can avoid dealing with the real issue. All the jihadists need to do is use surgically implanted explosives like Al Qaeda did to try and assassinate one of the Saudi Royals a few years ago.
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
If this does not anger you…
The American Revolution was fought over a petty tea tax…just sayin’.[/quote]
Ah, thats not true.
That bastards would not let them smuggle.
I think the imp�?�¼ortance of smugglers, prostitutes and and conmen in American history is not really appreciated enough.
[/quote]
Interesting point, although I wouldn’t single out the US of A in that respect lol.
Madame de Pompadour, William Owen, sir Francis Drake himself as well as a shitload of pirates of a lesser fame aren’t exactly american.
If you’re in Austria - why get a Beretta, go with a Glock I love mine [/quote]
I can haz 2 guns!
I was thinking a pocket Glock to carry conceiled completely illegaly and the other one if some bitches dont respect ma authoritay in my own home.
[quote]orion wrote:
What do you think about a 9mm semiautomatic carbine?
Specifically, the Beretta X4 Storm?
Under Austrian law that is a pistol, snicker, so I could own that.
[/quote]
I don’t know the weapon particularly. But I am not overly impressed with the 9mm round. In a pistol, I would either step up to at least .40 or step down for concealment purposes to a .380.
The guy with the rifle will almost always when the gun fight between a pistol and a rifle. One hit ends it.
If legally available, go get the shortest barrel shotgun they let you have in Austria and put 00 buck in it for home defense.
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
If this does not anger you…
The American Revolution was fought over a petty tea tax…just sayin’.[/quote]
Ah, thats not true.
That bastards would not let them smuggle.
I think the imp�¼ortance of smugglers, prostitutes and and conmen in American history is not really appreciated enough.
[/quote]
The point is that people were willing to put up with far less government intrusions before they took action.
I would say the US government has done a spectacular job at keeping the people docile.
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
[quote]Cortes wrote:
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
I agree - them being afraid of being blamed for “profiling” is increasing TSA’s inefficiency.
The question is - would you rather let some TSA employee see everyone’s crack on an X-ray screen and maybe (lol) catch someone with explosives “in their underwear” or limit what TSA can do in favor of privacy vs. security ?
[/quote]
For every fancy new intrusive machine they create to solve the problem of people bringing “bad” stuff onto the plane, a new problem is simultaneously created via the law of unintended consequences. Think about it: Guns and knives were screened for, so what did the 9-11 hijackers use? Boxcutters. Well, they outlawed those. Not to worry, along came Richard Reid with C-4 tucked neatly into his shoes. Now we have to remove our shoes (only at American airports, ime). So then what, you think they’re gonna put it in their shoes again? Of course now. Next, we had the guy bringing separate liquid components and trying to mix them on the plane to create an explosion. What happened as a result of that? Do you remember? Yeah, I remember every time I have to go and buy a bunch of bullshit travel sized toiletries specifically for use on the plane and make certain they fit into my sandwich baggie. But wait, there’s more! After this, no one bothered with the liquid method anymore, the next guy (that I can think of) stuffed the C-4 into his pretty little Victoria’s Secret low-rise bottoms. The reaction: genital inspections.
The point is, none, not ONE of the attempted (thank God) terrorist attacks that occurred after the prior measures had been taken was anything like the one before. Now, you can take one point of view and say that it’s working. And I’ll say that it’s “working” about as well as crushing a single cockroach in your kitchen and saying, “There now, that takes care of that.”
The entire system is broken. Massively, preposterously broken. False dichotomies aside, I would “rather” the TSA looked for the people who are most likely to be terrorists, stopped them at their checkpoints, followed certain protocols to disinterestedly determine if each person deserved further screening or detention, and let the vast majority of the populace, many of whom clearly have no business being screened for anything but diverticulitis or seborrheic dermatitis, get to watching Everybody Loves Raymond and complaining about how they miss the peanuts. [/quote]
I agree with this to an extent, realistically though there’s nothing preventing terrorists from hiring someone to bring shit into the airport.
Case in point - non-Slavic looking subway passengers in Moscow are subjects to frequent and random searches, so Chechen terrorists hire locals to transport explosives.
[/quote]
I’ll gonna go out on a limb and guess that if you are aware of this fact, the Russians are, too. And, now it’s just a hunch, but I’d bet my lunch money that they are not adapting to this new reality by now inspecting all passengers’ underwear. I’ll bet they are doing something more, I don’t know, practical…?
I don’t really care that much about it. I would refuse the Xray…and request a pat down from a TSA chick. I don’t care if a chick or dude does it…but I’ll always request the chick…lol.
People complain about everything…next thing you know, when a tradgey happens, they’ll be the first people to get up in arms about how the airport needs to be MORE safe.
I’m not saying the system is perferct, they could definitely work something out that is less invasive, and better for your health (Xrays and pat downs) but for now it works until they find something better. The scanner and pat downs can’t detect powder explosives throughout the Human body…so they said they have to come up with a better way of doing things.
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
I don’t really care that much about it. I would refuse the Xray…and request a pat down from a TSA chick. I don’t care if a chick or dude does it…but I’ll always request the chick…lol.
People complain about everything…next thing you know, when a tradgey happens, they’ll be the first people to get up in arms about how the airport needs to be MORE safe.
I’m not saying the system is perferct, they could definitely work something out that is less invasive, and better for your health (Xrays and pat downs) but for now it works until they find something better. The scanner and pat downs can’t detect powder explosives throughout the Human body…so they said they have to come up with a better way of doing things.[/quote]
Cute.
Carry on.