I disagree with this. Believing in something is not a choice. I mean I guess it can be a choice, but I would know deep down that I was faking it / tricking myself.
Is believing in God a requirement for being a christian? Or do you just have to worship him? I am being serious here.
Edit: I am assuming by rejecting, you are implying that one stops believing. Please correct me if I am wrong.
Itâs humanly possible to push it farther down so that youâre not quite sure if you really believe it or not
Whether it would be worth while is a different question
How many people reject him that are sure of his existence? I mean if I reject him itâs because logic and reason have shown me no signs that I should believe. At least not really more than something like Big Foot or the Loch Ness monster.
It would be much better if he showed that he existed with no doubt. Especially if he is going to eternally torture you if you donât worship.
Whatâs the difference in outcome according to a lot of believers though? Iâm fine admitting itâs a possibility just like anything else I havenât seen thatâs a possibility from ghosts to UFOâs. But does that keep me from being tortured if I just think that he may or may not exist.
You asked me a bunch of questions last night, and Iâm still thinking how to respond. You asked me questions about stuff that DID used to bother me a ton, but I have resolved for myself, but it was complicated
You wouldnât want to read all the thoughts that have been coming to me, Iâm trying to think of what the cliff notes would/should be
Fwiw, if people were trying to follow the works of Santa Claus, and used it as an excuse to exert their will on you, youâd probably have much more criticism.
Or maybe if there was an organization that worshipped Santa and kept getting caught covering up child rape and was always above reproach because Santa.
Plus, to an atheist, itâs just a topic to discuss. Many feel no need to expunge it from their minds or mouths anymore than they do the weather. Itâs silly to assume otherwise.
I am hoping we are all doing this because we are having fun. I honestly love arguing. Some of you can tell by now. I try to get better as I go, but have a lot to learn too. Language is hard to master, and so is debate.
Is this not akin to saying every govt law is alright, regardless of its validity. Nobody is forcing you to obey them after all. You could always just spend eternity in jail.
After all, the concept of god is that of the ultimate malevolent authoritarian.
People âenjoyingâ a religious debate is typically limited to the atheist side of the fence. Itâs virtually impossible to really debate religion without coming off as insulting to the other person. Itâs a bi-product of questioning someoneâs basis of existence etcetc.
Do you think this is true though knowing about missionaries/evangelicals? I mean donât you have a lot of believers who go to people who believe something different than the religion they are trying to sway them to become? And go to people who may not believe and try to sway them as well?
I would think they get enjoyment out of this even if they may not ultimately be looking for debate. You have to think they at least expect it especially if they are trying to change someoneâs mind from say Muslim to Christian.
Not at all. Obey the government, or go be with the government full-time. Obey God, or Heâll let you not deal with Him.
Whoâs to say this wonât happen prior to ultimate judgement?
Pretty sure most people donât believe He is going to torture anyone, by the way.
Iâm personally not insulted, and hope I havenât insulted anyone as blunt as my answers may or may not be.
Those people donât actually want to debate about it. You canât really debate about which religion is right. Those people are just looking for someone to convince them of something new/different.
Thatâs because the bible preaches there is value in converting people. That doesnât mean thereâs value in arguing with people they have no chance of converting.
Except this isnât whatâs happening. Itâs an eternity of torture for not obeying him. Youâre still within the realm he controls. Judges donât go visit the people they put away.
Not me. I may get a bit worked up, but it is because I myself am having trouble articulating my point, or I get to hasty and misrepresent someoneâs argument. I really donât like to do that, and am guilty of it today. I guess I have apologized in those situations, and asked for clarification.
You have been civil enough in my opinion.
It IS whatâs supposed to happen. Rejecting God, who is goodness, would result in your acceptance of evil. It would just involve your choosing evil over goodness.
Much like rejecting govt laws (goodness) is an acceptance of evil?
Are we actually in disagreement on whether or not the concept of God is that of the ultimate authoritarian? Or are you just explaining your reasoning for being okay with it?
What faith are you? Not looking to bash just curious. I think from an earlier thread we have I know most of the usual players faith background and I donât know yours.
I was raised Methodist before turning into a heathen. Worst day of my life was when my best friends mom converted them to Catholicism and we had to go to separate churches. Or at least it seemed like it.
Thatâs not how I read the options. Worship what you canât see or spend eternity in flames according to some people who believe in the words of a book written a long time ago. A book with many different versions and translations.
Oh and thatâs just one game in town. Plenty other people have other books which they say are true. But the one weâve been talking about in here doesnât preach much about God being pretty cool with you if you believe or donât believe.
This is one of the things that always bugged me. While religion is an amazingly effective society control lever, your religion is very very likely to be dictated by whom you are born to.
Then further shaped by the quality of the group who teaches it to you. All modern day religion could very well be a bastardized approach of the correct old-school religion, and weâd never even know it
Oh, same to you. I never took offense in our exchanges. Nobody here has been insulting to me, in fact.