Trinity - Bible Teaching or Doctrine of Man

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
961

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
This “Re-formulated positively,” statement at 846 should be all the evidence anyone needs of the man made synthetic fabric of the impotent RCC. Anybody who thinks this was always what was meant by “Outside the Church there is no salvation” is willfully lying to themselves or an imbecile. Who does and doesn’t go to heaven and whether clearly unsaved pagans can be identified has changed.

Pat’s right, or so it appears. The RCC has declared the incomprehensibly holy God a hip n groovy dood who just accepts people doing the best they know how despite clear and unmistakable biblical evidence to the contrary. Wadda joke, and a bad one at that. How can anybody believe the Holy One of Israel could have anything to do with this feel good psychobabble.

But wait, we have not yet been treated to Chris’s response which will surely dig up some long convoluted explanation that contradicts all this, but not really. You just need to achieve a “higher understanding” provided in a load of ritual and religion and it’s all good.

OR, OR, OR, you can just accept the simple statements of scripture, accessible to a child, that all are born dead and those and only those who believe with their heart and confess with their mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord will be saved and that a flagrantly sinful life and or fatally heretical gospel evince the absence of saving grace. [/quote]

The fact that you can’t even see the place for Sacred Tradition clearly stated in the Bible shows that it is not “accessible to a child.”

Please show proof. You just make claims but don’t show what you’re talking about. Very confusing.

[quote]
That’s what will be paid for Pat. Millions and millions of wailing lost souls will eternally die with the knowledge that that Molech in the vatican lied to them.[/quote]

962

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
This “Re-formulated positively,” statement at 846 should be all the evidence anyone needs of the man made synthetic fabric of the impotent RCC. Anybody who thinks this was always what was meant by “Outside the Church there is no salvation” is willfully lying to themselves or an imbecile. Who does and doesn’t go to heaven and whether clearly unsaved pagans can be identified has changed.

Pat’s right, or so it appears. The RCC has declared the incomprehensibly holy God a hip n groovy dood who just accepts people doing the best they know how despite clear and unmistakable biblical evidence to the contrary. Wadda joke, and a bad one at that. How can anybody believe the Holy One of Israel could have anything to do with this feel good psychobabble.

But wait, we have not yet been treated to Chris’s response which will surely dig up some long convoluted explanation that contradicts all this, but not really. You just need to achieve a “higher understanding” provided in a load of ritual and religion and it’s all good.

OR, OR, OR, you can just accept the simple statements of scripture, accessible to a child, that all are born dead and those and only those who believe with their heart and confess with their mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord will be saved and that a flagrantly sinful life and or fatally heretical gospel evince the absence of saving grace.

See that’s what Paul preached. That’s What Peter preached and James and John and Stephen and Barnabas and Timothy and Titus. It wasn’t until the 20th century that we learn from that satanic lie in Rome that actually all kinds of religious and well meaning people are in God’s saving favor because… it feels good? Even they didn’t always believe that. In fact for most of the church age the RCC did not teach this. It’s now “reformulated positively”.

That’s what will be paid for Pat. Millions and millions of wailing lost souls will eternally die with the knowledge that that Molech in the vatican lied to them.[/quote]

Thanks for proving my point. You utter ignorance and nonsensical ramblings about the RCC prove you know nothing about it. Second, you pass judgment on the practitioners of the faith simply based on hate not fact.
At the bottom of each page is scriptural references for everything discussed in the that section. Look it up. There is a reason that is in there, Paul said it in Romans.

I don’t mind discussing things, but they have to be actual things, not made up hate filled passions.
The church you loath was created by Christ himself. The New testament was created by the church you loath. The Bible cannon was assembled by the Church you hate.
It’s in the bible, look it up.

If I am going to hell for my faith, I’ll see you there bud. Simply confessing that Jesus is Lord is a foregone conclusion for us, if you don’t believe that already, there is no point in going to church. It’s not enough. You gotta act right too.

963

I just wanted to say something which I think is vital.

Jimmy cracked corn and I really DO care. Poor chap has no one supporting him. Oh wait, I mean:

I am a Protestant according to all theses “denominations” but I don’t like referring to myself as part of a denomination, but rather plain and simple, a follower of Christ. That means worshiping him, emulating him, and living the life he would be proud of. I don’t follow traditions as our Catholic brothers and sisters, but I see no harm in doing so. I believe that tradition can get in the way with salvation if it is done mindlessly, out of obligation or if its meant to take the place of Christ’s final sacrifice.

But I most definitely see merit as well. If one does these long held traditions with a pure heart, does them willingly and enjoyably, all in the purpose of serving our one and only God, then I believe it is a wise practice to do.

I think many a times we get caught up in semantics and miss the big picture. The big picture of course, is serving our Lord and Savior, Jesus the Christ.

964

By the way Tirib, it says you live in Michigan, do you happen to live close to or in Detroit?

965

[quote]pat wrote:
<<< Paul said it in Romans. >>>[/quote]No, Paul did not say it in Romans. Paul said the exact opposite in the 2nd of Romans, declaring a further exposition of his revelation of universal culpability (law unto themselves) from the 1st chapter. He is proclaiming the truth that every last single human since Adam is without excuse and equally damned in him in whom all died (1st Corinthians 15.) because God in His unquestionable justice has made it plain even to the deniers in this thread. I’ve quoted that passage in Romans 1 til I’m blue in the fingers.

In fact the whole book of Romans stands as a blaring indictment of that satanic, damnable doctrine of ignorance which is an abhorrent insult to the holiness and light of the most high God. I just gave you a clear example, like I have many times before, but that won’t stop you from jumping up and down and demanding that I stop running down the RCC and being hateful and come up with some proof. Why can you not see the crystal clear truths spelled out in the written Word of God Himself? Because you are just as dead as the atheists you argue with here.

This is just one way I know. Your profane abuse of the grace of the risen savior in telling universally recognized utter heretics and practicing Christ hating sodomites that God accepts them is unmistakable. You thereby display both your alienation from God and slap happy true hatred for those you lie to. You say I hate you? You lie. I say YOU hate THEM because you lead them to believe a lie that will cost them eternity if persisted in til the end. I care about them… and you. I won’t do that to them or you to make myself feel better in the name of some pagan god who is no god at all.

One thing I know for sure. We are not practicing the same gospel. We don’t even speak the same spiritual language. I would have much more respect for the RCC of old that actually had some testicles and would have gladly told me I was damned and burned me at the stake. You have no idea how nauseating it is to have you try n force filth and heresy down God’s throat by declaring clean that which He clearly condemns. If your church was actually Christ’s I should be on that list. As it is if she ever did bear any fragrance of the resurrection she has long since forfeited it and the scriptures she did indeed give us stand ironically as her loudest hostile witness.

All that said? One more time. There will be some catholics in heaven and folks from my church and every other good one in hell. You people just do not frickin get it which I expect, but it still frustrates me.

How did I get into this again? =[

966

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
This “Re-formulated positively,” statement at 846 should be all the evidence anyone needs of the man made synthetic fabric of the impotent RCC. Anybody who thinks this was always what was meant by “Outside the Church there is no salvation” is willfully lying to themselves or an imbecile. Who does and doesn’t go to heaven and whether clearly unsaved pagans can be identified has changed.

Pat’s right, or so it appears. The RCC has declared the incomprehensibly holy God a hip n groovy dood who just accepts people doing the best they know how despite clear and unmistakable biblical evidence to the contrary. Wadda joke, and a bad one at that. How can anybody believe the Holy One of Israel could have anything to do with this feel good psychobabble.

But wait, we have not yet been treated to Chris’s response which will surely dig up some long convoluted explanation that contradicts all this, but not really. You just need to achieve a “higher understanding” provided in a load of ritual and religion and it’s all good.

OR, OR, OR, you can just accept the simple statements of scripture, accessible to a child, that all are born dead and those and only those who believe with their heart and confess with their mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord will be saved and that a flagrantly sinful life and or fatally heretical gospel evince the absence of saving grace.

See that’s what Paul preached. That’s What Peter preached and James and John and Stephen and Barnabas and Timothy and Titus. It wasn’t until the 20th century that we learn from that satanic lie in Rome that actually all kinds of religious and well meaning people are in God’s saving favor because… it feels good? Even they didn’t always believe that. In fact for most of the church age the RCC did not teach this. It’s now “reformulated positively”.

That’s what will be paid for Pat. Millions and millions of wailing lost souls will eternally die with the knowledge that that Molech in the vatican lied to them.[/quote]

Thanks for proving my point. You utter ignorance and nonsensical ramblings about the RCC prove you know nothing about it. Second, you pass judgment on the practitioners of the faith simply based on hate not fact.
At the bottom of each page is scriptural references for everything discussed in the that section. Look it up. There is a reason that is in there, Paul said it in Romans.

I don’t mind discussing things, but they have to be actual things, not made up hate filled passions.
The church you loath was created by Christ himself. The New testament was created by the church you loath. The Bible cannon was assembled by the Church you hate.
It’s in the bible, look it up.

If I am going to hell for my faith, I’ll see you there bud. Simply confessing that Jesus is Lord is a foregone conclusion for us, if you don’t believe that already, there is no point in going to church. It’s not enough. You gotta act right too.

[/quote]

does a dance

The Gospel According to Mark says, “He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned” and in the Gospel According to John, Jesus concurs, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of the water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God”; however, Paul strengthens the point that, “without faith it is impossible to please him. For whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him” and let it be said that we must believe as St. Fulgentius points out on his sermon on the Faith 1, Faith makes a relationship with God possible. Faith is the foundation of everything and the beginning of human salvation. Apart from the faith, one can neither be numbered among the sons of God nor obtain the grace of justification. Without faith, every human effort is empty.

Protestants misuse the same lines to show that they don’t need the Church or the authority of the Church (which I contest that these Protestants that deny authority of the Church are denying the authority of man to think), that we show that if a pagan on a desolate island yet has faith in the one true God, and does His will, he can be saved.

967

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
<<< Paul said it in Romans. >>>[/quote]No, Paul did not say it in Romans. Paul said the exact opposite in the 2nd of Romans, declaring a further exposition of his revelation of universal culpability (law unto themselves) from the 1st chapter. He is proclaiming the truth that every last single human since Adam is without excuse and equally damned in him in whom all died (1st Corinthians 15.) because God in His unquestionable justice has made it plain even to the deniers in this thread. I’ve quoted that passage in Romans 1 til I’m blue in the fingers.

In fact the whole book of Romans stands as a blaring indictment of that satanic, damnable doctrine of ignorance which is an abhorrent insult to the holiness and light of the most high God. I just gave you a clear example, like I have many times before, but that won’t stop you from jumping up and down and demanding that I stop running down the RCC and being hateful and come up with some proof. Why can you not see the crystal clear truths spelled out in the written Word of God Himself? Because you are just as dead as the atheists you argue with here.

This is just one way I know. Your profane abuse of the grace of the risen savior in telling universally recognized utter heretics and practicing Christ hating sodomites that God accepts them is unmistakable. You thereby display both your alienation from God and slap happy true hatred for those you lie to. You say I hate you? You lie. I say YOU hate THEM because you lead them to believe a lie that will cost them eternity if persisted in til the end. I care about them… and you. I won’t do that to them or you to make myself feel better in the name of some pagan god who is no god at all.

One thing I know for sure. We are not practicing the same gospel. We don’t even speak the same spiritual language. I would have much more respect for the RCC of old that actually had some testicles and would have gladly told me I was damned and burned me at the stake. You have no idea how nauseating it is to have you try n force filth and heresy down God’s throat by declaring clean that which He clearly condemns. If your church was actually Christ’s I should be on that list. As it is if she ever did bear any fragrance of the resurrection she has long since forfeited it and the scriptures she did indeed give us stand ironically as her loudest hostile witness.

All that said? One more time. There will be some catholics in heaven and folks from my church and every other good one in hell. You people just do not frickin get it which I expect, but it still frustrates me.

How did I get into this again? =[
[/quote]

You still don’t get it. I posted the scripture for you, I think Pat was referring to Hebrews, not Romans for the CCC referenced.

968

[quote]forbes wrote:
By the way Tirib, it says you live in Michigan, do you happen to live close to or in Detroit?[/quote]I live about a 1000 feet from the western Detroit border.

969

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
By the way Tirib, it says you live in Michigan, do you happen to live close to or in Detroit?[/quote]I live about a 1000 feet from the western Detroit border.
[/quote]

Is that close to the Ambassador bridge?

970

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
<<< You still don’t get it. I posted the scripture for you, I think Pat was referring to Hebrews, not Romans for the CCC referenced.[/quote]Well we’re getting closer. One of us certainly doesn’t get it. He was referring to a horrific perversion of Romans 2 where Paul says the gentiles are a law unto themselves. I have a very good memory. That passage, along with many others, far far from saying that the ignorant lost are their own righteous standard is in reality teaching the very reason why they are in fact lost. But you’d have to get your mind free from the bondage of Rome for something so unavoidable to become clear.

Look, somebody’s answering my prayers. I don’t even mean please save my house and give me a car, both of which have been done. I’ll bring here what we talked about in our PM’s.

I mean when I lock myself in and cry out that he make me more like Him. That he give me a love and passion for all that He is and all that He desires for me. That He make me hurt for the lost and rejoice in His fellowship with me. That He preserve my purity in mind, body and speech in this wicked society, a huge one that I could never ever do on my own. That He make himself life to a long list of people I’d love to spend eternity praising Him with. I know His presence and I “hear” His voice.

Who is this? My imagination? A satanic delusion or the Lord of all creation? Why would God so richly commune with a man who despises His church bride? Must be either my imagination or a clever spiritual deception. So tell me guys. Wherein does my prayer life consist? If this really is God lavishing His magnificent love on me what possible motivation could I have for associating myself with that unholy empire? If it’s not, don’t you have a Christian duty to tell me? Or is the “one true most holy apostolic church” so pathetically impotent that it can’t even muster enough wisdom to so much as ATTEMPT to rescue a well meaning apostate either from himself or especially the devil?

Or am I just Ok because I say “Jesus” and try hard so God understands that I just don’t know what I’m saying when I declare the church He left us an instrument of evil and damnation?

971

[quote]forbes wrote:

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
By the way Tirib, it says you live in Michigan, do you happen to live close to or in Detroit?[/quote]I live about a 1000 feet from the western Detroit border.
[/quote]

Is that close to the Ambassador bridge?[/quote]The bridge is on the southern-ish eastern border with Canada on the river. The tunnel is a bit further north.

EDIT: so no =]

972

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
<<< You still don’t get it. I posted the scripture for you, I think Pat was referring to Hebrews, not Romans for the CCC referenced.[/quote]Well we’re getting closer. One of us certainly doesn’t get it. He was referring to a horrific perversion of Romans 2 where Paul says the gentiles are a law unto themselves. I have a very good memory. That passage, along with many others, far far from saying that the ignorant lost are their own righteous standard is in reality teaching the very reason why they are in fact lost. But you’d have to get your mind free from the bondage of Rome for something so unavoidable to become clear.
[/quotes]

‘The ignorant lost are their own righteous standard’ is not the reality of either teaching. These are not lost ignorants, these are ignorants that still proclaim the Word of God by following the will of God and desiring after their Lord’s heart.

You know something I noticed…you just keep making it about you. Make me like this, make me love, give me passion, desires me, make me hurt, with me, my purity, that I’d love, I know, I hear. What about others? This is why I could never understand the Protestant idea of “personal relationship” with Jesus. As Romans 9:3, says, “I wish that I myself were accursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh.”

Protestants, especially American protestants tend towards individualism in their Christianity, when if fact our duty is to save the world, or communities, not just us. That is mediocre, if all it took was becoming a hermit, I’m not sure it would be much of a challenge except for those most socially affixed. However, we’re not. We are responsible for each other’s salvation, as well as our own.

Yes, you are imagining things that are not there. Because you are ignorant, obvious from your fruits on talking points of the Church, about the Church bride.

Have no clue, God talks to Pagans all the time. Magis weren’t Jews, as well, there is stories of God speaking to Pagans. So, even though you’re not a pagan, he’ll still talk to you.

We do tell you all the time, so does the Catholic Church, you just don’t accept its God given authority. If you really do God’s will, don’t worry about it.

No, you’re not okay to just say “Jesus,” I’ve been telling you this forever. You have to do His will. I’m sure God will bring you back to His bride, sooner or later, as long as you follow His will.

973

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
<<< Yes, you are imagining things that are not there. Because you are ignorant, obvious from your fruits on talking points of the Church, about the Church bride. >>>[/quote]And closer still.

BTW, without holiness it is impossible to please God so yes I spend a good deal of time in His presence being renewed in his Spirit. Nothing else anybody does makes any difference while they live in surrender to sin. I promise you, as I have said many times, even concerning you, others get a lot of my attention. You’re just selective in what you want to see.

I give up trying to follow your “no salvation outside the church, but I’m saved with no communion with the pope, but it’s still through the church, but without communion apparently”. “God will judge individuals based on what He knows they would do if they did hear the gospel, but bless their hearts, it’s not their fault they haven’t heard”. “Some children of Adam will choose true godliness even while immersed in rank paganism, which is their way of truly seeking God”. It makes my skin crawl just typing crap like this.

Romans 3:9-18

[quote] 9-What then? Are we better than they? Not at all; for we have already charged that both Jews and Greeks are all under sin;

10-as it is written,
"THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE;

11-THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS,
THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD;

12-ALL HAVE TURNED ASIDE, TOGETHER THEY HAVE BECOME USELESS;
THERE IS NONE WHO DOES GOOD,
THERE IS NOT EVEN ONE."

13"THEIR THROAT IS AN OPEN GRAVE,
WITH THEIR TONGUES THEY KEEP DECEIVING,"
“THE POISON OF ASPS IS UNDER THEIR LIPS”;

14-“WHOSE MOUTH IS FULL OF CURSING AND BITTERNESS”;

15-"THEIR FEET ARE SWIFT TO SHED BLOOD,

16-DESTRUCTION AND MISERY ARE IN THEIR PATHS,

17-AND THE PATH OF PEACE THEY HAVE NOT KNOWN."

18-“THERE IS NO FEAR OF GOD BEFORE THEIR EYES.”[/quote]

974

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
<<< Yes, you are imagining things that are not there. Because you are ignorant, obvious from your fruits on talking points of the Church, about the Church bride. >>>[/quote]And closer still.

BTW, without holiness it is impossible to please God so yes I spend a good deal of time in His presence being renewed in his Spirit. Nothing else anybody does makes any difference while they live in surrender to sin. I promise you, as I have said many times, even concerning you, others get a lot of my attention. You’re just selective in what you want to see.
[/quote]

Holiness comes through doing God’s will. No, you just do the me, me, me thing. That is one thing about the Catholic Church, you’ll hardly hear someone say me in the mass. You got we, but no me.

I know I get attention.

If you want to be in the presence of the Lord, go to Adoration some time.

You sound like one of those Protestants that say, unless you are in my Church and hear and believe in my version of the Gospel, you’re not saved.

See you don’t get it, let me explain. No, God will not judge individuals based on what He knows they would do if they did hear the Gospel. He judges them on what they do, because THEY FOLLOW THE WILL OF GOD. Jesus said, there will be those that call “Lord, Lord,” but he will deny them. Only those that do the Father’s will, can have salvation.

Of course it makes your skin crawl, It make my skin crawl to if I was lying about the truths of His bride.

975

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
This “Re-formulated positively,” statement at 846 should be all the evidence anyone needs of the man made synthetic fabric of the impotent RCC. Anybody who thinks this was always what was meant by “Outside the Church there is no salvation” is willfully lying to themselves or an imbecile. Who does and doesn’t go to heaven and whether clearly unsaved pagans can be identified has changed.

Pat’s right, or so it appears. The RCC has declared the incomprehensibly holy God a hip n groovy dood who just accepts people doing the best they know how despite clear and unmistakable biblical evidence to the contrary. Wadda joke, and a bad one at that. How can anybody believe the Holy One of Israel could have anything to do with this feel good psychobabble.

But wait, we have not yet been treated to Chris’s response which will surely dig up some long convoluted explanation that contradicts all this, but not really. You just need to achieve a “higher understanding” provided in a load of ritual and religion and it’s all good.

OR, OR, OR, you can just accept the simple statements of scripture, accessible to a child, that all are born dead and those and only those who believe with their heart and confess with their mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord will be saved and that a flagrantly sinful life and or fatally heretical gospel evince the absence of saving grace.

See that’s what Paul preached. That’s What Peter preached and James and John and Stephen and Barnabas and Timothy and Titus. It wasn’t until the 20th century that we learn from that satanic lie in Rome that actually all kinds of religious and well meaning people are in God’s saving favor because… it feels good? Even they didn’t always believe that. In fact for most of the church age the RCC did not teach this. It’s now “reformulated positively”.

That’s what will be paid for Pat. Millions and millions of wailing lost souls will eternally die with the knowledge that that Molech in the vatican lied to them.[/quote]

Thanks for proving my point. You utter ignorance and nonsensical ramblings about the RCC prove you know nothing about it. Second, you pass judgment on the practitioners of the faith simply based on hate not fact.
At the bottom of each page is scriptural references for everything discussed in the that section. Look it up. There is a reason that is in there, Paul said it in Romans.

I don’t mind discussing things, but they have to be actual things, not made up hate filled passions.
The church you loath was created by Christ himself. The New testament was created by the church you loath. The Bible cannon was assembled by the Church you hate.
It’s in the bible, look it up.

If I am going to hell for my faith, I’ll see you there bud. Simply confessing that Jesus is Lord is a foregone conclusion for us, if you don’t believe that already, there is no point in going to church. It’s not enough. You gotta act right too.

[/quote]

does a dance

The Gospel According to Mark says, “He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned” and in the Gospel According to John, Jesus concurs, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of the water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God”; however, Paul strengthens the point that, “without faith it is impossible to please him. For whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him” and let it be said that we must believe as St. Fulgentius points out on his sermon on the Faith 1, Faith makes a relationship with God possible. Faith is the foundation of everything and the beginning of human salvation. Apart from the faith, one can neither be numbered among the sons of God nor obtain the grace of justification. Without faith, every human effort is empty.

Protestants misuse the same lines to show that they don’t need the Church or the authority of the Church (which I contest that these Protestants that deny authority of the Church are denying the authority of man to think), that we show that if a pagan on a desolate island yet has faith in the one true God, and does His will, he can be saved.[/quote]

What part of the Church you think disagrees with the referred scripture? Again you are making false allegations. There is nothing about the church that disagrees with the scriptures…So guess what? Making shit up out of thin air doesn’t really count as an argument.

976

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
<<< Paul said it in Romans. >>>[/quote]No, Paul did not say it in Romans. Paul said the exact opposite in the 2nd of Romans, declaring a further exposition of his revelation of universal culpability (law unto themselves) from the 1st chapter. He is proclaiming the truth that every last single human since Adam is without excuse and equally damned in him in whom all died (1st Corinthians 15.) because God in His unquestionable justice has made it plain even to the deniers in this thread. I’ve quoted that passage in Romans 1 til I’m blue in the fingers.

In fact the whole book of Romans stands as a blaring indictment of that satanic, damnable doctrine of ignorance which is an abhorrent insult to the holiness and light of the most high God. I just gave you a clear example, like I have many times before, but that won’t stop you from jumping up and down and demanding that I stop running down the RCC and being hateful and come up with some proof. Why can you not see the crystal clear truths spelled out in the written Word of God Himself? Because you are just as dead as the atheists you argue with here.

This is just one way I know. Your profane abuse of the grace of the risen savior in telling universally recognized utter heretics and practicing Christ hating sodomites that God accepts them is unmistakable. You thereby display both your alienation from God and slap happy true hatred for those you lie to. You say I hate you? You lie. I say YOU hate THEM because you lead them to believe a lie that will cost them eternity if persisted in til the end. I care about them… and you. I won’t do that to them or you to make myself feel better in the name of some pagan god who is no god at all.

One thing I know for sure. We are not practicing the same gospel. We don’t even speak the same spiritual language. I would have much more respect for the RCC of old that actually had some testicles and would have gladly told me I was damned and burned me at the stake. You have no idea how nauseating it is to have you try n force filth and heresy down God’s throat by declaring clean that which He clearly condemns. If your church was actually Christ’s I should be on that list. As it is if she ever did bear any fragrance of the resurrection she has long since forfeited it and the scriptures she did indeed give us stand ironically as her loudest hostile witness.

All that said? One more time. There will be some catholics in heaven and folks from my church and every other good one in hell. You people just do not frickin get it which I expect, but it still frustrates me.

How did I get into this again? =[
[/quote]

Rom 2:12-24. Reread, preferable not a bastardized translation, like King James. The ESV reads:

“[God’s Judgment and the Law]
[12] For all who have sinned without the law will also perish without the law, and all who have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. [13] For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified. [14] For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. [15] They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them [16] on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus.
(Romans 2:12-16 ESV)”

I hate pasting scriptures…

Again making shit up out of thin air does not count as an argument. You can hate it, but if you want to discuss it, bring up real things, not made up stuff. We’re not that dumb and you continue to prove you rally out of complete ignorance and not fact.

And when did God make you his judge? I thought that was Jesus’s job. You know Catholics are going to hell? Tell me, then how many?

If I am going your going with me…

977

[quote]forbes wrote:
I just wanted to say something which I think is vital.

Jimmy cracked corn and I really DO care. Poor chap has no one supporting him. Oh wait, I mean:

I am a Protestant according to all theses “denominations” but I don’t like referring to myself as part of a denomination, but rather plain and simple, a follower of Christ. That means worshiping him, emulating him, and living the life he would be proud of. I don’t follow traditions as our Catholic brothers and sisters, but I see no harm in doing so. I believe that tradition can get in the way with salvation if it is done mindlessly, out of obligation or if its meant to take the place of Christ’s final sacrifice.

But I most definitely see merit as well. If one does these long held traditions with a pure heart, does them willingly and enjoyably, all in the purpose of serving our one and only God, then I believe it is a wise practice to do.

I think many a times we get caught up in semantics and miss the big picture. The big picture of course, is serving our Lord and Savior, Jesus the Christ.
[/quote]

First of all, Gang up? Have you seen how many anti-catholic threads there here? I’d say we’re quite the minority.

I have great respect for my protestant brothers and sisters. Most of my friends are protestants and we discuss and agree on most stuff. Not all, but the basics. Now the difference here is not only a lack of respect, but unwashed hatred based on completely false information is not acceptable to me. Thirdly, passing judgment on others based on falsehoods and supposed knowledge of scripture is just plain dumb. If you know scripture, you should know better than to think you know where folks will spend eternity. Save for a few examples, you should be able to even guess because it requires the intimate knowledge of someone’s heart.

I ask that if you have a gripe with the Church, at least let it actually be something that actually exists.

Also, protestants have ritualized some things that Catholics assume or just plain haven’t made a ritual out of. I think our cup is full when it comes to rituals. Do we believe in salvation through faith? You bet, if you don’t have faith your wasting your time in the church. Do we believe Jesus is the Lord and Savior? How many languages’ do you want that proclaimed in? It in our songs, it’s in the mass, it’s in the scriptures, it’s in almost everything we do, it’s carved in friggin’ stone in many churches. Do we believe in baptism? Yup. We do it at birth and affirm it latter in life. So I am not really sure what the problem is. To say we don’t believe in scripture, or any salvation through Christ is patently false and just plain dumb to sayâ?¦Like is said it’s written in stone.

If you have a respectful disagreement I am game, but at least let it be a real actual thing. That would be nice.

978

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
This “Re-formulated positively,” statement at 846 should be all the evidence anyone needs of the man made synthetic fabric of the impotent RCC. Anybody who thinks this was always what was meant by “Outside the Church there is no salvation” is willfully lying to themselves or an imbecile. Who does and doesn’t go to heaven and whether clearly unsaved pagans can be identified has changed.

Pat’s right, or so it appears. The RCC has declared the incomprehensibly holy God a hip n groovy dood who just accepts people doing the best they know how despite clear and unmistakable biblical evidence to the contrary. Wadda joke, and a bad one at that. How can anybody believe the Holy One of Israel could have anything to do with this feel good psychobabble.

But wait, we have not yet been treated to Chris’s response which will surely dig up some long convoluted explanation that contradicts all this, but not really. You just need to achieve a “higher understanding” provided in a load of ritual and religion and it’s all good.

OR, OR, OR, you can just accept the simple statements of scripture, accessible to a child, that all are born dead and those and only those who believe with their heart and confess with their mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord will be saved and that a flagrantly sinful life and or fatally heretical gospel evince the absence of saving grace.

See that’s what Paul preached. That’s What Peter preached and James and John and Stephen and Barnabas and Timothy and Titus. It wasn’t until the 20th century that we learn from that satanic lie in Rome that actually all kinds of religious and well meaning people are in God’s saving favor because… it feels good? Even they didn’t always believe that. In fact for most of the church age the RCC did not teach this. It’s now “reformulated positively”.

That’s what will be paid for Pat. Millions and millions of wailing lost souls will eternally die with the knowledge that that Molech in the vatican lied to them.[/quote]

Thanks for proving my point. You utter ignorance and nonsensical ramblings about the RCC prove you know nothing about it. Second, you pass judgment on the practitioners of the faith simply based on hate not fact.
At the bottom of each page is scriptural references for everything discussed in the that section. Look it up. There is a reason that is in there, Paul said it in Romans.

I don’t mind discussing things, but they have to be actual things, not made up hate filled passions.
The church you loath was created by Christ himself. The New testament was created by the church you loath. The Bible cannon was assembled by the Church you hate.
It’s in the bible, look it up.

If I am going to hell for my faith, I’ll see you there bud. Simply confessing that Jesus is Lord is a foregone conclusion for us, if you don’t believe that already, there is no point in going to church. It’s not enough. You gotta act right too.

[/quote]

does a dance

The Gospel According to Mark says, “He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned” and in the Gospel According to John, Jesus concurs, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of the water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God”; however, Paul strengthens the point that, “without faith it is impossible to please him. For whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him” and let it be said that we must believe as St. Fulgentius points out on his sermon on the Faith 1, Faith makes a relationship with God possible. Faith is the foundation of everything and the beginning of human salvation. Apart from the faith, one can neither be numbered among the sons of God nor obtain the grace of justification. Without faith, every human effort is empty.

Protestants misuse the same lines to show that they don’t need the Church or the authority of the Church (which I contest that these Protestants that deny authority of the Church are denying the authority of man to think), that we show that if a pagan on a desolate island yet has faith in the one true God, and does His will, he can be saved.[/quote]

What part of the Church you think disagrees with the referred scripture? Again you are making false allegations. There is nothing about the church that disagrees with the scriptures…So guess what? Making shit up out of thin air doesn’t really count as an argument.[/quote]

You talking to me or Tirib, because I don’t think I disagreed with you.

979

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
I just wanted to say something which I think is vital.

Jimmy cracked corn and I really DO care. Poor chap has no one supporting him. Oh wait, I mean:

I am a Protestant according to all theses “denominations” but I don’t like referring to myself as part of a denomination, but rather plain and simple, a follower of Christ. That means worshiping him, emulating him, and living the life he would be proud of. I don’t follow traditions as our Catholic brothers and sisters, but I see no harm in doing so. I believe that tradition can get in the way with salvation if it is done mindlessly, out of obligation or if its meant to take the place of Christ’s final sacrifice.

But I most definitely see merit as well. If one does these long held traditions with a pure heart, does them willingly and enjoyably, all in the purpose of serving our one and only God, then I believe it is a wise practice to do.

I think many a times we get caught up in semantics and miss the big picture. The big picture of course, is serving our Lord and Savior, Jesus the Christ.
[/quote]

First of all, Gang up? Have you seen how many anti-catholic threads there here? I’d say we’re quite the minority.

I have great respect for my protestant brothers and sisters. Most of my friends are protestants and we discuss and agree on most stuff. Not all, but the basics. Now the difference here is not only a lack of respect, but unwashed hatred based on completely false information is not acceptable to me. Thirdly, passing judgment on others based on falsehoods and supposed knowledge of scripture is just plain dumb. If you know scripture, you should know better than to think you know where folks will spend eternity. Save for a few examples, you should be able to even guess because it requires the intimate knowledge of someone’s heart.

I ask that if you have a gripe with the Church, at least let it actually be something that actually exists.

Also, protestants have ritualized some things that Catholics assume or just plain haven’t made a ritual out of. I think our cup is full when it comes to rituals. Do we believe in salvation through faith? You bet, if you don’t have faith your wasting your time in the church. Do we believe Jesus is the Lord and Savior? How many languages’ do you want that proclaimed in? It in our songs, it’s in the mass, it’s in the scriptures, it’s in almost everything we do, it’s carved in friggin’ stone in many churches. Do we believe in baptism? Yup. We do it at birth and affirm it latter in life. So I am not really sure what the problem is. To say we don’t believe in scripture, or any salvation through Christ is patently false and just plain dumb to sayâ?¦Like is said it’s written in stone.

If you have a respectful disagreement I am game, but at least let it be a real actual thing. That would be nice.
[/quote]

Woah…Woah…Woah…Woah

I never mentioned anything about ganging up. Please do not put any words in my mouth.

If you clearly read what I wrote, you would see that I consider you my brother and i have no disagreement. I was trying to reconcile the differences between protestant and catholic.

980

[quote]forbes wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
I just wanted to say something which I think is vital.

Jimmy cracked corn and I really DO care. Poor chap has no one supporting him. Oh wait, I mean:

I am a Protestant according to all theses “denominations” but I don’t like referring to myself as part of a denomination, but rather plain and simple, a follower of Christ. That means worshiping him, emulating him, and living the life he would be proud of. I don’t follow traditions as our Catholic brothers and sisters, but I see no harm in doing so. I believe that tradition can get in the way with salvation if it is done mindlessly, out of obligation or if its meant to take the place of Christ’s final sacrifice.

But I most definitely see merit as well. If one does these long held traditions with a pure heart, does them willingly and enjoyably, all in the purpose of serving our one and only God, then I believe it is a wise practice to do.

I think many a times we get caught up in semantics and miss the big picture. The big picture of course, is serving our Lord and Savior, Jesus the Christ.
[/quote]

First of all, Gang up? Have you seen how many anti-catholic threads there here? I’d say we’re quite the minority.

I have great respect for my protestant brothers and sisters. Most of my friends are protestants and we discuss and agree on most stuff. Not all, but the basics. Now the difference here is not only a lack of respect, but unwashed hatred based on completely false information is not acceptable to me. Thirdly, passing judgment on others based on falsehoods and supposed knowledge of scripture is just plain dumb. If you know scripture, you should know better than to think you know where folks will spend eternity. Save for a few examples, you should be able to even guess because it requires the intimate knowledge of someone’s heart.

I ask that if you have a gripe with the Church, at least let it actually be something that actually exists.

Also, protestants have ritualized some things that Catholics assume or just plain haven’t made a ritual out of. I think our cup is full when it comes to rituals. Do we believe in salvation through faith? You bet, if you don’t have faith your wasting your time in the church. Do we believe Jesus is the Lord and Savior? How many languages’ do you want that proclaimed in? It in our songs, it’s in the mass, it’s in the scriptures, it’s in almost everything we do, it’s carved in friggin’ stone in many churches. Do we believe in baptism? Yup. We do it at birth and affirm it latter in life. So I am not really sure what the problem is. To say we don’t believe in scripture, or any salvation through Christ is patently false and just plain dumb to sayÃ?¢?Ã?¦Like is said it’s written in stone.

If you have a respectful disagreement I am game, but at least let it be a real actual thing. That would be nice.
[/quote]

Woah…Woah…Woah…Woah

I never mentioned anything about ganging up. Please do not put any words in my mouth.

If you clearly read what I wrote, you would see that I consider you my brother and i have no disagreement. I was trying to reconcile the differences between protestant and catholic. [/quote]

I didn’t take it in offense. I took this “Poor chap has no one supporting him” to mean something like “gang up”, but inflection isn’t well translated in forums.
I agree reconciliation without feeling the need to change one another, or declaring one’s faith an abomination is the best option. I have learned a lot about my faith from protestants. It is my opinion that sharing each others understanding of faith helps both parties…

Yes, I got what you wrote and I agree. We can be unified in Christ with out being like each other…