never cheat yourself of the experience of smoking a great rum flavored cigar! - ooops /hijack
Hey guys, I’m sorry if I’ve come across as cold. That wasn’t my intention. We do differ quite a bit in our opinions on this type of matter…but I guess we still have other things in common like conviction 
I don’t like to sound as if I’m “lowering God down to a human level”. If you understood where we’re coming from, we believe that God wants us to draw close to Him, and to at least fully understand His word the bible (which is why it’s there for us). We don’t believe that God would require the “intellectuals” to “fabricate a theory” about Him being three persons in one.
Anyway, I think that I’m finished with this thread now and will just agree to disagree LOL. I do understand that there’s far more involved in having faith than head knowledge. I’ll finish with a scripture shall I?
1 Corinthians 13:1-7 (Contemporary English Version)
"What if I could speak all languages of humans and of angels? If I did not love others, I would be nothing more than a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. What if I could prophesy and understand all secrets and all knowledge? And what if I had faith that moved mountains? I would be nothing, unless I loved others. What if I gave away all that I owned and let myself be burned alive? I would gain nothing, unless I loved others.
Love is kind and patient, never jealous, boastful, proud, or rude. Love isn’t selfish or quick tempered. It doesn’t keep a record of wrongs that others do. Love rejoices in the truth, but not in evil. Love is always supportive, loyal, hopeful, and trusting."
I truly am sorry if I’ve offended anyone, and Tribs, I don’t mean to sound naive - I absolutely love learning about the universe and I’m awestruck at the thought of it all! I love to ponder over these things
Thanks for the input and dialogue - it is always good to re-examine our beliefs.
These discussions do get heated, and we all need time to cool off every one and awhile.
Hope you’ll still jump with comments though.
You didn’t offend anybody, at least I know for sure you didn’t offend me. That’s not the point. There’s also no need to apologize. That’s not the point either.
I may still chip in, although I have got a busy weekend and stuff. Main reason for my last comment is that I’d rather be peaceable with people than simply try to “win an argument”…and it’s gotten to the point where I realise that you all are just as convicted for your belief in the trinity as I am with my beliefs…so any further discussions would probably lead to “friction”. I’d rather leave on a positive note.
I understand that I haven’t offended anyone on a personal level, just maybe in a belief sense. I know how important it is for you guys to believe that Jesus is God. If it’s something that you’ve grown to accept for years (i.e. ever since your faith was in it’s “infancy”), even if I don’t believe in it; it’s something that has quite an emotional attachment to it as well (hence why conversations can get heated). I can relate to that because time and time again, people have made the accusation that Jehovah’s Witnesses are NOT Christian (simply because we don’t believe Jesus to be God)…and this does rile us up because we put so much emphasis on following Jesus. Can you imagine trying to explain the obvious, in an emotionally detached manner, that you ARE a Christian - when someone claims in no uncertain terms you’re not (based on their own opinion)? LOL That’s the kind of offence I was talking about.
Nobody’s angry or “heated” either my friend. However, some tension or heated discussion in itself is not necessarily unloving either.
God is not mocked. The entire history and existence of the WB&TS is an affront to His person and glory. I am warning you, as I am commanded to do, that He who sits at the right hand of the Father will not hold them guiltless who blaspheme His holy name.
Believe you me. This has nothing to do with my thinking I’m better or smarter or more receptive than you are. Quite the contrary. I WAS NOT looking to be saved when I was and I have done plenty to challenge the loving grace of God since.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
Nobody’s angry or “heated” either my friend. However, some tension or heated discussion in itself is not necessarily unloving either.
God is not mocked. The entire history and existence of the WB&TS is an affront to His person and glory. I am warning you, as I am commanded to do, that He who sits at the right hand of the Father will not hold them guiltless who blaspheme His holy name.
Believe you me. This has nothing to do with my thinking I’m better or smarter or more receptive than you are. Quite the contrary. I WAS NOT looking to be saved when I was and I have done plenty to challenge the loving grace of God since.
[/quote]
I don’t think you are being haughty, don’t worry. I would not have conversed with you if I thought that.
Although, obviously I do disagree with the WB+TS part (that’s a deep subject). Even if a person is following a course that HE thinks is right, there is still room for grace even if it was the wrong course. It is the blasphemy again the holy spirit that is the unforgivable sin (a different story completely); and to blaspheme against the holy spirit means to work against God’s power/“hand”. A typical example would be the Pharisees of Jesus day. Many of them, in their pride, schemed against Jesus EVEN THOUGH they had seen the powers he had (and thus demonstrated that he was God’s son)…THAT is what blasphemy against the holy spirit is - knowingly insulting/working against God and His will. Judas is the prime example - he knew Jesus was the son of God, and yet his greed for money was more important and he betrayed God’s son and lead him to his death.
I’m not sure if you’re suggesting I did, but I certainly wasn’t saying you have committed an unforgivable sin. Again, quite the contrar.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I’m not sure if you’re suggesting I did, but I certainly wasn’t saying you have committed an unforgivable sin. Again, quite the contrar.[/quote]
Let’s put it another way - do you think that as a Jehovah’s Witness I’m on the path to hell because of what I believe in? Do you have scriptural proof that Jehovah’s Witnesses are displeasing God?
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I’m not sure if you’re suggesting I did, but I certainly wasn’t saying you have committed an unforgivable sin. Again, quite the contrar.[/quote]
Let’s put it another way - do you think that as a Jehovah’s Witness I’m on the path to hell because of what I believe in? Do you have scriptural proof that Jehovah’s Witnesses are displeasing God?[/quote]
I believe that as a fallen man, like myself, a child of the first Adam, you are on the path to hell because of what you DON’T believe in. Being a JW or not is incidental and merely one manifestation of sin among many. The difference between you and I has nothing to do with you and I. The difference is Jesus. The eternally begotten Son of the Father.
This IS the Bible from Genesis to Revelation and I learned a long time ago that a scriptural fencing match will get me nowhere with JW’s as much as I love to do it. You are a walking dead man. Adam died and in him so did we all. I cannot argue you to life. Only the convicting resurrecting power and merciful love of the one true God who despite what you, I or anybody else believes, declares Himself to eternally exist as Father, Son and Holy Spirit can bring the dead unto life.
My job is to tell you. He is the one who accomplishes the impossible.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I’m not sure if you’re suggesting I did, but I certainly wasn’t saying you have committed an unforgivable sin. Again, quite the contrar.[/quote]
Let’s put it another way - do you think that as a Jehovah’s Witness I’m on the path to hell because of what I believe in? Do you have scriptural proof that Jehovah’s Witnesses are displeasing God?[/quote]
I believe that as a fallen man, like myself, a child of the first Adam, you are on the path to hell because of what you DON’T believe in. Being a JW or not is incidental and merely one manifestation of sin among many. The difference between you and I has nothing to do with you and I. The difference is Jesus. The eternally begotten Son of the Father.
This IS the Bible from Genesis to Revelation and I learned a long time ago that a scriptural fencing match will get me nowhere with JW’s as much as I love to do it. You are a walking dead man. Adam died and in him so did we all. I cannot argue you to life. Only the convicting resurrecting power and merciful love of the one true God who despite what you, I or anybody else believes, declares Himself to eternally exist as Father, Son and Holy Spirit can bring the dead unto life.
My job is to tell you. He is the one who accomplishes the impossible.[/quote]
That’s quite a long winded post for “we are all sinners and unless we put faith in Jesus we’re all dead”
I guess that my definition of hell, is slightly different to what you took it as. There are two types of hell (or three if you want to get technical) - one form is “Hades” (this means grave), example:
Acts 2:31
“He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in Hades (translated as hell in the KJV), neither his flesh did see corruption.”
http://biblos.com/acts/2-31.htm
http://strongsnumbers.com/greek/86.htm
And another form is “Gehennah”, which is an everlasting cutting off from God (or a physical, eternal, fiery torture, as some believe…not sure if that is you?). It is this Gehennah that I was talking about when referring to “hell”. Everybody has a chance of being saved from Hades, but not if they deserve Gehennah, example:
Luke 12:5
“But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell (Gehenna); yea, I say unto you, Fear him.”
http://biblos.com/luke/12-5.htm
http://strongsnumbers.com/greek/1067.htm
So what I was asking was, do you think that Jehovah’s Witnesses in their so called “blasphemy” and lack of faith in Jesus “as God” are heading towards “Gehennah”? (I’m not talking about Hades where EVERYone is heading for). If you don’t think this, then why the warning? If you do, then what actions of Jehovah’s Witnesses (other than imperfection/sin which is atoned for by Jesus) are displeasing to God and where is the scriptural evidence?
I don’t mean to sound “cocky”, I just think that if you are “taking on the role of prophet” and giving me/us stern warnings, then a good scriptural reason is in order…
IJM - I think Trib was pretty clear about what he believes and that it is disingenuous of you to try to change the subject to a new discussion of the differences in belief between Christianity and JW’s about our final destination. You asked him a direct question and he answered it, and as always instead of dealing with the question, you launch off into another issue and another discussion without finishing the one you started.
the reason for your actions? plain as day . . .
Everything with you guys is just a lead into another talking point. You seem incapable of just asking direct questions without some long convuluted setup. Just a hint - we can see the setup coming a mile away, so just ask the question you really want answered. Stop being rude to people who are actually trying to converse with you by asking questions without really caring about our answers except for your “talking point” setup.
We already know you don’t believe in a Christian concept of hell, just like you don’t believe in a Christian concept of the Deity of Christ.
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I’m not sure if you’re suggesting I did, but I certainly wasn’t saying you have committed an unforgivable sin. Again, quite the contrar.[/quote]
Let’s put it another way - do you think that as a Jehovah’s Witness I’m on the path to hell because of what I believe in? Do you have scriptural proof that Jehovah’s Witnesses are displeasing God?[/quote]
I don’t. Nor am I to judge whether you will go to hell or not. It’s not my place. I do highly disagree with the tenets of the JW’s and the origin of belief and the revision of scripture and history is highly suspect to me. That’s my problem. But I do not believe JW’s are bad people deserving of any kind of punishment. I believe anyone who truly loves God, and tries to be pleasing to him, will not be condemned. However, neither am I condemned because I do not believe as you do and I know that is what your church teach…That is wrong. I am not worm food just because I am not JW. I am not going to hell either because I am not Baptist, Church of Christ, Church of God, Pentecostal, Methodist, Universal, Jedi Knight, etcâ?¦…This type of retarded archaic thinking needs to stop. I consider myself a little bit of everything thought I am Catholic. I am Evangelical, I am Pentecostal, I am Eucharistic… I am not Jehovah’s Witness’ for that would call on me to deny the nature of God, that I will not do. But I do not condemn you for this belief, God is the judge and I believe what’s in your heart is more important than which Bible you thump.
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
<<< I don’t mean to sound “cocky”, I just think that if you are “taking on the role of prophet” and giving me/us stern warnings, then a good scriptural reason is in order…
[/quote]
I do not argue with men who are “dead in trespasses and sins” Eph. 2:1ff. Because “The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned.” Eph. 2:14.
I offer them life, in the name of Him who is life. This is not an intellectual exercise. It is a spiritual resurrection.
I’ll let ya in on a little secret. If I discern by the grace of God that somebody is seeking, I’ll spend all the time they need answering their questions. I have not the time, inclination nor commandment to engage in endless vain wranglings with people “wanting to be teachers of the Law, even though they do not understand either what they are saying or the matters about which they make confident assertions.” 1st Tim. 1:7
Hey, that sounds eerily similar to the watchtower policy which in it’s form happens in this case to be correct.
[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
IJM - I think Trib was pretty clear about what he believes and that it is disingenuous of you to try to change the subject to a new discussion of the differences in belief between Christianity and JW’s about our final destination. You asked him a direct question and he answered it, and as always instead of dealing with the question, you launch off into another issue and another discussion without finishing the one you started.
the reason for your actions? plain as day . . .
Everything with you guys is just a lead into another talking point. You seem incapable of just asking direct questions without some long convuluted setup. Just a hint - we can see the setup coming a mile away, so just ask the question you really want answered. Stop being rude to people who are actually trying to converse with you by asking questions without really caring about our answers except for your “talking point” setup.
We already know you don’t believe in a Christian concept of hell, just like you don’t believe in a Christian concept of the Deity of Christ.[/quote]
Where have you been? lol
No, I ask questions like my other ones because I want to know clearly what the other person is thinking without making assumptions…it’s not just a set up. I could just come straight out with what I was thinking, but I would probably go off on a tangent.
Sorry for going off topic btw
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I’m not sure if you’re suggesting I did, but I certainly wasn’t saying you have committed an unforgivable sin. Again, quite the contrar.[/quote]
Let’s put it another way - do you think that as a Jehovah’s Witness I’m on the path to hell because of what I believe in? Do you have scriptural proof that Jehovah’s Witnesses are displeasing God?[/quote]
I don’t. Nor am I to judge whether you will go to hell or not. It’s not my place. I do highly disagree with the tenets of the JW’s and the origin of belief and the revision of scripture and history is highly suspect to me. That’s my problem. But I do not believe JW’s are bad people deserving of any kind of punishment. I believe anyone who truly loves God, and tries to be pleasing to him, will not be condemned. However, neither am I condemned because I do not believe as you do and I know that is what your church teach…That is wrong. I am not worm food just because I am not JW. I am not going to hell either because I am not Baptist, Church of Christ, Church of God, Pentecostal, Methodist, Universal, Jedi Knight, etcâ?¦…This type of retarded archaic thinking needs to stop. I consider myself a little bit of everything thought I am Catholic. I am Evangelical, I am Pentecostal, I am Eucharistic… I am not Jehovah’s Witness’ for that would call on me to deny the nature of God, that I will not do. But I do not condemn you for this belief, God is the judge and I believe what’s in your heart is more important than which Bible you thump.[/quote]
Jehovah’s Witnesses aren’t the only Christian religion that don’t believe in the Trinity. I personally know Catholics, Baptist and Pentecostal that don’t believe in the Trinity and believe that Jesus is God’s son and not God. Not every Evangelical group believes in the Trinity either. So I guess you’re not part of the Catholics, Evangelical or Pentacostal who deny that Jesus is God?
I’m glad you don’t think we’re bad but unfortunately, according to the Bible there is only on faith or belief. Ephesians 4:5,6 states: “One lord, one faith, one baptisim.” I’ve realized many years ago that when you argue or debate with someone especially like we do in this type of forum, no one participating is going to agree. Hopefully the many interested people who read these threads can look at both sides and decide for themselves who’s beliefs are based on the Bible and who’s are not.
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I’m not sure if you’re suggesting I did, but I certainly wasn’t saying you have committed an unforgivable sin. Again, quite the contrar.[/quote]
Let’s put it another way - do you think that as a Jehovah’s Witness I’m on the path to hell because of what I believe in? Do you have scriptural proof that Jehovah’s Witnesses are displeasing God?[/quote]
I don’t. Nor am I to judge whether you will go to hell or not. It’s not my place. I do highly disagree with the tenets of the JW’s and the origin of belief and the revision of scripture and history is highly suspect to me. That’s my problem. But I do not believe JW’s are bad people deserving of any kind of punishment. I believe anyone who truly loves God, and tries to be pleasing to him, will not be condemned. However, neither am I condemned because I do not believe as you do and I know that is what your church teach…That is wrong. I am not worm food just because I am not JW. I am not going to hell either because I am not Baptist, Church of Christ, Church of God, Pentecostal, Methodist, Universal, Jedi Knight, etcâ?¦…This type of retarded archaic thinking needs to stop. I consider myself a little bit of everything thought I am Catholic. I am Evangelical, I am Pentecostal, I am Eucharistic… I am not Jehovah’s Witness’ for that would call on me to deny the nature of God, that I will not do. But I do not condemn you for this belief, God is the judge and I believe what’s in your heart is more important than which Bible you thump.[/quote]
I too believe that Jehovah God is the God who can read hearts, and wouldn’t be the type to make conclusions about a person based on what they’ve seen over the internet 
I believe the misconception that people often get of JWs is their “denunciation” against what the bible calls Babylon The Great (the symbolic term for false worship). But the matter of fact is that it’s the false worship as a whole that the bible condemns, and says will be destroyed, not necessarily the people that are in it who may have a good heart condition.
Being in either religion is not a safe guard in itself, the bible clearly shows that it’s what’s in the heart that matters most.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
<<< I don’t mean to sound “cocky”, I just think that if you are “taking on the role of prophet” and giving me/us stern warnings, then a good scriptural reason is in order…
[/quote]
I do not argue with men who are “dead in trespasses and sins” Eph. 2:1ff. Because “The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned.” Eph. 2:14.
I offer them life, in the name of Him who is life. This is not an intellectual exercise. It is a spiritual resurrection.
I’ll let ya in on a little secret. If I discern by the grace of God that somebody is seeking, I’ll spend all the time they need answering their questions. I have not the time, inclination nor commandment to engage in endless vain wranglings with people “wanting to be teachers of the Law, even though they do not understand either what they are saying or the matters about which they make confident assertions.” 1st Tim. 1:7
Hey, that sounds eerily similar to the watchtower policy which in it’s form happens in this case to be correct
[/quote]
See that’s what I’m talking about! You’ve shown what you really think. You think that I’m not a spiritually minded person, that I’m blatantly sinning, and my lifestyle is against God. Wow, how did you manage to discern all that about me from one internet discussion?
Would it be too difficult for you to comprehend that I fully understand from the heart, what that scripture is saying and fully agree with it? What I’ve experienced in my heart and the connection I feel with God is something I find hard to explain to people, because it’s so amazing and I don’t think most people not of the same mind would relate or understand (and even some would make fun). But no, because I disagree with you on SOME points and try to logically explain why, you just think that I’m all about secularism and this material world…
[quote]mse2us wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
I’m not sure if you’re suggesting I did, but I certainly wasn’t saying you have committed an unforgivable sin. Again, quite the contrar.[/quote]
Let’s put it another way - do you think that as a Jehovah’s Witness I’m on the path to hell because of what I believe in? Do you have scriptural proof that Jehovah’s Witnesses are displeasing God?[/quote]
I don’t. Nor am I to judge whether you will go to hell or not. It’s not my place. I do highly disagree with the tenets of the JW’s and the origin of belief and the revision of scripture and history is highly suspect to me. That’s my problem. But I do not believe JW’s are bad people deserving of any kind of punishment. I believe anyone who truly loves God, and tries to be pleasing to him, will not be condemned. However, neither am I condemned because I do not believe as you do and I know that is what your church teach…That is wrong. I am not worm food just because I am not JW. I am not going to hell either because I am not Baptist, Church of Christ, Church of God, Pentecostal, Methodist, Universal, Jedi Knight, etcÃ?¢?Ã?¦…This type of retarded archaic thinking needs to stop. I consider myself a little bit of everything thought I am Catholic. I am Evangelical, I am Pentecostal, I am Eucharistic… I am not Jehovah’s Witness’ for that would call on me to deny the nature of God, that I will not do. But I do not condemn you for this belief, God is the judge and I believe what’s in your heart is more important than which Bible you thump.[/quote]
Jehovah’s Witnesses aren’t the only Christian religion that don’t believe in the Trinity. I personally know Catholics, Baptist and Pentecostal that don’t believe in the Trinity and believe that Jesus is God’s son and not God. Not every Evangelical group believes in the Trinity either. So I guess you’re not part of the Catholics, Evangelical or Pentacostal who deny that Jesus is God?
I’m glad you don’t think we’re bad but unfortunately, according to the Bible there is only on faith or belief. Ephesians 4:5,6 states: “One lord, one faith, one baptisim.” I’ve realized many years ago that when you argue or debate with someone especially like we do in this type of forum, no one participating is going to agree. Hopefully the many interested people who read these threads can look at both sides and decide for themselves who’s beliefs are based on the Bible and who’s are not.[/quote]
Personally I do not know who you are talking to that are Catholic, Baptist and Pentecostal, but those three definitely teach and preach the trinity. If you are talking to Christmas and Easter attenders then I can see why they will listen to your side of the story. Otherwise if you actually talk to devote Christians they will never beleive what you preach. Denying the Deity of Christ makes a person lost in the lies that they preach. The leaders of a church will be judged harsher than the sheep that follow. By coming on this forum you and I become a leader for your way of thinking. We will be judged harsher if our faith is wrong from the Bible, and the teachings of the Apostles. Christians have ties to the apostles teachings. JWs do not. Might want to read up on the founding fathers of the chruch that Irish put out there for us. Read the whole book and do not listen to the WT on their excerpts taken out of context. These fathers are directly connected to the people that walked and talked with Jesus. Charles Taze Russell was not. Charles Taze Russell leaned on his own understanding of the Bible, not the understanding of Christ his Apostles and their disciples. Might want to think more about that.
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
<<< I don’t mean to sound “cocky”, I just think that if you are “taking on the role of prophet” and giving me/us stern warnings, then a good scriptural reason is in order…
[/quote]
I do not argue with men who are “dead in trespasses and sins” Eph. 2:1ff. Because “The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned.” Eph. 2:14.
I offer them life, in the name of Him who is life. This is not an intellectual exercise. It is a spiritual resurrection.
I’ll let ya in on a little secret. If I discern by the grace of God that somebody is seeking, I’ll spend all the time they need answering their questions. I have not the time, inclination nor commandment to engage in endless vain wranglings with people “wanting to be teachers of the Law, even though they do not understand either what they are saying or the matters about which they make confident assertions.” 1st Tim. 1:7
Hey, that sounds eerily similar to the watchtower policy which in it’s form happens in this case to be correct
[/quote]
See that’s what I’m talking about! You’ve shown what you really think. You think that I’m not a spiritually minded person, that I’m blatantly sinning, and my lifestyle is against God. Wow, how did you manage to discern all that about me from one internet discussion?
Would it be too difficult for you to comprehend that I fully understand from the heart, what that scripture is saying and fully agree with it? What I’ve experienced in my heart and the connection I feel with God is something I find hard to explain to people, because it’s so amazing and I don’t think most people not of the same mind would relate or understand (and even some would make fun). But no, because I disagree with you on SOME points and try to logically explain why, you just think that I’m all about secularism and this material world…[/quote]
How are you understanding the Bible through only your heart? Another item I do not see in all the JWs I have read on these threads is the leading of the Holy Spirit? It is always about you and the Bible. The Holy Spirit is the one that helps us discern the interpretation of the scripture. God leads us, and puts things on our heart through the Holy Spirit. I have not heard more from you guys about Jehovah’s Active Force, again I really like that name, then I might listen to you more, but it is always about you and your bible.
It just seems to me that the JWs are more interested in separating themselves from all Christian beliefs to the point of changing the names of things and the bible translations so you will not be associated with them, but then you come out and say you are a Christian. If you are a Christian our foundations would be the same. They are not the same so by calling yourself an apple even though you are an orange does not make you an apple. The Apostles creed is the foundation of Christianity. You guys miss most of what it says.
I believe in God, the Father almighty, creator of heaven and earth.
I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.
He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit and born of the Virgin Mary.
He suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried.
He descended into hell. On the third day he rose again.
He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit,
the holy catholic Church, the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and life everlasting.
Amen.
Jesus descended into hell, but you guys do not beleive in hell. He will come again to judge the living and the dead, who can come again but Jesus, but you guys only say that Jehovah will judge. We believe in the forgiveness of sins, and you guys say that your works is what helps in the continuation of this forgiveness. Life everlasting means that all people will live forever, the question is where, you guys believe we just turn to dust if we are not a JW. Christians beleive you are either in heaven or hell. There is not in between.
How can you call yourself a Christian and not beleive these things?