Training While Fasting

[quote]eengrms76 wrote:
skor wrote:
Off-top: Is there a single great intellectual thinker who had an impressive physique? I’ll the ones I can think of are non-impressive in any way.

Of course not. When one decides they are going to devote their lives to the pursuit of knowledge they give it 110%. There isn’t much room leftover for anything else. Just like anything- you can either do one thing exceptionally, or a lot of things half-assed. [/quote]

You have to decide what your goals are in life, and what is really important. Truly wise people I suspect would say that they do not want to impress others, even with their intellectual aptitude. Or they may say that no matter what attributes they may have, physical or mental, they are not impressive. Pride was once realized as a dangerous vice, and humility a great virtue.

I personally don’t think bodybuilding fits into a philosopher’s reality. Sports can more easily. In Greece there were many philosophers that promoted athletics. In Asia there have been wise men skilled in the martial arts.

Ask yourself if what you seek is to be impressive. If that is the case then you may not find what you seek in mental and spiritual avenues. Think of that old quote (and I may be butchering it) “Life is about learning how much we don’t know”. Humility is about realizing how impressive we are not. That gives birth to patience, which has been argued as the greatest virtue and perhaps father of the rest.

I don’t mean to lecture, and I hope it does not sound that way. These are things I ask myself too, and find myself drifting in and out of the lifting lifestyle.

Inrweating thread. I’ve been to several “holistic retreats” and been on different types of 3-5 day fasts (juice only, water only, etc). Personally, they’re not for me, I just love to eat too much. However, I think everyone should do a three day fast ONE TIME in their life-it does put you on a serious mind trip which often yields new insights into your life.

 I also don't like fasting because losing one ounce of hard earned muscle is against my religion. However, I tried a three day fast once with just three protein powder shakes a day, and yoga plus total body dumbell work. It was the closet thing I could find to a compromise of getting the good mental effects while losing minimal muscle. 

 I don't want to burst your bubble, but with all of the emphasis on T here, don't you think the stress the body perceives while fasting increases cortisol and shuts down T? I wouldn't be surprised if the muscle wasting while fasting is a combined effect from caloric deprivation and T decrease.

To answer the initial question, I would go for something like a grease-the-groove method, where you practice a few major movements at least 2-3 times a day, with heavy weight. Not much metabolic stimulus, but you should keep most if not all of your strength.

In effect, you are letting your body know that it does have to keep its muscle and strength for survival. I’d probably do 3 reps of a clean and press and nothing else a few times per day.

And to other posters about physical and mental pursuits:

I don’t think they are mutually exclusive. Your brain and gluteus medius, and VMO are all parts of your body. They can all be trained, sometimes together, sometimes not. Impressive stature and performance can be acheived in as little as 3 hours/week (for some, less). Does that not leave enough time to focus on studies/brain training?

Personally, I find them to be complimentary.

I am observing the month of Ramadan right now (as are other Muslims) and I work out about an hour before the sun goes down, then when sunset arrives, I can eat and drink again (for Ramadan, no food or beverages the whole day from sunrise to sunset).

I’m using Rippetoe’s Starting Strength to maintain strength without getting excessively worn out, and some slow paced walking on non-training days (to avoid getting too thirsty).

[quote]Dr.PowerClean wrote:
Inrweating thread. I’ve been to several “holistic retreats” and been on different types of 3-5 day fasts (juice only, water only, etc). Personally, they’re not for me, I just love to eat too much. However, I think everyone should do a three day fast ONE TIME in their life-it does put you on a serious mind trip which often yields new insights into your life.

 I also don't like fasting because losing one ounce of hard earned muscle is against my religion. However, I tried a three day fast once with just three protein powder shakes a day, and yoga plus total body dumbell work. It was the closet thing I could find to a compromise of getting the good mental effects while losing minimal muscle. 

 I don't want to burst your bubble, but with all of the emphasis on T here, don't you think the stress the body perceives while fasting increases cortisol and shuts down T? I wouldn't be surprised if the muscle wasting while fasting is a combined effect from caloric deprivation and T decrease.[/quote]

Hi Doc,

Actually I don’t think the part about T is true. Well at least not for the fasting style of Ramadan. I still don’t know the methods for Yom Kippur style fasting but if anything, partial fasting actually helps T, providing there is still exercise stimulus and adequate nutrition when not fasting.

I’m pretty sure there are studies showing training in a fasted state is productive - hormone wise.

[quote]humble wrote:
I’m pretty sure there are studies showing training in a fasted state is productive - hormone wise.
[/quote]

This article discusses the positive changes in inflammatory markers during Ramadan fasting: Inflammation and intermittent fasting - Protein Power

Look over at Art DeVany’s site:
www.arthurdevany.com
He promotes a Paleolithic type diet combined with intense weighttraining. He also recommends periodic short fasts.
You can also do a search here of an interview he gave to T-Nation.

I dont think a short-term fast of 3-5 days is going to be devastating to your physique. I would ditch the supplements…after all, if you are taking supplements it is similar to eating.

I occasionally do one days fasts and know how clear your mind gets in such situations.

You probably know that it is very important to break your fast properly. Break it with a light fruit or vegetable meal and build up from there.

Good luck!

Do the fast. Spiritual enlightenment priceless. I played college ball and went thru grueling summer workouts with the team. Not recommended but went thru summer workouts fasted. For three days had nothing to do with body did not care it was about my spirit. When the spirit is dead and without life so is the man even with lots of muscles.

Yo, I’m so glad to see this forum, I know I’m like hella late since the last post. But just in case anyone reads this. I have done 2 40 day fasts, and on my third. I generally do it once a year for spiritual, mental, emotional clarity, and physical cleansing.

Just some facts about fasting for folks cause it is crazy to do if you don’t understand it. I only do Juice fasting with Smart water (for electrolytes), BCAA suplements, some Psyllium (3 Tbsp/day), Flax seed oil (2 Tbspn/day) and if it gets very difficult I’ll eat 1/4 of a banana.

Water fasting is generally too difficult for 40+ days for the average person, unlike David Blaine most of us have jobs and family. I will try this one year, but I’m going to have to be in an environment where I have to no nothing except read.

Juice fasting is not starving, contrary to popular belief. Starving is when you don’t supply your body with the proper nutrients, as I.m sure we all already know.

Obese people are over weight and malnourished (starving their bodies of nutrients. Juice fasting on the other hand provides your body with an excess of vitamins and nutrients while simultaneously decreasing calories. Bad cells die off due to lack of calories and new better improved cells are reproduced. Hence the more efficient running body system, younger looking skin, and and overall more youthful apperance and health.

Some facts, I put together a fasting program for a friends, middle aged man with diabetes on insulin and medication who had swelling in his legs. He stuck with it only adding one meal of straight meat. In forty days he was off medication, lost 30 lbs, no more swelling in the legs, and no longer needed insulin. His Dr. asked him what he did, they considered him a miracle. He said his lili buddy gave him a recipe for making juice and he stuck with it.

I encourage all those High protein people to take at least a few days a months to juice fast. When I’m not fasting I utilize the Metabolic Diet (very hig pro, low carb). But at times you need to cleanse the system to let it function more efficiently.

Hope this helps, fasting is hard, but damn, the benefits not to mention the fat loss, are more than worth it.