[quote]pushharder wrote:
And he would be one of the first on this forum to cackle about it.
We sure see a lot of irony on this forum. I don’t know if it has something to do with the fact that many (some?) of us lift iron or not.[/quote]
Wrong again.
[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
No, but the most effective army in the world and enough nuclear weapons to blow the world up three times over should make sure that you are safe from any attempts to make you bow to Allah.
If it isnt, this is not a problem that can be solved with military means.
[/quote]
Why are you advocating nuking muslims? You apologists sure do have some warped ideas about how to deal with threats and issues. Is violence just your knee-jerk reaction to everything?[/quote]
Methinks you’re missing the point there fella.
Maybe you’re misrepresenting his point on purpose, I dunno.
But the fact that Americans are so afraid of this vague ‘Islamic threat’ is laughable. Orion is right. If THIS ‘issue’ causes so much distraction and fear in this country, our problems run deeper than we think.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
[quote]Makavali wrote:
[quote]pushharder wrote:
And he would be one of the first on this forum to cackle about it.
We sure see a lot of irony on this forum. I don’t know if it has something to do with the fact that many (some?) of us lift iron or not.[/quote]
Wrong again.[/quote]
You might be inclined to use the word “wrong” but to use the word “again” is simply unspeakably inaccurate and you should be flogged at the mainmast in front of the entire crew.[/quote]
Please leave me out of your sick fantasies.
[quote]thelifter wrote:
and no one gives a shit about how Americans live, or what liberties and whatnot they stand for. They simply want you guys to stop ripping apart the nations of fellow Muslims, and to go back and mind your own business. [/quote]
this
edit - i would have left out the part about ripping apart the nations of fellow muslims. The mind your own business is the important part.
[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
[quote]Makavali wrote:
When people say America brought 9/11 on themselves they are only half wrong. People like you are the other half to that equation. By confusing reality with fairy tales about ‘chosen people’ you made such conflict viable.[/quote]
Right . . . . sure . . . and all those centuries of muslim violence have been just a weird aberration . . .[/quote]
Certainly not, but we can’t pick sides and then fein shock when the other side attacks.
[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
[quote]Dustin wrote:
[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
When someone reads that book and then chooses to fly a plane into a building because of that book [/quote]
That is why I asked you in my previous post if you can understand what would motivate a Muslim to commit mass murder. It isn’t from a goddamn book.
I have nothing else to say to you on this matter.[/quote]
And there is the actually crux of your arguement. You divorce the philosophy from the act, separating the mindset from the anger and removing the history from the setting.
You have to agree that those who wage Jihad against the West believe in a fundamental take on Islam - this belief system commands attacks against any non-islamic entity and condones/promotes dying in your struggle against that entity, promising reward and honor for that sacrifice - it is the belief system which enables the action - the two are inseparable.
You honestly believe that it is only because of the actions of the west that any conflict exists between Islam and the West, while I have proved over and over again with facts that Islam has never needed the actions of the West to justify its continual war against Western Civilization.
You treat the current conflict between the two parties as something that exists in a vacuum, ie peaceful muslims minding their own business were invaded and assaulted out of the blue by an unprovoked Western world and thus any resultant action is entirely the fault of the West.
This is not the case at all - you cannot separate modern events from historical events. You cannot divorce a religion violently opposed to the existence of the West from any resultant attacks upon the West.
You actually believe that by removing itself fro the ME entirely, America would then be at peace with Islam for all of eternity. This would never be the case. Regardless of any action or inaction, involvement or non-involvement, at the end of the day, Islam demands that Western Civilization submit or be destroyed.
At the very most, our action have only provided a convenient modern rallying cry for a religion’s followers who were already hell-bent on war against us anyway.
You see only the last 20 years in isolation, I see the last 1400 as a continual whole.
You believe Islam is no threat to you personally, because you are anti-government, but Islam doens’t care - it will only want to know if you will submit or not.[/quote]
They’d probably have their hands full on the other side of the atlantic. We chose to meddle in the middle east, so we become the target. Pretty simple.
We have a choice. We can stay out of it and let them fight amongst themselves or we can enter the fray. Right or wrong, we’ve entered the fray and this is why they attack us. If we chose to stay out of it, I doubt we would high on their list of targets.
[quote]Chushin wrote:
[quote]EurekaBulldogLaw wrote:
[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
No, but the most effective army in the world and enough nuclear weapons to blow the world up three times over should make sure that you are safe from any attempts to make you bow to Allah.
If it isnt, this is not a problem that can be solved with military means.
[/quote]
Why are you advocating nuking muslims? You apologists sure do have some warped ideas about how to deal with threats and issues. Is violence just your knee-jerk reaction to everything?[/quote]
But the fact that Americans are so afraid of this vague ‘Islamic threat’ is laughable. Orion is right. If THIS ‘issue’ causes so much distraction and fear in this country, our problems run deeper than we think.[/quote]
Because how could a bunch of cave-dwelling goat herders from half-way around the world do any REAL damage, right?
Jeez, it’s not like they’ve the stated intention to procure weapons of mass-destruction, and the willingness to use them indiscriminately on civilians or something!!!
Yeah, right.
Just how many “dirty bombs” or how much chemical weaponry would cease to make this threat “laughable,” exactly?
Clearly SOMEBODY’S problem (denial) runs deeper than he thinks… [/quote]
We could cease to be a primary target and let the locals sort it out. Instead we chose to lead the charge and have become a primary target. Pretty simple.
[quote]gregron wrote:
Using that logic basically everything in the world would be imaginary. Thats a terrible arguing point.
.greg.[/quote]
No, our knowledge of certain objects can only imaginary – spontaneously formed in our imagination – but that does not mean the objects to which our imaginations refers are imaginary.
For example, all theoretical knowledge starts in our imagination as intuitions; however, we need to distinguish between that knowledge which can be backed up through either logic or observation and that which cannot.
To my mind, neither logic nor observation would help with understanding Muslims or for that matter Islam. These subjects are just way too abstract. In the end all we can be left with are a bunch of stereotypes that have no relevance.
[quote]kodiak82 wrote:
[quote]Makavali wrote:
[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
[quote]Makavali wrote:
When people say America brought 9/11 on themselves they are only half wrong. People like you are the other half to that equation. By confusing reality with fairy tales about ‘chosen people’ you made such conflict viable.[/quote]
Right . . . . sure . . . and all those centuries of muslim violence have been just a weird aberration . . .[/quote]
It’s a culmination of Christian and Islamic stupidity. Stop trying to paint yourselves as the martyrs here, the only reason you don’t execute for apostasy is because Christianity is politically hobbled.[/quote]
If it wasn’t you would be one of the first to go. [/quote]
435 posts to your name and not one of them worth reading.
[quote]Chushin wrote:
[quote]EurekaBulldogLaw wrote:
[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
No, but the most effective army in the world and enough nuclear weapons to blow the world up three times over should make sure that you are safe from any attempts to make you bow to Allah.
If it isnt, this is not a problem that can be solved with military means.
[/quote]
Why are you advocating nuking muslims? You apologists sure do have some warped ideas about how to deal with threats and issues. Is violence just your knee-jerk reaction to everything?[/quote]
But the fact that Americans are so afraid of this vague ‘Islamic threat’ is laughable. Orion is right. If THIS ‘issue’ causes so much distraction and fear in this country, our problems run deeper than we think.[/quote]
Because how could a bunch of cave-dwelling goat herders from half-way around the world do any REAL damage, right?
Jeez, it’s not like they’ve the stated intention to procure weapons of mass-destruction, and the willingness to use them indiscriminately on civilians or something!!!
Yeah, right.
Just how many “dirty bombs” or how much chemical weaponry would cease to make this threat “laughable,” exactly?
Clearly SOMEBODY’S problem (denial) runs deeper than he thinks… [/quote]
Who cares if they have “stated intention”? If they actually ‘procure’ said weapons, then let’s give a shit.
But I still think on some level that even if they did, it’d be just like North Korea in that yeah, they have nuclear technology, but they don’t want to use it because they know that would be the end of them. No more power. They can’t maintain Muslim nations if they’re all dead, can they?
I’m not sure what the reference to chemical weapons has to do with this, considering that (to my knowledge) chemical weapons have not been used in the United States by these scary Muslims.
And if I have a problem, I wouldn’t call it denial. I would call it not being afraid of everything I’m told to be afraid of. I would not call this group of radicals a threat to this country, the country with the most power on the globe, but maybe I just believe in it more than you do.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
Waiting until “then,” that is after “they procure the weapons” has worked before, right?[/quote]
And how did bombing them help?
Plus, the “weapon” they “procured” was something that they found in situ.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
[quote]EurekaBulldogLaw wrote:
Who cares if they have “stated intention”? If they actually ‘procure’ said weapons, then let’s give a shit…[/quote]
Good idea. Let’s wait until “then.” That usually works.
[New guy makes splendid splash into the roiling waters of PWI. Displays rare, highly tuned intellect][/quote]
Exactly, just like that huge preemptive war we had with the Soviet Union in order to save the world.
Wait a second…