Times Article "The Secret History of the Shadow Campaign That Saved the 2020 Election"

[Aragorn]

@Beyond_Beyond

The problem was they were proclaiming Biden a winner, before he was officially confirmed

Like they literally did for EVERY SINGLE presidential election in my life except for 2000. That’s normal. Repeat: normal. It is normal for media outlets to call the election before the official count is certified because that takes weeks.

And it takes weeks specifically because of security safeguards and such to avoid foul play.

Repeating: every single election in my lifetime except for 2000.

It’s not fishy or suspicious, it’s something standard we are all used to over here except when the big orange crybaby puts out false marketing.

@Beyond_Beyond

From the Times article, Trump said on Dec. 2. “Within days after the election, we witnessed an orchestrated effort to anoint the winner, even while many key states were still being counted.”

In a way, Trump was right

You’re quoting Trump, who’s been on the wrong side of EVERYTHING in this election and is a profligate liar. If anything the media held back for a LOT longer than they needed to out of a desire to not deal with the big orange crybaby’s tantrums. Naturally it didn’t work because he was never going to be quiet.

@Beyond_Beyond

Its part of a continuation of the admitted conspiracy

In your head maybe. There was no conspiracy to defraud the election. None. Zero. Nil. Zilch.

@Beyond_Beyond

The “pillow guy” did a long video in which he describes many large breaches of voter laws, with ineligible voter’s votes being counted, multiple votes from the same person, dead people voting, more people voting than were listed on the electoral roll. This is all information from the relevant official electoral authorities from the states in question.

Regardless of what a thorough investigation finds, Biden is POTUS. I can’t see that I can’t see that being invalidated even years down the track of his term if enough evidence in found and proven.

Are you serious?? Yeah, I want to take political and national security advice from a pillow maker .

And there there is NO EVIDENCE. NONE. He lost fair and square and his fragile man-child ego can’t take it so he throws a fit.

NO EVIDENCE.

There are always anomalies, but nothing that would ever qualify as the wide scale fraud Trump wishes. It’s all bullshit man.

[H_factor]

@Beyond_Beyond

The election is not done at least until the recounts in are finalised, Counting hadn’t even finished the night of the election, let alone the next day, and that didn’t include the recounts of disputed seats.

So is that a yes or no on the 2016 hissy fit when the media called it before counts were certified? Trump STILL hasn’t conceded. Should the media wait until he does?

@Beyond_Beyond

You need to at least know what someone is saying before you can dismiss it.

From what I’ve gathered off google it’s the exact same shit that we have discussed for forever on here and debunked numerous times. It’s the stuff already corrected, already thrown out by courts, the same allegations packaged in numerous previous videos and articles. I’ll ask again what makes this video so much more important than all of them? How does it diminish all the things far more qualified people have already discussed in regards to it. It’s not some moral high ground to sigh at yet another video claiming to have all this proof when it’s already all been said, all been tossed out, and told not an issue by far more qualified people than the my pillow man.

@Beyond_Beyond

We did have a huge thread and no you didn’t debunk shit, you just had a different opinion.

I think you need to go back and reread then. It may not have been you and it wasn’t just me it was others after the election pointing out that nonsense like zomg Michigan had all these votes go one way that’s impossible when it was corrected in minutes as human error. Or the beyond_beyond hilarious parts where Trumpers talked about the counts being off in certain counties in Michigan or Minnesota when those counties didn’t even exist in the state. The details I may confuse some on but the hilarity was real.

@Beyond_Beyond

Maybe your arguments have holes in them.

Perhaps. If you’ll go back I was consistently saying at the beginning that widespread election changing fraud if it existed is important. Someone asked me if I would admit Trump was President if it changed the results and I said absolutely. I predicted Trump would lose in the prediction thread but I never demanded he lose. What the Trumpers are doing is demanding Biden lose. They didn’t like the result and they won’t accept it because their narcissistic conman told them he could only lose if the election was fixed. Which of course wasn’t true and yet here we are.

@Beyond_Beyond

Conservatives seem to be able to live with the fact that other people have a different opinions to them.

This is not about conservatives liberals and opinions. Saying widespread voter fraud which shows Donald Trump won the election requires proof. Proof that hasn’t been shown despite numerous recounts, court cases, etc. That is not opinion that’s fact. Recounts and court cases did not go the way you wanted. You can be mad about that all day long but it changes nothing.

@Beyond_Beyond

I don’t know about you personally but your Democrat mates sure did bitch and whine about election interference when Trump won in 2016.

God we have done this shit before. The difference is you had intelligence communities saying Russia influenced the election. That’s the key difference you never want to look at. That’s why an investigation took place. Even Republicans were calling for this.

@Beyond_Beyond

Forgive me until I hear what the investigations on the 2020 election are when they are completed, before I make my judgement.

Since you haven’t taken the results of anything done so far maybe when you are finished you can move on? Considering courts, recounts, elections officials, CISA, the AG, etc are all coming to the same conclusion and god knows that isn’t enough. We have to figure out what pillow man thinks or something.

[Aragorn]

@H_factor

Were you throwing a fit from thousands of miles away when they said Trump won? Which I believe was the night of and she conceded the next day?

Yeah this is the definition of selective outrage, not to mention selective attention.

If he wants to be consistent he should have been shouting from the rooftops in 2016 that they couldn’t call the election because the counts hadn’t been made official yet.

@H_factor

Do I need to watch a two hour video to know that that’s horseshit?

Literally anything would be a better use of your time than that. Like say… Reading a book. Or writing a book. Or chess puzzles. Or… picking up knitting ffs.

[H_factor]

@Aragorn

There are always anomalies, but nothing that would ever qualify as the wide scale fraud Trump wishes. It’s all bullshit man.

As is the case with many conspiracy theories it simply defies logic. Like 9/11 being an inside job which would require tons of people to know about it and cover it up for years with no leaks. This is far more unlikely than the moon landing faked, 9/11, Sandy hook, whatever. The amount of people you would need to pull this off across different parts of the nation with different rules on how things are done? Come on. Dems can do that and they decide to lose house and senate races they are favored in? Right that makes sense.

What still doesn’t make sense is that all anyone talks about is looking into just the Presidential race. No Republicans who won in those states are saying “nope I can’t serve.” No Republican leaders are saying “yeah we don’t know if we won that Senate race.”

Republicans in November were largely happy with the vast majority of the results. They over performed expectations in the house and senate. President Trump was historically disliked and has some of the most consistent lowest approval ratings of any politician in history. He was President during a pandemic in which much of the country thought he was handling incredibly poorly.

I mean an incumbent losing is always surprising in a historical sense as it doesn’t happen a bunch but it does happen. The scenario for that to happen was present and Democrats happened to run the most likely person to win. The least “threatening” most mundane moderate person in their entire field. Biden didn’t need to appeal to progressives they hated Trump enough to show up. He just needed to perform better than HRC in some swing states that she narrowly lost.

HRC lost a narrow election electorally (in terms of number of votes in swing states that could have given her the W) and was an incredibly unpopular politician at the time. Democrats ran someone who wasn’t as unpopular and he performed well enough in those swing states to win. It’s really not rocket science or takes some type of holy hell how did this happen take. This isn’t Regan losing in 84 or Clinton in 96 type head scratching shit that no one could possibly have seen coming.

[Beyond_Beyond]

@Aragorn

ike they literally did for EVERY SINGLE presidential election in my life except for 2000. That’s normal. Repeat: normal. It is normal for media outlets to call the election before the official count is certified because that takes weeks.

And you don’t see a problem with that? MSM tries to make news. At best it puts its own spin on events. It doesn’t actually report news, they haven’t done that for a long time. They used to report news, then so the viewer could make up their own minds about events. Now they control the narrative and they tell you what to think, and in works on nearly 50% of the population.

2000 election they did indeed take the time to get a clear result. Most other elections, you could tell earlier that there was a clear cut winner, with little or no claims of voter fraud or interference, so the news wasn’t overplaying their hand by announcing the election, and anointed the winner.
These very same people who admitted to being part of the Time conspiracy to make sure Trump wouldn’t win, censored any debate about the issue and went ahead, saying Trump was making conspiracy theories, and dismissed even the possibility of it happening. They slandered a USPS worker that had made accusations about mail fraud, and lied and said they had recanted, when they hadn’t.

You go on to say

@Aragorn

And it takes weeks specifically because of security safeguards and such to avoid foul play.

Repeating: every single election in my lifetime except for 2000

Okay so where were the same security safeguards in 2020 to avoid such foulplay. They were okay in 2000, but not in 2020?

@Aragorn

You’re quoting Trump, who’s been on the wrong side of EVERYTHING in this election and is a profligate liar.

Wrong. Iactually quoted an article that quoted Trump. You missed the end part that wasn’t Trump speaking"In a way Trump was right" That provides a very different context. It actually agrees with Trump. They admit it in plain english, is there something wrong with your ability to read and comprehend?

@Aragorn

In your head maybe. There was no conspiracy to defraud the election. None. Zero. Nil. Zilch.

You might want to read some of my earlier posts. I’m saying their are plenty of questions that need to be answered for the sake of transparency.

@Aragorn

Are you serious?? Yeah, I want to take political and national security advice from a pillow maker

You’re conflating political advice, with someones concerns over potential election fraud.
Two very different things that don’t necessarily agree nor invalidate each other.
Like my criticism of others I doubt you have actually watched the video, let alone taken the time to view and muse upon the inconsistencies that have been brought up.

Just dismiss it and move on. I’m glad you’re not in a postion to give political or national security advice to anyone with any power.

Don’t bother waiting for the investigation of any claims, like was done for the 2016 democrats defeat. You are doing the same thing as MSM, pre empting the actual results of the investigation.

[H_factor]

@Aragorn

If he wants to be consistent he should have been shouting from the rooftops in 2016 that they couldn’t call the election because the counts hadn’t been made official yet.

If Trump had won and Biden lost all these “we’re just trying to make sure every vote was counted accurately” type people would be losing their shit if Dems were doing this.

They want something that swings the election to the person they wanted to win. Which is understandable to an extent, but at some point you just gotta move on when you’ve exhausted looking for it. But we are and can’t be at that point. You have a conman that is saying hey I won over and over and people that believe him. 20,000 investigations, recounts, an entire election do over, none of this would matter if it ended with Biden being president. It had a chance to end if Trump wasn’t a narcissist that cared about someone other than himself. But we knew he would do this he told people he would do this. I just didn’t think he would convince as many people as he apparently has.

He could tell them tomorrow he created the universe and if someone said that’s bullshit half of them would say prove he didn’t.

[H_factor]

@Beyond_Beyond

Don’t bother waiting for the investigation of any claims, like was done for the 2016 democrats defeat.

Hilary Clinton conceded the election the night of or the next day. No one waited on some investigation. I think in being so far away and only reading far right websites (because anything else is MSM) you don’t have much of a grasp on actual events as they happened. The investigation was into foreign interference in the 2016 election. That didn’t come from some pillow guy capital letters video saying PROOF!!! It came from intelligence agencies and wasn’t disputed. It had bipartisan support.

Clinton didn’t say “I won people are saying I won by a lot” or any type of foolish nonsense for months solid and challenge everything in court cases across the country. She lost an election and conceded.

@Beyond_Beyond

You are doing the same thing as MSM, pre empting the actual results of the investigation.

So you think Obama should have remained President until the investigation into foreign interference ended in 2019? I have to admit I don’t remember many far right websites or current Trump fans calling for that.

[Californiagrown]

@H_factor

I think in being so far away and only reading far right websites (because anything else is MSM) you don’t have much of a grasp on actual events

Pretty much.

[zecarlo]

@H_factor

The investigation was into foreign interference in the 2016 election.

People are generally simpletons and don’t understand the difference between claims of fraud and claims of interference.

[H_factor]

@zecarlo

don’t understand the difference between claims of fraud and claims of interference.

Damnit if only a wacky pillow man would make a video explaining the difference I would know

[treco]

I voted in the Presidential election 11 different times. It can be done.

[H_factor]

You’re dating yourself I’m at 5.!

[treco]

@H_factor

You’re dating yourself

Just like High school
ha

[chillain]

@Beyond_Beyond

I think its funny how in the 2016 the Dem’s cried foul of foreign interferrence, and election meddling. At least then there was a proper official investigation that took years to complete. It eventually found that there was no evidence.

Ok, so this is factually incorrect, as a ton of evidence of Russian interference (via multiple channels) was indeed uncovered. Furthermore, numerous instances of coordination between the highest levels (Don Jr, Kushner were just doing oPPo rEsEaRcH tho!) of the Trump campaign and Russian actors are facts-of-the-matter

Of course, we know that you actually meant to (continue to) parrot the 'nO CoLLuSiOn!" spin that then-AG Barr et al. used to immediately shape the post-report narrative… so at least work on your self-awareness game, while you (continue to) accuse others of regurgitating mainstream* agendas/propaganda

*make no mistake, US conservative media is absolutely mainstream, as I’ve clarified for you previously

@Beyond_Beyond

We all believe a senile old git, named Joe, was more popular than any other president ever.

You’ve reached the wrong conclusion here. In fact it was the unprecedented* dislike of the incumbent that got Biden elected. Feel free to blame our two-party system, fine. Can also blame the fact that Trump only ever acted like a leader for his voters/supporters (and not the entire nation), also fine

*…that an incumbent president can have a six-month run of 50-year-low unemployment levels and still never hit 50 percent in any major national poll suggests that he’s got not just a firm ceiling, but an unprecedentedly low one." [source: Trump's Ceiling Is Too Low for Him to Be Reelected]

@Beyond_Beyond

Conservatives seem to be able to live with the fact that other people have a different opinions to them. Liberals for all their talk about equality, fairness and tolerance, are full of shit . They can’t handle disagreement, you must obey them without question or you will be censored or cancelled. They are the most intolerant of all hypocrites.

I get your overall point re: the current lack of tolerance to dissent (and find it both troubling and threadworthy)

But it’s worth mentioning what conservatives and liberals are in fact united about right now… and it’s against the conspiracy/alternative reality folks like yourself. Look no further than the current faction of establishment Republicans that delivered an unprecedently bipartisan impeachment result, or going back further, just look at this (right-leaning) board to see how actual, principled conservatives have viewed the Trump effect on their party over these years, and indeed going forward

*popcorn emoji for the upcoming CPAC

[Beyond_Beyond]

@chillain

Ok, so this is factually incorrect, as a ton of evidence of Russian interference (via multiple channels) was indeed uncovered.

I partly agree with you on this, so I will clarify. There is no doubt foreign govt’s try to influence elections, especially both Russia and China, to name 2. Yes Don Jr etc, had meetings with people from Russia. Its quite possible, probable even that skullduggery was discussed. Whether there was evidence to be discovered,maybe(i would have been suspicious too, if I was pro democrat)? Apparently none damning enough to prove that foreign influence had an effect on the election was brought forth in the official investigation.

If there had been some damning evidence, despite my support for the Republicans, I would be for the proper legal processes to be followed. Whether that meant overturning the 2016 election or not, I would still be for it. No matter who wins, the process need to be transparent and accountable. It would be a complete shitstorm for America but you can’t knowingly let people get away with illegal interference of the process.

@chillain

You’ve reached the wrong conclusion here. In fact it was the unprecedented * dislike of the incumbent that got Biden elected. Feel free to blame our two-party system, fine. Can also blame the fact that Trump only ever acted like a leader for his voters/supporters (and not the entire nation), also fine

No doubt a lot of people did(and still do) dislike Trump, he is a polarizing figure in a time where division of the country is more than any time in recent history.
Its hard to tell the truth though. Trump had plenty of support from the general public too though. Massive support was demonstrated. Trump rallies had thousands of supporters. Biden /Harris rallies had bugger all supporters.
MSM pushed the dislike of Trump. They were clearly, and massively wrong in the 2016 election. They kept this up for 2020, and even intensified it, whilst silencing opposition voices. Were they right this time? You think they were. Its certainly possible, but its been a long time since I’ve accepted anything from MSM at face value, because they are biased and lie too often.

@chillain

Look no further than the current faction of establishment Republicans that delivered an unprecedently bipartisan impeachment result, or going back further, just look at this (right-leaning) board to see how actual, principled conservatives have viewed the Trump effect on their party over these years, and indeed going forward

On face value, maybe. That’s how MSM are showing it. To me it looks like a bunch of Republican career politicians and staffers shitting themselves with fear, being a toothless minority, facing threats of reprisal from bloodthirsty Democrats looking for revenge.
Its an act of submission. Please spare me, I never liked Trump, I won’t make any trouble.
For all his bluff and bullshit Mitch McConell against Trump, didn’t pull the trigger on him when it came time to vote guilty. He’s not united he’s just playing both sides to look after number one. It will probably bite him in the ass, next election? Maybe not though, voters of all persuasions seem to have short memories. Only time will tell.

[Beyond_Beyond]

@H_factor

You also seem to ignore what over 60 failed court cases?

That’s what MSM says. Here’s an article that disagrees, with their narrative. EXCLUSIVE: Here’s the Breakdown on the 80 Cases Related to the 2020 Presidential Election (thegatewaypundit.com)

When looking at the number of cases related to the 2020 Presidential election that were decided on merits, there were only 21 cases decided so far. Of these cases, President Trump won 14. The President won 14 of 21 cases decided on merits which is two-thirds of the cases.

What the media doesn’t tell you and omits from their reporting is their greatest lie.

The report as of February 4th, 2021 shows:

• There are 80 court cases to date based on the 2020 election
• In 28 cases President Trump was/is the plaintiff
• In 48 cases President Trump was/is not the plaintiff
• In 4 cases President Trump is the defendant
• 21 of these cases have been decided on merits
• Of the 21 cases decided on the merits, President Trump won 14 of them or two-thirds of the cases
• 25 cases remain active

[H_factor]

@Beyond_Beyond

Of the 21 cases decided on the merits, President Trump won 14 of them or two-thirds of the cases

Yawn. Let me slap this bullshit down for you. Lmao. Read how they are getting what they are “counting.” What’s crazy is you talk about people drinking MSM kool-aid or something but you only consume far right conspiracy sites and you NEVER think about if what you’re reading is completely full of shit.

Damn I wish you were in charge of scoring my high school football team games. Well they have uniforms on that counts as a touchdown. Trump had a lawyer. I’m counting that case as a favorable result!

He “won” all these court cases just like he won the election. Bigly!

Lmao. What’s weird is you talk about narrative and yet your far right websites all use the exact same shitty source here for their clickbait headline?

The Epoch Times’ headline gives the impression that Trump won several election-related lawsuits on their merits. But only one of the cases cited by the article was decided after Nov. 3, many were not exclusively about Trump, and some were not related to the general presidential election at all.

PolitiFact - Trump did not win two-thirds of election lawsuits ‘where merits...

[Beyond_Beyond]

Haha, you were the one that started this shit off, with “60” law suits from Trump going no where. You were happy to use them in favor of your argument.
The majority of those must have had nothing to do with election fraud either, so you’ve been quoting irrelevant bullshit straight from MSM. But like any leftist its okay when you do it. Give yourself a dozen uppercuts as you “slap this bullshiot down”
The original article I mentioned was referring to claims from Buzzfeed Trump Lost 59 Election Cases Before Electoral College Vote (buzzfeednews.com)

Apparently they too were fine to use the figures when they thought it helped their case against Trump.

[zecarlo]

@Beyond_Beyond

Trump rallies had thousands of supporters.

But you need million of votes to win an election.

@Beyond_Beyond

Biden /Harris rallies had bugger all supporters.

Because Covid, genius.

@Beyond_Beyond

its been a long time since I’ve accepted anything from MSM at face value, because they are biased and lie too often.

Good thing they aren’t counting the votes.

[H_factor]

@Beyond_Beyond

Haha, you were the one that started this shit off, with “60” law suits from Trump going no where. You were happy to use them in favor of your argument.
The majority of those must have had nothing to do with election fraud either, so you’ve been quoting irrelevant bullshit straight from MSM.

What are you talking about? I’m talking about the elections that team Trump had after he lost. He had no success in any of those really. And then you replied to that with hey here’s an article that said he’s been winning. Except upon examination most of those were done BEFORE the election and many had nothing to do with the Presidential election. Of course I “started” it off. I was showing that Trump tried numerous things to gain the votes needed to win the election. Except none of them worked. And you responded with an article that had nothing to do with that fact.

But you are right in the majority of Trump’s lawsuits had nothing to do with election fraud either. Because they couldn’t prove election fraud. It’s not irrelevant bullshit from the MSM. Team Trump challenged many things in court after the election. And he lost time and time again.

You might know that if you didn’t traffic in alternate reality news solely.