Because we’re into getting stuff done and accomplished and making ourselves and our lives better. We have a sense of urgency. In the end stuff gets done faster in te North and the living experience is overall better.
I have some crazy stories about the South if you would like me to explain, but I wouldn’t want you to have your pride hurt.
[quote]blck1jack wrote:
Because we’re into getting stuff done and accomplished and making ourselves and our lives better. We have a sense of urgency. In the end stuff gets done faster in te North and the living experience is overall better.
I have some crazy stories about the South if you would like me to explain, but I wouldn’t want you to have your pride hurt.[/quote]
You talk like the south is some third world country. And don’t equate the north with better living. That’s stupid.
[quote]blck1jack wrote:
Because we’re into getting stuff done and accomplished and making ourselves and our lives better. We have a sense of urgency. In the end stuff gets done faster in te North and the living experience is overall better.
I have some crazy stories about the South if you would like me to explain, but I wouldn’t want you to have your pride hurt.[/quote]
There is nothing a yankee can say that would hurt my pride other than - “I want to move down there and help out”.
You have a sense of urgency? TO what…get another ulcer? Take more blood pressure medicine?
Fuck that. Sit down. Sip some bourbon, and enjoy today.
[quote]rainjack wrote:
BluePfaltz wrote:
I want to see the south rise again, and I am willing this at any cost. Get everyone to agree “Hey, the southern states are in trouble” and you might have some momentum to work with.
Until then, good luck.
It’s changing. Poverty is no where near where it used to be. Industry is flocking to the area. Look at Atlanta in the last 20 years. Look at the Raleigh-Durham area. Dallas, Houston, and Austin can be included as well. Once Texas got off the oil tit - we have made some big strides. It is a process - not a gov’t program.
It will take continued hard work by the INDIVIDUAL - not a New Deal-like handout.
But you have way too much agricutlure in the region to ever be equal with the Norhteast. Price takers are just above beggars. And that is all agriculture is - a bunch of price takers.
And “equal” is a realtive term. Why in God’s name would any self respecting southerner want to be anything like a damn yankee?
[/quote]
Im aware of this economic change, and I agree it is defidently for the better.
I also want to clarify The New Deal was a pretty shitty deal for both ends, but though it doesnt happen like that in the US, “new deals” are happening all over the world, especially South America.
I dont know where you live, Rainjack, but you might know where Marshall is in Texas. I stayed there for a while and from what I gathered it seemed pretty backwards.
I’ll clarify. Oil machines were placed, obviously where there is oil. Instead of building around the industry, towns, roads, and schools were build through them. I remember seeing bumper stickers that said “My kid knows how to read! ”
I never once see those stickers up here in the north. Its ususally “My kid is an honor student at such and such…” or the like. Knowing how to read shouldnt be an accomplishemnt, it should be standard and mandatory. The main commerce of Industry were commercial trade and retail. Dollar Generals produced more revenue then most main shopping centers.
A two hour drive from where I stayed West would take me to Dallas/Ft. Worth, where it was far more industrious and nicer. Believe me, as strange as it sounds I enjoyed sitting on my porch with my remmington and a bottle of Jack, but after a while, the inferiority of it all got to me.
The south would be stronger if they diversified their economic structure. For example, form Unions and make them stronger, placing skilled workers and education for the unskilled as first priority assets. Create import incentives and healthcare standards for all working class people, and their families.
Reform the lower class structure to increase productivity incentive, reducing poverty liabaility and potentially reducing crime rates. Establish non-biased (or religious) social systems focused on education and society, like after school programs and adult schools.
This sounds like wishful thinking to me, and an abbhoration to most who read this. Especially the “who will pay for all this anyway?”. I actually will take the Republican’s side on this, if the southern states can get their governemnts to pay for it, you will have a great social and economic system. The south has the lowest home and mortgage rates in the country, food, and general expenses are less down south then up North.
If the south knew how to capitolize on it all responsibly, the north would be forced to bow down and esteem equally. Most southern states pride themselves in military, football, fried chicken, gun laws, and fox news. The working class allways seems to work and never able to expand. The north has something of a reganomic “upward mobility” (though not as the president said it would happen).
The south has it much harder, they seem to work for the sake of working, never really doing anything greater or moving forward. Northerns work, get money, and some who are smart, make more money, raise a few kids and a take care of a wife very comfortably.
Southern structures work to work, and live their need for glory through Football, or use the Military as a “join something greater then myself and where I come from” rationale. Crime is insticntive to the south, as prision overcrowding is a real problem occuring today. Its often better to commit a crime and go to jail then deal with the “free system” and all of its hypocricies and injustices. Im including the North as guilty in this too.
In short, the north’s vision of the south is just as distored as the south’s vision of the north. Northerners arent work crazy, we are just smarter with the work we do and capitolize on it. The south isnt dumber, they just dont recognize a problem to be a problem until its too late.
Northerners arent “godless and liberal” (F You Coulter), we are socialistic and independent in and of ourselves. The south isnt all redneck and bible thumping everywhere, its just the church is the south’s leading orginization for everything, political, social and integral to the economy. In southern states, the church is what the people live by, most by circumstance.
I really hope im not alone on all of this.
[quote]BigRagoo wrote:
blck1jack wrote:
Because we’re into getting stuff done and accomplished and making ourselves and our lives better. We have a sense of urgency. In the end stuff gets done faster in te North and the living experience is overall better.
I have some crazy stories about the South if you would like me to explain, but I wouldn’t want you to have your pride hurt.
You talk like the south is some third world country. And don’t equate the north with better living. That’s stupid.[/quote]
Let me remind everyone that Camden, NJ is the nations worst area in crime, as Compton, CA comes second. Us northerners arent all that privledged. In New Jersey, we could have so much industry, we would rival Detroit, MI.
Areas like Patterson, Newark, Camden, Pompton Plains area, or Mercer, Hunterdon, Ocean, and Morris counties were all once booming with industry, at one point had the highest living standards of the country too. The north knew, Work hard = play hard, live nice.
Not anymore. Ever since the Newark Labor Riots in the (70’s?) the North, from Pennsylvania (Pittsburg to Scranton), New York (Buffalo to White Plains), RI, MA, VA, MD, and DE experienced a crisis in political and economic shift, usually after reformation of monetary security.
The north never recovered. Should we return to the economic dominance we once had, that “trickle down effect” so trite to hear would be possible.
In this case, you would be wrong. However, the above isnt happening, so you are right.
Its sad, but true. The north (and south)could be better, but as of now, We are the Pot calling the Kettle Black.
lived in alabama for 33 years. here is what i have to offer about the south.
the disproportionate amount of working poor. people who could probably bring home just about the same amount ofmoney getting welfare and food stamps, but go to work each day making LESS than minimum wage. my mom and dad fit into that catogory.
the amoutn of racial segregation by choice. blacks and whites go t separte churces, schools, and universites.
ignorance of world events. i took a job for a brief amount of time suring the time the tsunami hit. i swear to god, at work, 90% of the people there did not know it even happened. if you are not talking about football, church, or nascar, there is NO CONVERSATION.
[quote]heavythrower wrote:
lived in alabama for 33 years. here is what i have to offer about the south.
the disproportionate amount of working poor. people who could probably bring home just about the same amount ofmoney getting welfare and food stamps, but go to work each day making LESS than minimum wage. my mom and dad fit into that catogory.
the amoutn of racial segregation by choice. blacks and whites go t separte churces, schools, and universites.
ignorance of world events. i took a job for a brief amount of time suring the time the tsunami hit. i swear to god, at work, 90% of the people there did not know it even happened. if you are not talking about football, church, or nascar, there is NO CONVERSATION.
[/quote]
There are parts of the South like that. Just as there are parts of the West and the East that are like that as well. Maybe not football church and nascar - but youwould have to admit that no matter where you live - ignorance is right over your left shoulder.
The low wages is a hold over from the old agriculture based economies. It is not that way everywhere in the south - but I would agree that it has a higher occurance rate in this region than say the heavily unionized northeast.
The south will never go union in full force. It goes against our nature. As a result - we will have a lower wage than the east. That does not equate to a lower standard of living - as that is completely subjective.
I am totally happy living in my little town. The doors stay unlocked - I don’t even know where my house key is. My pickup has not had the key taken out of its ignition since 1996. My kids are safer here than just about anywhere else, and I don’t really have to worry about what they are doing, or where they are on a Friday night as there is a town full of parents that will tell you what the kids are doing usually before they even do it.
I don;t know how much that is worth to some, but for me and my family - you can’t put a price on it.
[quote]BluePfaltz wrote:
The south would be stronger if they diversified their economic structure. For example, form Unions and make them stronger, placing skilled workers and education for the unskilled as first priority assets. Create import incentives and healthcare standards for all working class people, and their families.
[/quote]
You have NO room to criticize anyone’s education if your posts here reflect your abilities.
This is the absolute worst advice I’ve ever read. Form unions and make them stronger to improve our economy? I don’t know this for a fact, but I’m pretty sure that if you look into it you’ll find that in the last 20 years nearly 90% of autoplants opened up in America have been in the South (without unions). There’s a reason for that.
[quote]
Reform the lower class structure to increase productivity incentive…[/quote]
With unions?
I grew up in Oklahoma, lived in NYC the last 2 years.
Any place in Oklahoma/Texas is better than than the northeast. The northeast is one big dump.
[quote]rainjack wrote:
There is nothing a yankee can say that would hurt my pride other than - “I want to move down there and help out”.
You have a sense of urgency? TO what…get another ulcer? Take more blood pressure medicine?
Fuck that. Sit down. Sip some bourbon, and enjoy today. [/quote]
Haha. As much as we disagree, sometimes I really like you.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
There is nothing a yankee can say that would hurt my pride other than - “I want to move down there and help out”.
You have a sense of urgency? TO what…get another ulcer? Take more blood pressure medicine?
Fuck that. Sit down. Sip some bourbon, and enjoy today.
Haha. As much as we disagree, sometimes I really like you.[/quote]
Since I found out he watches Letterman, I somehow lost the ability to dislike him either…
He’s what we usually call around here a “Strip Club Republican”.
You just gotta love’em.
[quote]OKLAHOMA STATE wrote:
I grew up in Oklahoma, lived in NYC the last 2 years.
Any place in Oklahoma/Texas is better than than the northeast. The northeast is one big dump.[/quote]
That’s what we all say about Oklahoma.
[quote]rainjack wrote:
The low wages is a hold over from the old agriculture based economies. It is not that way everywhere in the south - but I would agree that it has a higher occurance rate in this region than say the heavily unionized northeast.
The south will never go union in full force. It goes against our nature. As a result - we will have a lower wage than the east. That does not equate to a lower standard of living - as that is completely subjective.
[/quote]
We make more money up here, but it costs a ridiculous amount to live here. When you’re paying 10,000 in property taxes, you better be making $100,000 a year.
[quote]doogie wrote:
BluePfaltz wrote:
The south would be stronger if they diversified their economic structure. For example, form Unions and make them stronger, placing skilled workers and education for the unskilled as first priority assets. Create import incentives and healthcare standards for all working class people, and their families.
You have NO room to criticize anyone’s education if your posts here reflect your abilities.
This is the absolute worst advice I’ve ever read. Form unions and make them stronger to improve our economy? I don’t know this for a fact, but I’m pretty sure that if you look into it you’ll find that in the last 20 years nearly 90% of autoplants opened up in America have been in the South (without unions). There’s a reason for that.
Reform the lower class structure to increase productivity incentive…
With unions?
[/quote]
I am only speaking from what I observed, if you or anyone else is offended by a well known fact, thats your (south’s) problem, not mine.
The reason I support unions is because of the Republican capitalistic ideal of competetion and reform. When a union has leverage to support a moderate number of people for work, education becomes necessary, and room for growth of the trade, economy, and social classes increases. Non-union companies would raise the standards individually to promote stronger workforce incentive. This kind of idle compromise would fullfill everything I said above, creating job opportunities, diversifying commerce and workforce strength and essentially liberalizing economic possibilities with healthcare, housing, and school education. In other words, it would more likely suite more people to move down south for greater opportunity.
Ill give you an example why I say what I do. I used to work for an Independent Electrical Contractor in Florida last year. I was brand new to the trade and after going to the “One Stop Career Center” (Unemployment office) The company I was reffered to claimed they would start me from scratch and train me as an Apprentice electrician through their school district. I thought that was a novel idea. I was on the job for maybe three months when after the big project I worked on was nearly finished, the company “let me go”. I was a bit confused, I knew I am expendable and simply hired help, but they’re paying for my healthcare and for me to learn to get better in my trade. I questioned to myself why spend the money and time on me when I am only doing basic menial work? I found out the $800 in apprentice fees to the school, and $250 in healthcare for me was nothing compared to the tax write off they would not have saved had they not hired me. I thought I was getting a good deal, and for once in my life I thought how great and promising the southern economy looked. I wandered looking for work for about two weeks before I became infuriated with the Florida work system and left back for New Jersey.
Maybe my experience soured how I feel about the southern workforce, maybe I dont have a right to feel the way I do. I do have a right to say the Northern workforce and economy is although harsh, also rewarding.