As anyone can clearly see by my previous post that I knew what this study was about. They have clinical trials ongoing and have treated people with various diseases and injuries already. Check out the video testimonies of the people they have treated. Unless you assert they are just paid actors.
So if the study is horribly designed, why don’t you offer your expertise?
I don’t assert that anyone is a paid actor.
However, I have asked you to provide a published paper of a clinical trial showing that this treatment was used effectively in humans, and that it is more effective than other therapies.
You have not done this. You provided a basic-science paper which Aragorn broke down in detail. And he didn’t say that it was horribly designed, actually he was fairly complimentary - you’re just too fucking dense to understand what he wrote.
That was a “basic science” paper, the sort of thing that’s the first or second step on the way to developing a treatment, but it’s a far cry from proving that the treatment is biologically active and effective in humans.
Again: show me a paper that demonstrates this treatment has been proven effective in humans for the purpose of clinical outcomes (quality of life, physical function, pain reduction, mortality…)
I have no dog in this fight - if you can provide a reference that does this, I will happily say so. I have nothing against stem cells - I only have a problem with misinformation, the sort of BS you are spouting off here that the US is lagging behind in stem-cell research.
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I’m only suggesting the U.S. is lagging behind in application. And I suspect there is a reason for this.
I’m not sure you did. ActivitiesGuy asked for a study that showed “superior results and no side effects” in humans to evaluate them. Not only did you not give him that, but in vitro study specifically mentions several side effects for stem cells as currently used. Nobody is claiming the doctors are paid actors. You’re moving the goalposts again. That was never the crux of any argument.
Did you even fucking read what I wrote???
Clearly the fuck not. I clearly said it was NOT a junk study, and I clearly made zero mention or even implication that it was a bad study. In fact I even gave props to it saying “one nice touch of this is that 2 independent laboratories were involved to double check results with different loactions, as well as 4 separate batches”.
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No kidding. They also breakdown challenges with stem cells. In fact the first quote I gave was from a paper they cite, that talks specifically about the current lack of evidence in stroke victims as well as difficulties in risk assessment.
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It’s really aggravating–you and I both are on the stem cell bandwagon in terms of its potential benefits, we just don’t like BS and borderline conspiracy theories (the FDA is locking down stem cell research because blah blah blah). That’s really all this thread is about, not how lame stem cells are.
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And I quote.@Aragorn likely can comment more directly on the actual quality of the study since this is nearer his area of expertise, but to my eyes this looks kinda like a junk paper (Figure 5 is laughably stupid, for one point).So even though you may have not said #3 was horribly designed. You did mention the above as I directly copy and pated your statement. So again if your such an expert why don’t you lend your expertise?
While I do not contend the U.S. is behind in it’s “studies” one has to wonder why there is no application. Why do people from this country have to go elsewhere in the world to have this procedure? As stated before Peyton Manning was looking at a possible retirement but had stem cell therapy and came back in 2012 with one of his best seasons. Not to mention all the video testimonials from people who have had the treatment done for there various problems. And what are the side effects of stem cells compared to the various drugs sold by Big Pharma? It seems that every other commercial is about pharmaceuticals, followed by law firms looking for potential clients to sue over issues caused by said drugs.
Nooo, you didn’t. That was AG telling you this: “Aragorn likely can comment more directly on the actual quality of the study since this is nearer his area of expertise, but to my eyes this looks kinda like a junk paper (Figure 5 is laughably stupid, for one point).” Thats a direct quote from his bloody post, not mine.
And I didn’t offer my expertise because I have a job already. Why the everloving hell would I offer my expertise on top of a full work schedule, to effectively double my workload? Lets see you offer to work 90 hours a week. Let alone only be paid for 50. That’s fucking stupid pn too many levels to list.
Seriously what the hell.
I already have a job in the biomedical field, doing research in a different area, and many other smart people are already working on stem-cell research. Your ignorance of how the medical research enterprise works does not change that fact.
You’re repeated nearly this exact passage in every post. It’s tired. We have taken it apart already.
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Sorry I got confused. The most stupid thing here is working 90 hours and only getting paid for 50.
You have not offered any legitimate answer as to why many people are having positive results with this therapy outside the U.S. And why it is not offered here. Saying more studies need to be done is not an answer.
If it is “not offered” here, that is likely because it is still being studied.
And, as explained earlier, it is still being studied because the USA requires meticulous research process to maximize the number of truly effective therapies that make it to market while minimizing the number of useless or harmful therapies that make it to markets
You keep citing video testimonials of people who claim to have experienced great results. The problem with that is not that the people could be paid actors - it’s that anecdotes are not the same as evidence of effectiveness. To know that a therapy works, it doesn’t require one person (or two people, or three people) who profess to have experienced good results - it requires some form of controlled study to confirm that the results are actually due to that therapy, and not some other variable.
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You suggested–or rather implied–that if I was such an expert then I should offer my help to this particular group of people. That would be the result–holding down 2 full time jobs and only getting paid for one of them. That is not a viable option and I am not particularly interested in doing something like that. Even if I got paid for the other 40+ hours I would not be interested in that workload.
It absolutely IS an answer, and a viable one. It’s just not one you like because it doesn’t fit your FDA conspiracy theory.
There are issues that need to be addressed. Period, end of story. Stem cells have remarkable potential but there are hundreds of things that need to be addressed.
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Tell that to the people who’ve experienced the results while the rest of the country has to sit around and suffer as we wait for more “studies” for confirmation. The citizens ought to have the choice to have this treatment done. The choice should not be impeded by excuses of more “studies” Meanwhile they have the choice to take the garbage remedies offered by Big Pharma so that money can be made off their unfortunate circumstances. Thankfully people that have more disposable income are leaving this country to have this treatment done instead of sitting around and deteriorating while the FDA protects markets for Big Pharma.
You are wrong again. More studies are not an excuse for the FDA to protect markets for Big Pharma. Wow conspiracy theories, a go to reaction meant to quell discussion and give cover to those who wish to take advantage of an issue. Plenty of people are being helped by traveling outside this country, instead of waiting around for more “studies” to be done. Isssues that need to be addressed doesn’t stop Big Pharma from releasing drugs on to the market that have a plethora of side effects and can cause death.