The Fatherhood Thread

I think 75% of our arguments are about dishwasher stacking. I’m not kidding. :grinning_face: Somehow when I’ve had a few weeks by myself over the years (eg, family went to visit relatives out of state when my vacation time didn’t align) everything works out fine.

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Unfounded Female anxiety is a hell of a thing, lol

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lol, the dishwasher stacking issue seems to be universal

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Checking in from the UK, the dishwasher going definitely reaches across the pond. My wife will actually stack large pans over little pans or bowls… How do you think that will wash!? I usually re-organise the dishwasher before it goes on.

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You’d think the dishwashers would better know how to properly load dishwashers. Alas, it just isn’t true.

Another item to the list that men are better at than women.

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Or maybe this exposes a fatal flaw in the theory that women are genetically programmed to wash our dishes.

On sammichez too. Face the facts- were better at that too. You want a dainty lady sammich to eat with an extended pinky?

No. You want a sandwich that has been built for function and sustenance. Heavy duty high performance kicking hungers ass sammich.

None of that pink girly sammich crap.

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We need to respect the OG.

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Dagwood knew.

Comparative advantage.

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If the wife stays home she should wash the dishes. The sandwich making, dishwashing notions came from a time when men worked, women stayed home, there was one family car and everything was a lengthy manual process.

The problem is that most people don’t live that way now, but many still expect the ideals. But they don’t want to revert to a 50’s quality of life to do it.

1,300 sq ft, 3 bedroom & 1-2 bath ranch style, a stripped down station wagon with zero features the man maintains and repairs himself for decades, a week of clothing with a Sunday best outfit and maybe a fancy pair of golf clubs for the effort that will be the life long set.

Can still be done. And the woman should clean dishes and send him off to work in his station wagon with a sandwich.

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Interestingly, the mid century modern lifestyles that we wouldn’t want to step back to were a tremendous step forward from the previous time.

Its interesting to look at those types of changes. It seems like as a society we’ve sacrificed satisfaction for convenience.

Now, everybody has a cell phone but they shut the ringer off.

My grand parents landed here in an old mine patch and were right in the Great Depression/WWII era wheelhouse. Everybody had fruit trees and gardens, and they’d have big canning/jarring parties among the neighborhoods.

Its not really the most convenient thing to grow and preserve a lot of your own foods, but they had really strong ties to each other and among families.

They built whole communities from scratch. My grandfather never watched baseball but he’d go to Pirates games every so often. He was one of many that built the 3 Rivers Stadium.

Tell me that wouldnt be nice! Walk around, watch a baseball game and enjoy the fruits of your labor.

I was on my way to PPG arena for something, and I hate the city in general. Does not jive with my rhythm at all. But me, wife & kiddo looked over and saw this:

And I felt a little more at home, cuz me & Vladimir worked our asses off on those, and its nice to see them in place as part of something bigger.

Our values have become completely deranged and it has very little to do with who makes the sandwiches.

It used to be that everybody worked hard and played hard. Now people work harder than everybody else and nobody deserves a damn thing (except them).

Everybody is fat but no one is satisfied.

People worked decades to build the computers and invent the languages that operate machines to do the work, and now people are worried about their jobs.

As a species, we’re retarded.

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I think k the 90’s were a sweet spot for analog/tech and the ensuing “close to the ground” hard work & automation. Digitizing and automating certain daily task processes was inarguably more efficient than prior methods. And for a few years it was awesome, people had more free time to pick tomatoes or whatever.

Then, with that free time, more “efficiency” led to more capacity and a simplification invention led to more work and responsibility with created free time. Checking emails and taking calls at home vs locking up an office for the day, more time to start more initiatives vs administrating a reduced “full time” work load et cetera. And we wound up busier and more stressed with efficiencies turned to more productivity vs more free time.

And this is the dystopia we live in.

But, it’s technically still possible to revert to an older way of living, people just don’t want to. For all the reminiscing, it’s just not an attractive way to live in practice, or people would be. Instead, they want to have their sandwiches and eat them too.

Interestingly, after a bumpy patch, AI may allow this. It’s an unknown specter right now and will no doubt rupture entire industries, but at some point it will probably be a repository to offload mundane to complex tasks while picking tomatoes and checking out old churches.

Figuring out money along the way will be the issue. What do we do when tens of rhousands of people start losing jobs but the world paradigm and economy hasn’t shifted yet? Jobs that will never come back.

And keep in mind nobody is safe. There is a misconception people who work with their hands will be fine, but AI is currently being trained to “see”, smell, feel etc cetera and interpret fluidly. It learns quickly.

Take a trained model and stick it in one of Elons new robots and everybody is fucked.

Or, we all have a servant that’s also a perfect options trader :man_raising_hand:

And we can stop and smell the flowers again. And we won’t have to worry about who is making sandwiches and washing dishes.

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I think something to consider when assessing society and its changes and challenges is that some people will thrive almost regardless of externals, assuming we’re not talking about the most tortured existence. Resilience - intelligence, optimism, flexibility, and capacity to form close relationships - makes happiness possible in nearly any setting.

Other people will be miserable in nearly every circumstance, because nothing is good enough.

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Yeah I think we look at history with white-washed nostalgia. There was certainly a sort of beauty of presence in an unplugged world but it would be very hard to unwind now. On a personal level. I do think there is merit is choosing which wave you want to be on top of, though. Even if you could make most of them work.

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It will further consolidate wealth.
It will no longer be the ruling class and the peasants (us), it will be the owning class.

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Yeah. This is why I say peoples values are completely deranged. They are anxious, isolated, depressed, atomized, detatched, and what ever else, but they don’t see the sense or value in building lasting ties within their families, communities, and humanity (faith/church) and so bereft of actual identity that they’re willing to take on identities that are superficial and meaningless.

Satisfying things that feed your body and soul are laughed at as quaint hobbies or silly beliefs.

Like the pizza I made with my son.

You can get a good pizza anywhere. You can even get a better tasting one if you’re lucky.

But you’re not going to get a pizza anywhere that passes along the life lessons that growing the herbs and veggies, stretching the dough yourself and baking it in your oven- creating the lifetime of memories that smell and taste like home- anywhere on earth, for any amount of money.

Satisfaction of a job well done vs. Convenience.

These are the choices we make as individuals that define and make tangible our values.

My kid is plenty smart, and will likely “learn to code”, but he’s also going to learn to weld.

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It certainly does seem like at some point there’s going to be a world where AI and robots are doing all the drudgery work, and maybe even all the “thinking” work

Like genuinely what do we do as a society when human labor is just not needed any more ? Can’t imagine it happening before I have to retire fully, but I do think it’s a possibility in my kids life time

100% automated cars are happening. My Tesla Y on Full Self Driving trial daddy Elon gave me was absolutely insane, like 95% of the way there

Something like 10% of the workforce is tied to trucking (the drivers, mechanics, diners and restaurants that feed them, gas stations) … and another huge chunk is based around human drivers in regular cars.

Pick a few of the other low hanging fruit jobs that are mostly menial labor and we could be looking at a 20-30% job robo-take over in the next 10-20 years . Gonna be interesting to watch how we all adapt to that

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it wont. AI isnt really Artificial Intelligence, its Deep Learning.
It does not handle exceptions well, and it cannot make judgement calls worth anything.

Lets say you’re driving a car and a kid walks in front of the car too short for you to stop.
The only other way you can go to avoid hitting this kid is to crash into the car next to you.
Easy choice for us; save the kid. Cars will likely be okay, so will passengers. Kid will die if you hit it.

What does the AI driver choose?
The only value it knows are numerical inputs.

They are consistently testing poorly in the category of imperfect decision making, and likely always will.

Easy. We’re already creating demand by deporting all the mexicans.

We’ll see low risk menial work taken over by AI, and the world will be better for it. We might even see an end to child labor.

All the important stuff that involves risk and critical decision making will be left to humans. Hopefully they’ll be competent ones, too.

Humans kill poeple in cars too. There’s gonna be some number where the difference becomes undeniable

Let’s say you run the numbers and humans driving causes 30,000 annual deaths but self driving cars only kill 9 people a year… or 90, or 900, or 9,000. When does it become silly to let humans keep driving?

We take away old people’s licenses when they can no longer safely operate a car, but compared to self driving cars that will be all of us when they get good enough.

Plus with stuff like trucking you’re doing 90% of the driving on freeways, which is primed for self driving and very few “kid or car” type scenarios. Have the truck drive itself 1,400 miles and have Joe blow pick it up at the shell station for the last mile delivery if driving in town is that much of a concern

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