I’m 42, been lifting for 5+ years consistently though have been in the gym on and off for my whole life. I’m 5’10, 190pds, excellent physical condition regarding BP/cholesterol, though have never gotten my full panel done.
I just recently ran a LGD 8 week cycle with no PCT.
I have Turinabol in 10mg tabs, Taurine, Tudca and Clomid for PCT.
I know I should do test but I am not currently in a position to inject, it just is what it is.
TBol 30mg ED along with Taurine for 8 weeks
Typical Clomid PCT
Its a total waste, and risk. You want to shut down your natural test production, gain a little bit of muscle, then hope your body bounces back to natural test levels (at your age it’s already tougher), and regardless of PCT, you won’t keep any of your gains. It just is what it is. So many guys stubbornly try it, gain water weight, put on a sliver of muscle, feel bigger, then it disappears.
Just flat out not worth it man. Not worth the risk for almost zero reward. Wait til you’re ready to inject, and do it the right way.
Why are you opposed (or not able to) inject?
5’10 and 190, depending on BF% is a decent start, no gripes there. Just silly to not use test.
Go get your labs drawn. You’re in your 40s, if your test is low, you can make a compelling argument with your wife, especially if a doctor is backing you.
To be honest, personally never done an oral only cycle, however I dont actually see why most people oppose them so much?
All AAS are derived from Test or its metobolites, some are more effective than test at putting on muscle (higher anabolic ratings), so in theory why would lean muscle gained from a dry oral cycle be any harder to keep than a test cycle?
Once the entry route (injection or oral) is out of the way, the active drug in the body would do the same thing.
Would everyone still oppose a Dbol or tbol cycle if it was injectable? I would think perhaps not.
My understanding is that “normal” levels of testosterone are fundamental in building and in this situation maintaining muscle. Which I believe is generally why guys with low testosterone have trouble doing so.
There is also the whole argument of shutting down natural testosterone will also shut down most of your estrogen production which can then lead to all the negative side effects of low testosterone and low estrogen. In my personal situation this would also lead to extreme joint discomfort.
I dont think building muscle on a oral only cycle is out of the question but I think maintaining it could be difficult. I would be more open minded to a oral only cycle that involves a wet oral that converts then I would to using a dry oral. Or a injectable cycle with no testosterone if a wet compound is used.
This is simply my understanding of the no oral only cycle theory. Iv also never ran one and I probably won’t because iv found what works well for me. I don’t think there is anything wrong with people experimenting and trying new things tho that’s how we learn and increase knowledge in the aas community. But I dont think I’d reccomend someone who is just starting aas use to try it.
I think the other issue is how much harsher orals can be. To get a bunch out of just an oral, I would think a higher dosage and longer duration would be needed.
Orals seem to be a “boost”, not the main ingredient.
I agree that without some aromatisation, low E sides could surface. Having said that, towards the end of my cut I was on Tren and Mast only (last test prop shot being 4 weeks prior), I had no issues with low E, and I am someone who suffers from low E sides from minute doses of Adex. @zeek1414
Maybe if I kept the tren and mast going I may run into some issues but then again, just like orals, I wouldn’t run that cycle longer than 4-6 weeks.
Testosterone does not have to be present in any way to build muscle, to maintain it however you do need your own androgenic hormones back or some form of AAS (whatever you may be using for TRT, test, primo, eq, nand etc).
@aaronca Although liver toxicity seems to be overestimated, this is one point where injectables would pose a benefit. However, even injectables affect liver and kidney values. Orals do not need to be run at very high doses to see results, think 50mg Dbol or Tbol or Var per day, thats 350mg of AAS a week and I’ve had great success on those doses.
Just a different train of thought here since I’ve had similar, if not better success with cycles devoid of test.
Have you had great success at those doses while running nothing else? And how long did you run them for?
I’ve had a few buddies over the years run oral only, put on 12-18lbs typically, and then lost it all. So I’ve always just gone with what I’ve seen, plus heard regarding the matter, and seemed pretty evident that it was true.
Sounds like maybe there’s some ways to make it work though?
No i keep the needles hidden in a storage box and the gear i put in a shoe box that has important personal files in it. I mean its up to you on where you at in your marriage and how you can schedule these things. On days she is off i just pin at the gym.
I’ve spent some time thinking about this and how someone could work around the constraints of a cycle without testosterone.
I think if I were advising someone (and of course none of this is advice, it’s merely me batting ideas around) I would say low dose dbol with mid dose something dry (tbol or anavar spring to mind, but Winstrol would be fine too) could work for a certain amount of time.
Dbol will still give you some e2, which would be otherwise lacking if your natural test is shut down. It’s close enough to testosterone in how it works and makes you feel (and aromatises) that you could probably use it as a base in low doses. Anavar is already pretty mild, so eight weeks of it at 50mg with 10mg of dbol could be good enough for someone who’s unable to inject. Again, not ideal and not recommended, but theoretically would work.
That being said I wouldn’t do this myself. But…if I couldn’t inject test maybe I would? Food for thought.
When your wife catches you do you have that conversation all planned out? Because you probably should. She’s going to ask you “if you kept this a secret what other secrets do you have?”. Just be prepared. Because she’ll catch you eventually. They always do. It’s hardwired in their brains to find this stuff out.
I actually think she knows im just not sure if it really matters that much. She seems to like the results and it has been a progressive change so maybe she has no idea. But we are both too busy to have time to pry into each other.