Had a 22yo family friend who’s unattached and turned down a chance to be a green card husband for a 29yo female surgeon from Brazil. The only response I could muster: “wtf is your problem?”
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I was raised Catholic but after seeing all there abuse of power in this country its very hard not to take a cynical view of them.
That being said what else do you think came into it?
It’s not what I think but what were the actual reasons. There really was the idea that being celibate demonstrated a higher level of devotion to god. And this idea is not unique to Catholicism. Also, the church didn’t want priests to appear less spiritual and holy than the members of the monastic orders who lived a life that was closer to how Christ lived.
I’m not saying there are no teachers who have abused kids. Catholic priests have had their abuse covered up for a long time, and it continues to happen. That alone is enough for me to despise the church, and if a school behaves in the same way I would feel equal disgust in their behavior. Religious or not, if you are covering up children being abused you are a terrible person.
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I think that’s the point of those articles it does and continues to happen with schools.
And yes, one is a terrible person for covering it up. And we Catholics must keep demanding it be exposed, with ever better safeguards put into place.
There is no excuse for the abuse or any cover up. I have no sympathy for predators be they Catholic or otherwise. I am not here to make excuses.
It brings me sorrow that the victims were ignored and that the people who should protect them the most, betrayed them the most…
They stole something more precious then the average predator, they stole their faith and their trust.
All secrecy must end and those who did the crimes must see justice. And it must become the policy of the church to turn over all predators, not protect them. And they must see justice.
We will not heal from these wounds for a long time. But efforts must be made and must never stop to bring healing to the victims and the church. Nothing less should nor can be accepted. I am sorry for the victims and I have no sympathy for the perpetrators or their enablers.
The church must be a open church. Open to admit it’s sins and open to healing all those who seek it.
This was not the intention of the words of Jesus, but to bring healing and peace to the least of God’s people.
And that’s all I have to say. I will speak no more in this thread.
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Well said.
I’m anti-capital punishment. However, if there were to be any exceptions…Well, millstone, neck, and the sea. You folks know the reference. I won’t leave the Church, but I certainly want justice for the victims.
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I’m extremely disturbed by the fact that the practice is so widespread and established that it transcends geographical boundaries - whichever catholic country you go to, you’ll find widespread abuse
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I have a theory on that (partially backed up by some testimony). The hierarchy at present is either decided by this type of behaviour, or a capacity to stay mum about it. Over time, this means that priests who do not fit this description, will be sidelined and not promoted.
The institution is now so rotten, that the hierarchy cannot reform itself, because the selection criteria for promotion was either bad actor or enabler of bad actor.
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Only the future can tell. Our priest seems to be a darn good man who care deeply about this issue. It both angers him and brings him a great deal shame. I believe there are more than enough priests like him to continue to make the necessary reforms on this issue.
When I looked for good, then evil came unto me : and when I waited for light, there came darkness.
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Echo.
To the OP, my wife and I had a discussion about the ongoing revelation of abuses within the church. She thought, as do many, that if the vow of celibacy is lifted and priests are allowed to marry, it would cut down on the abuses. To which I asked “If a priest is willing to break his celibacy to abuse a child, why wouldn’t they just break it with an adult?” Celibacy doesn’t equal child abuse.
The church needs a purge and the evil doers within destroyed.
I think Rod Dreher is likely onto something, as controversial as it may be.
Taking a stab at these…
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Saints aren’t deified, and I was taught that you don’t pray to the saints, instead you ask for them to intercede on your behalf much like you might ask a friend to pray for you if you were going through a difficult time.
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Popes aren’t deified but they do enjoy a closer relationship to God than others, see: Papal infallability.
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Interestingly, there are a number of Catholic priests who are married having come from either Orthodox or Episcopalian faiths prior to their conversion to Catholicism. The Catholic Church teaches that priest can’t marry because they devote themselves to the service of the Church. Their vows of celibacy also exclude marriage from a practical perspective.
That being said, a priest can offer marriage advice the same way an unmarried therapist could offer marriage advice. One doesn’t need to have been married in order to counsel others.
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I don’t know how to do the quote thing, but here goes…
On point 1, interestingly enough there is a thread of thought from the early church onwards that still persists in the Orthodox faith very profoundly on deification (theosis). St. Athanasius said something like God became man that man might become God. In the Orthodox mind, God is understood to have a distinction between His essence and His energies. We participate more and more in the energies of God through theosis. It can also be said we become by grace what God is by nature. See St Gregory Palamas for a fuller development through hesychasm, but essentially many of the church fathers that the Catholics recognize as such including St Gregory of Nyssa, St Gregory of Nazianzus, and St Basil among others all write on deification/theosis. Over time, this mode of salvation was replaced in the West by St Anselm’s ransom theory.
Of course this is understood to be the normal course of salvation and not contingent on being canonized a saint.
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Well gay also doesn’t equal pedophile. However it would be ridiculous to ignore the fact that almost all the victims are male.
I chalk that up to the self propagating nature of pedophelia, wherein many times a victim becomes an abuser.
Take someone like Jerry Sandusky for example. If you ask him, he is neither gay nor a pedophile, but he definitely molested boys. The thing is, they don’t see themselves as either. In their minds they were just expressing an extraordinarily warped sense of “caring”.
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It’s an access thing imo. They have far more access to boys than girls, and no legitimate “outlets”.
Is it? That doesn’t ring quite true to me though I’ll grant I have no professional experience in abuse (no amateur experience either!)
I think distinctions need to be made between the various chronophilias, especially when trying to draw conclusions about the abuser sexual preferences. Do chronophiles have stronger gender or age predilictions? That is given a 9 year old boy, a 9 year old girl, a 13 year old boy, and a 13 year old girl would an abuser be more likely to choose along age or gender lines?
And how does their self-identified gender preference correlate with the victims of their abuse?
I find the whole thing fascinating - almost as though chronophilia is it’s own sexual preference* - until I remember it’s the abuse of children we’re discussing and then I just find it unspeakably sad.
“*” I’m not trying to equate chronophilia with sexual preferences amongst consenting adults at all.
Do they?