The AfterLife

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[quote]flashgordon wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:
Rajraj:

If your point is that faith exists independent of proof, then why didn’t you say it in the first place? If BrotherChris’ argument regarding proof is pointless, why join the fray with comments like “there’s no proof Jesus is divine” or whatever the exact words you used were? [/quote]

Flashgordon stated his belief was based on real evidence so I wrote “It’s annoying as hell when people tell you that your religion isn’t based on real evidence instead of faith.”

That point was challenged so I asked him to provide proof.

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

I’ll tell you why: your argument holds no merit, the worthlessness of it has now been exposed to you and you have been forced to backtrack and revise it under the guise of “this is what I was saying from the start”. I laugh at the HVAC comment. I have mentioned ONE time in more than 4000 posts that I used to be an HVAC technician and apparently you place such import on what I say that that one comment stuck with you. And now you’ve resorted to pure Sophistry to embolden your argument. If I wanted to listen to personal attacks passed off as valid arguing points I could just spend all my time in PWI arguing with LifticusMaximus. [/quote]

I check GAL regularly. It’s not important to me I just thought it was a funny way to insult you. I have made valid arguments you have just chosen to ignore them.

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

Lastly, whenever we talk about anything spiritual or anything related to Jesus, His message is never off-topic. And the fact that you openly admit to not believing in a spiritual world combined with the fact that you fail to grasp the irrelevancy of proof in regards to any sort of deity has seriously discredited anything you have to say from here on out.

You believe that there is no spiritual world, an assumption I already came to several days ago. Fine. Then why are you here? To argue your point that there is no spiritual world? I’ll take a page out of your book and ask what sort of proof there is to support your belief. I have proof that it does exist, you just haven’t seen it. [/quote]

I’m here for my own enjoyment - that’s why I post in GAL. More specifically I’m in this thread because of the initial statements flashgordon made.

You see you keep missing things. Brother Chris started with the “you just haven’t seen it” argument.

I’m not claiming I have proof the spiritual world doesn’t exist. That’s just my personal belief.

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

See what I did there? I stooped down to your level. If BrotherChris is off-base in his assertions, then why even validate them? Why “stoop down” to his level? (BrotherChris: I am NOT saying that you are at some sort of level below the rest of us. In fact, as pretentious as I think it is to say that your belief system is rooted in proof or fact, I don’t blame you for searching for these things in the face of inane arguments like rajraj’s)

Now it’s my turn to be pretentious, and I gotta admit, I am REALLY, REALLY good at it: don’t bother responding to my post, rajraj. You have nothing to bring to the table, aside from Sophistry, revisionism and personal insults (rooted in your obsession with me) so there is no point in you continuing to discuss this with me. My intellect is clearly superior to yours and quite frankly, I’m wasting my time here.

You don’t believe in a spiritual world at all, and the point of this thread wasn’t about whether or not an afterlife exists, but what our thoughts about whatever afterlife it is that those who DO believe one exists are. You have no place in this thread anymore. Vanish. [/quote]

I only posted when someone claimed they have evidence of Jesus Christ’s divinity, but apparently you can’t comprehend that. Everyone has the right to their beliefs. I just posted to point out that real evidence of Jesus’s divinity does not exist.
[/quote]

Ok, mabye I worded what I said wrong and you misunderstood. I do not have evidence for every part of my faith.
But, I do have enough evidence of the existence of Jesus and his death. Sorry if you picked me up wrong, I am NOT saying I have what you would call evidence for Jesus’ divinity.

God bless[/quote]

Glad we agree that’s all I was getting at.

I don’t consider myself superior to those who are spiritual or anything like that. That was never my intention.

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[quote]byukid wrote:
Hey, maybe if we let this thread die, it will come back and tell us what the afterlife is all about.[/quote]

LOL

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I’m willing to gamble large sums of money on the fact that there is an afterlife. Anyone want to take me up on that bet?

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[quote]DBCooper wrote:
Both of you are being absolutely ridiculous.

Brother Chris: If someone were to say to you that they have seen proof that God does not exist, or that perhaps multiple gods exist as in Hinduism or even in ancient Greece, you’d chalk it up to disillusionment of some kind. If someone claimed to have some sort of vision of this, or to have spoken to them or something along those lines, you’d call them confused or delusional. It is beyond egotistical and pretentious to sit here and say that you have seen proof of something as mysterious and powerful as ANY god.

My point this entire time is that it is NOT faith if you have seen “proof” of God’s existence. If God exists and you have seen the proof, you really don’t have much of a choice regarding your beliefs. You can reject Him or you can accept Him, there is no other choice. So if you follow Him, that isn’t faith. If God exists, then Heaven must also exist, and if we know that it DOES exist, how can our actions be motivated by anything else but our selfish need to be closer to Him? [/quote]

I can see your point. Moreover, I can understand where you get the idea of faith. Nevertheless, Catholics don’t hold the same limitations on the word faith:

Is there things in which are revealed and not seen? Yes, that is the truth. Now, are there things that can be reasoned and seen with one’s owns eyes? Yes as well. That is why the Catholic Church says ‘faith and reason’ because we don’t cast out one for another. We can reason that G-d exists deductively. We see that science not only begs for there to be an intelligent mind, but also shows heavy evidence that there is one (fine-tuning).

There is other things that completely make zero sense (objective-morality) if you go around saying that there is no G-d.

My point of writing all this is that even though we can understand parts of G-d through reason and our own eyes (Abraham for instances) we can still have faith. Abraham had great faith, and he clearly saw the backside of G-d.

[quote]
You know that there is no way to prove that God exists, so for you to rest your entire argument on that basis reveals the utter lack of knowledge you have about spirituality in general.[/quote]

What do you think about the Kalam argument?

I once heard an atheist at a debate on G-d that atheist could disprove G-d. I’m do not remember exactlly what he said…something on the lines of showing the existence of a god is parallel to a square circle. I don’t know if I entirely follow what he was saying, just thought it was interesting that he tried to make that argument.

P.S. Who’s your money on for the WS2011?

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[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]byukid wrote:
Hey, maybe if we let this thread die, it will come back and tell us what the afterlife is all about.[/quote]

LOL[/quote]

Lol

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[quote]TD54 wrote:
I’m willing to gamble large sums of money on the fact that there is an afterlife. Anyone want to take me up on that bet?[/quote]

This reminds me of a joke I heard by Fulton:

One say Bishop Sheen was talking on the subject of Jonah and the Whale/Fish and being in there for three days. A heckler asked how Jonah could be in a fish for three days. Bishop calmly answered, “I don’t know, but when I get to Heaven I’ll make sure to ask him.”

The heckler said back, “What if Jonah ain’t in Heaven?”
The good bishop quipped, “Then you ask him.”

I still lol.

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[quote]byukid wrote:
Hey, maybe if we let this thread die, it will come back and tell us what the afterlife is all about.[/quote]

this~

again, kid…you’re the star of this thread about nothing.

another 4,000 internet points.

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[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

P.S. Who’s your money on for the WS2011?[/quote]

The Angels.

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Just wanted to add that the concept of an afterlife is not entirely about an individual trying to save their own skin - it’s more about giving hope to those whose loved ones have passed on. Seeing friends and relatives even pets die around you is a very potent reminder of mortality: both your own and the people around you.

The idea that you can be reunited with those you’ve lost is a huge factor in what we generally think of as an afterlife. All cultures have a concept of an afterlife in one form or another. Comparatively few have the concept of a hell as a punishment for evil. Aztecs would slaughter thousands of people in ritual mass sacrifice to keep their own citizenry in order and appease their gods. It was done on a scale that we in the modern world would consider an atrocity but they didn’t regard it as ‘evil’ and didn’t expect their gods to punish them for it.

The Western concept of Hell didn’t exist then: it was developed by the Byzantines through their attempts to make sense of death and loss experienced by the living. The ancient Greek analogue to ‘our’ Hell wasn’t an analogue at all: extant Greek plays depict Hades more as a realm of shadows than a blazing torturous inferno ruled by a trident-wielding, goatee-sporting demon.

What we have in common with them is the fear of death and loss, not just our own deaths but everyone close to us. At some level we all need to make sense of it. You see disasters on TV everyday and people are always trying to explain them away.

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[quote]Edgy wrote:

[quote]byukid wrote:
Hey, maybe if we let this thread die, it will come back and tell us what the afterlife is all about.[/quote]

this~

again, kid…you’re the star of this thread about nothing.

another 4,000 internet points.[/quote]

Actually, Edgy, I think YOU win the internet for having more avatar changes in the past month than even WolBarret.

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[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:

[quote]Edgy wrote:

[quote]byukid wrote:
Hey, maybe if we let this thread die, it will come back and tell us what the afterlife is all about.[/quote]

this~

again, kid…you’re the star of this thread about nothing.

another 4,000 internet points.[/quote]

Actually, Edgy, I think YOU win the internet for having more avatar changes in the past month than even WolBarret.

[/quote]

How many do I get for the worst Avi change?

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[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

P.S. Who’s your money on for the WS2011?[/quote]

The Angels.
[/quote]

Yeah, they’ve been killing it. The wrecked Boston, which made my day, and anyone I saw with Boston on…I made sure they heard the news.

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[quote]roybot wrote:
Just wanted to add that the concept of an afterlife is not entirely about an individual trying to save their own skin - it’s more about giving hope to those whose loved ones have passed on. Seeing friends and relatives even pets die around you is a very potent reminder of mortality: both your own and the people around you.

The idea that you can be reunited with those you’ve lost is a huge factor in what we generally think of as an afterlife. All cultures have a concept of an afterlife in one form or another. Comparatively few have the concept of a hell as a punishment for evil. Aztecs would slaughter thousands of people in ritual mass sacrifice to keep their own citizenry in order and appease their gods. It was done on a scale that we in the modern world would consider an atrocity but they didn’t regard it as ‘evil’ and didn’t expect their gods to punish them for it.
[/quote]

To expound further on this point there is a great fear of the nothing; the thought that this life is the only chance you have to experience awareness of self truly frightens the ego. Especially as you become older and more aware of your mortality. This is a fear which has haunted mankind since the moment we became conciously aware of our existence and started to question it.

As an atheist I find that a sobering thought and try to live life accordingly, but, sadly often fail in that regard as it’s a lucky man who truly lives life to it’s fullest.

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[quote]DJHT wrote:
How many do I get for the worst Avi change?
[/quote]

-542,691. that Avi has gots to go~

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[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
Actually, Edgy, I think YOU win the internet for having more avatar changes in the past month than even WolBarret.
[/quote]

yea…guess I’ve been unsettled lately. I didn’t think that there were internet points awarded for that tho-

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[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]DBCooper wrote:

P.S. Who’s your money on for the WS2011?[/quote]

The Angels.
[/quote]

Yeah, they’ve been killing it. The wrecked Boston, which made my day, and anyone I saw with Boston on…I made sure they heard the news.[/quote]

Actually, I don’t really think they’ll do it. It was just a joke. The team that wins it will be the team on God’s side. You know, like when an athlete says “God was on our side today.” Hopefully it’ll be the Giants.

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Great song, it’s about faith.

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Where were you before you were born?? Same thing as when you die, you just cease to exist. BOOM… no after life, just enjoy life now while you can.

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[quote]hwh89 wrote:
First of all, please excuse my English(English is the third language here in Palestine).
do you believe in the after-life? i do, but every time i think about it, it confuses the hell out of me. Every body say they want to live forever, but when you think about it you find it very weird.

Because we are programmed to believe that everything should have a finale.
So, What is the end?and what are your thoughts about The Afterlife?
and for those who do not believe in the Afterlife, What do you think will happen after you die?
[/quote]

Um…has anyone else noticed the OP has a HAMAS flag on his profile?

OP: Don’t pull that string sonny. There is no afterlife.

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[quote]hwh89 wrote:

Great song, it’s about faith.[/quote]