In a recent interview with the BBC, the Abu Ghraib whistleblower says he suffered abuse at home for exposing the outrageous conduct of the Americans at Abu Ghraib.
[i]The US soldier who exposed the abuse of Iraqi prisoners in Abu Ghraib prison found himself a marked man after his anonymity was blown in the most astonishing way by Donald Rumsfeld.
[…]
His wife had no idea that Mr Darby had handed in those photos, but when he was named, she had to flee to her sister’s house which was then vandalised with graffiti. Many in his home town called him a traitor.
“I knew that some people wouldn’t agree with what I did,” he says.
“You have some people who don’t view it as right and wrong. They view it as: I put American soldiers in prison over Iraqis.”
That animosity in his home town has meant that he still cannot return there.[/i]
I for one, salute Joe’s courage. Who else thinks the exposed cases of murder, rape, and abuse by American soldiers in Iraq are just the tip of the iceberg?
Murder, abuse and rape are not condoned by any honorable serviceman in the military. Bringing into light the acts perpetrated on prisoners by degenerates withing the Army was honorable.
As for the tip of the iceberg… are you crazy? This is an old story. Years old. An american just got 100 years in jail for being on point while the rest of his squad killed a family and raped
Edit: I couldn’t find the story to corroborate a CNN story I watched this morning, so… no 100 year jail thing.
But I did find more cases against military abuses.
[quote]kroby wrote:
Murder, abuse and rape are not condoned by any honorable serviceman in the military. Bringing into light the acts perpetrated on prisoners by degenerates withing the Army was honorable.
This is an old story. Years old. [/quote]
I’ll allow you your sense of time. There is another prison where they bring the “hardcore” detainees, the one near the airport. Stories may surface about that place as they did about the Phoenix Program. Political torture/assasinations in the Provincial Interrogation Centers … Ring a bell?
Your prison near the airport is Camp Cropper I used to work next to it and frequented the site while I worked for Halliburton. It is in the heart of Centcom. Hindsight is 20/20 those things are less likely to happen here. Its too bad NG soldiers police it. They already have a bad rep from Abu Ghraib. The actions of few will scar many. It is really ashame.The way Abu Ghraib was exposed was less than honorable, that story should of never left house. Biggest mistake in the war in regards to PR.
[quote]T-MIA wrote:
Your prison near the airport is Camp Cropper I used to work next to it and frequented the site while I worked for Halliburton. It is in the heart of Centcom. Hindsight is 20/20 those things are less likely to happen here. Its too bad NG soldiers police it. They already have a bad rep from Abu Ghraib. The actions of few will scar many. It is really ashame.The way Abu Ghraib was exposed was less than honorable, that story should of never left house. Biggest mistake in the war in regards to PR. [/quote]
I will disagree. The worst mistake was having those fucks in the military. There is no condoning actions that debase humanity. They thought it was fun, a hoot. There’s plenty of soldiers that would have not done these acts.
Sure you can disagree, yeah your right their actions were everything but professional. Be that as it may it still did not need the attention it got. That was a devastating blow for our campaign. That was kind of my point of the general unprofessionalism of NG units. Its not all of them but you put an active duty soldier next to NG your gonna see a hell of a difference. If you compare the units their chain of command is like a mom and pop small town business where as AD is ran like a large corporation.
There are obviously differences and anomalies but generally speaking these have been my obsv. People see that crap and say thats what the US is doing over there. Its sensationalism at its best. Fucking shame.
[quote]T-MIA wrote:
People see that crap and say thats what the US is doing over there. [/quote]
Yeah, people can be so stupid at times. We all know the US had nothing to do with it. It was a setup by those Russian commie bastards. The blame shouldn’t have been laid on the White House since it wasn’t responsible for the Iraq war in the first place.
Of course it was. Those liberal papers took it completely out of context. The so-called “tortured and humiliated prisoners of Abu Ghraib” were in fact volunteers. They came begging the Americans to initiate them to that SM everybody was talking about. All the soldiers were trying to do was help. It got twisted and completely blown out of proportion.
Israeli interrogators ‘in Iraq’
The US officer at the heart of the Abu Ghraib prison scandal says she has evidence that Israelis helped to interrogate Iraqis at another facility.
The Mystery of Abu Ghraib
The interrogation techniques employed by the Abu Ghraib gang bear a striking resemblance to those employed by Israel, according to Amnesty International…
As Seymour Hersh has pointed out, the U.S.-Israeli alliance has been taking covert shape in the course of this war…
The Israeli Torture Template
According to a political appointee within the Bush administration and U.S. intelligence sources, the interrogators at Abu Ghraib included a number of Arabic-speaking Israelis who also helped U.S. interrogators develop the “R2I” (Resistance to Interrogation) techniques. Many of the torture methods were developed by the Israelis over many years of interrogating Arab prisoners on the occupied West Bank and in Israel itself… http://www.counterpunch.org/madsen05102004.html
[quote]T-MIA wrote:
Your prison near the airport is Camp Cropper I used to work next to it and frequented the site while I worked for Halliburton. It is in the heart of Centcom. Hindsight is 20/20 those things are less likely to happen here. Its too bad NG soldiers police it. They already have a bad rep from Abu Ghraib. The actions of few will scar many. It is really ashame.The way Abu Ghraib was exposed was less than honorable, that story should of never left house. Biggest mistake in the war in regards to PR. [/quote]
Lixy Im not denying that what happened happened. And it is definitely wrong. It just does not properly depict the way the US is handling itself across the board. It was plastered across the news and tore down any trust that we had with the people. Its probably why we are where we find ourselves today. Everything is falling apart.
Lixy knowing what you read and actually seeing it are two diff stories. Worst conflict you ever got in was in the schoolyard getting your ass kicked and Im sure Im not alone on this board when I say it probably happened alot
[quote]T-MIA wrote:
Lixy Im not denying that what happened happened. And it is definitely wrong. It just does not properly depict the way the US is handling itself across the board. It was plastered across the news and tore down any trust that we had with the people. Its probably why we are where we find ourselves today. Everything is falling apart. [/quote]
You’re advocating a “keep-it-down” policy? Somehow, I think the administration tried everything it can to cover it up. I mean, how dumb do you think the president’s circle can be? Surely, they must have done a lot to tone it down. But the good thing about a democratic society, is that such things are bound to resurface. It’s too big a deal if you ask me.
Abu Ghraib is not an isolated incident. Many soldiers have abused their power. No offense, but with the amount of people with criminal background allowed into the military lately, shit is bound to happen.
Im not advocating the “keep-it-down” policy. Yes Lixy the quality of soldiers and their backgrounds are less than desireable nowadays, that is def a true statement. Things were much more scrupulous when I joined in 1996. What I am saying is this: Did anything positive come from the unfolding of those events…no nothing but violence came. Those were some of the bloodiest months if I remember correctly. That was to be expected.
Abu Ghraib was just one of dozens of unfortunately publicized events that have devestated this campaign. I would sooner give 10 lives to save a thousand than let a handful of peoples story be heard, so the rest of the world could know about it. It only serves to misrepresent our nation. In the end it only harmed many more than it ever helped. The greater good is always first.
[quote]lixy wrote:
T-MIA wrote:
Lixy Im not denying that what happened happened. And it is definitely wrong. It just does not properly depict the way the US is handling itself across the board. It was plastered across the news and tore down any trust that we had with the people. Its probably why we are where we find ourselves today. Everything is falling apart.
You’re advocating a “keep-it-down” policy? Somehow, I think the administration tried everything it can to cover it up. I mean, how dumb do you think the president’s circle can be? Surely, they must have done a lot to tone it down. But the good thing about a democratic society, is that such things are bound to resurface. It’s too big a deal if you ask me.
Abu Ghraib is not an isolated incident. Many soldiers have abused their power. No offense, but with the amount of people with criminal background allowed into the military lately, shit is bound to happen. [/quote]
And many of your bretheren have blown up and decapitated innocent people.
Ain’t war hell! I don’t think there is an army on this planet that hasn’t been in conflict and killed innocents, save the salvation army. Its all very unfortunate but nonetheless collateral damage
[quote]T-MIA wrote:
What I am saying is this: Did anything positive come from the unfolding of those events…no nothing but violence came. [/quote]
You seem pretty ambivalent about this. On one hand, you say – and I quote – “that story should of never left house”. On the other hand, you claim that you’re “not advocating the “keep-it-down” policy”.
Which is it? I’m having a hard time figuring out where you stand. Would you keep such scandals secrets to protect the “honor” of the army? Or would you publicize it to make sure it doesn’t happen again? The victims are clear on this: They want it out in the open.
I think there have already been enough lies in this war as is. Abu Ghraib and other horrors would have never happened if Bush/Cheney didn’t go to war unnecessarily. That is the point!
What I am SAYING is that that was not the time for it to come out. Timing is everything in war and Abu Ghraib couldn’t have happened at a worse time. YES those victims deserve to be heard but in doing so they killed thousands more. Jesus man! Wake Up! Where is your bleeding heart for all those innocents killed so others can be heard. it doesn’t make good sense. A government should think about all not just one. Letting them speak at that point in time is thinking with too much emotion, those people would have got their minute and those soldiers would have got what was coming to them no matter what. I thought what I said was pretty clear.