[quote]Gregus wrote:
The book talks about what just about every European knows and believes and Every American is brain washed to not know and believe.
Were all the same, remember? [/quote]
If what you say is true, then I’d consider this American attribute to be positive and I hope it continues. What is useful about considering your own race either more or less inetelligent than average? To me it seems only negative things.
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Sticky this thread, mods! This is easily the best thread we’ve had here.[/quote]
Rather than risk misplacing the reason for your excitement and being a put-off by it, I guess i’ll just ask: Why so giddy?
[quote]michezwick wrote:
Gregus wrote:
The book talks about what just about every European knows and believes and Every American is brain washed to not know and believe.
Were all the same, remember?
If what you say is true, then I’d consider this American attribute to be positive and I hope it continues. What is useful about considering your own race either more or less inetelligent than average? To me it seems only negative things.[/quote]
Now, I don’t know whether it’s true that there is a measurable difference. Not something I’ve looked into or care about. Though the argument that there is NO difference would appear more of a religious-type faith belief than anything based on reason. Only if all humanity were clones of the same individual would that make sense.
However, let’s suppose that perhaps it is true that it is a fact that there are differences in mean or median intelligence or there is a distribution difference.
Your position is that even if true, it’s better to believe it’s not true? In fact, you say it would be “positive” to deny it even if true?
[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
That book was done at least 10 years ago, before they finished mapping the genome. That said, Lynn just came out with a book that confirmed the same thing with newer data:
Here’s another:
Here’s another:
The ‘rebuttal’ you refer to is here:
The basic liberal religious presupposition is that, despite the fact that people from different races look differently than one another (and have different disease resistance, lactose tolerance, grain tolerance, heights, etc), human evolution stopped short of creating differences in general intelligence - that we’re all the same in that regard.
That idea doesn’t make any sense and isn’t confirmed by any reliable data outside of data that liberals want to believe. If you just google “Ashkenazi IQ,” you’ll turn up a ton of stuff that explains it from a population-genetic standpoint:
http://www.google.com/search?q=ashkenazi+iq&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a
[/quote]
Wow you seem pretty interested in the topic. I’ve personally never given the topic much thought so maybe you can help me out. In a psychology class I took freshman year, we did a section on intelligence. Differences in the intelligences of racial groups just happened to come up.
I remember a particular explanation my professor (whose degree is in physical anthropology) gave us for why he believed any differences found along racial lines should be met with skepticism.
He described a Japanese minority that consistently tested below the average Japanese population on IQ tests. However, the difference in test scores between the minority and majority groups only occurred when Japanese-raised individuals were tested. When you tested both groups of Japanese-Americans (raised in the US rather than Japan), there was no difference. Presumably this is because the minority group is no longer cultured to think they’re inferior.
I was just wondering if anyone else had heard of this study…
So the theory of this book is just that same people are more genetically lucky than others? Wow thats mindblowing!
Also… 10,000 years is a long time, especially considering alot of people dont even belive the earth is that old. At least if you are one of those people you dont need this book, you already know this all happend in the last 10,000 years lol.
[quote]michezwick wrote:
Wow you seem pretty interested in the topic. I’ve personally never given the topic much thought so maybe you can help me out. In a psychology class I took freshman year, we did a section on intelligence. Differences in the intelligences of racial groups just happened to come up.
I remember a particular explanation my professor (whose degree is in physical anthropology) gave us for why he believed any differences found along racial lines should be met with skepticism.
He described a Japanese minority that consistently tested below the average Japanese population on IQ tests. However, the difference in test scores between the minority and majority groups only occurred when Japanese-raised individuals were tested. When you tested both groups of Japanese-Americans (raised in the US rather than Japan), there was no difference. Presumably this is because the minority group is no longer cultured to think they’re inferior.
I was just wondering if anyone else had heard of this study…[/quote]
Sounds like an interesting study. Another question I’d have is how education affects IQ test scores. I know that IQ tests are only supposed to measure raw intelligence, but I’d be shocked if twins, one of which was well schooled and the other was not, would score identically (or even nearly identically) on this test. Anyway have know of some studies on this subject, or have I completely missed the boat?
[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
michezwick wrote:
Gregus wrote:
The book talks about what just about every European knows and believes and Every American is brain washed to not know and believe.
Were all the same, remember?
If what you say is true, then I’d consider this American attribute to be positive and I hope it continues. What is useful about considering your own race either more or less inetelligent than average? To me it seems only negative things.
Now, I don’t know whether it’s true that there is a measurable difference. Not something I’ve looked into or care about. Though the argument that there is NO difference would appear more of a religious-type faith belief than anything based on reason. Only if all humanity were clones of the same individual would that make sense.
However, let’s suppose that perhaps it is true that it is a fact that there are differences in mean or median intelligence or there is a distribution difference.
Your position is that even if true, it’s better to believe it’s not true? In fact, you say it would be “positive” to deny it even if true?
[/quote]
He might have a point. All civilizations are made up of stories and rituals we just unquestioningly believe in. It might be better to have such a story as part of the official narrative.
Of course it´s to late if the question is discussed in public.
[quote]TBT4ver wrote:
michezwick wrote:
Wow you seem pretty interested in the topic. I’ve personally never given the topic much thought so maybe you can help me out. In a psychology class I took freshman year, we did a section on intelligence. Differences in the intelligences of racial groups just happened to come up.
I remember a particular explanation my professor (whose degree is in physical anthropology) gave us for why he believed any differences found along racial lines should be met with skepticism.
He described a Japanese minority that consistently tested below the average Japanese population on IQ tests. However, the difference in test scores between the minority and majority groups only occurred when Japanese-raised individuals were tested. When you tested both groups of Japanese-Americans (raised in the US rather than Japan), there was no difference. Presumably this is because the minority group is no longer cultured to think they’re inferior.
I was just wondering if anyone else had heard of this study…
Sounds like an interesting study. Another question I’d have is how education affects IQ test scores. I know that IQ tests are only supposed to measure raw intelligence, but I’d be shocked if twins, one of which was well schooled and the other was not, would score identically (or even nearly identically) on this test. Anyway have know of some studies on this subject, or have I completely missed the boat?[/quote]
There is an interesting study about American black Army kids in Germany.
They had they same IQ as any other German kid, so it is highly questionable that intelligence is correlated to race either way, even though African Americans do score lower on IQ tests in the US than their white counterparts.
That would raise some interesting questions though, the first one being, what happens to black kids that they do not live up to their genetic potential?
[quote]michezwick wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
Sticky this thread, mods! This is easily the best thread we’ve had here.
Rather than risk misplacing the reason for your excitement and being a put-off by it, I guess i’ll just ask: Why so giddy?[/quote]
When I wrote that, there was no flaming and the thread was raising the intelligence bar around here. That’s a good thing. I’d hoped we could save the usual PWI stuff for politics.
This thread may have been better in the GAL section.
Growing up in a less conductive environment…
In the same way, height, food tolerance and body composition are greatly influenced by a persons diet. Especially in the early age and their culture’s dietary heritage. A mere 10 thousand years ago we were all eating pretty much the same: mostly flesh and leafs.
If you’ve gone through a multicultural public school…it’s pretty obvious some people are just more unintelligent than others. I remember a whole skintone practically was at 2nd grade level reading in 4th grade, while another was 6th grade level in 4th grade…nature or nurture, you decide. We all went through the same system.
Wait, so if we were to look at a mono-cultural school you would expect to see everyone being of equal intelligence? Don’t be ridiculous.
You’d have difference, but not as deep, not as great of a disparity.
How much deeper? Deeper than someone growing up in a different socioeconomic environment? how did you measure?
That’s like fat people who say they’re born that way.
[quote]orion wrote:
TBT4ver wrote:
michezwick wrote:
Wow you seem pretty interested in the topic. I’ve personally never given the topic much thought so maybe you can help me out. In a psychology class I took freshman year, we did a section on intelligence. Differences in the intelligences of racial groups just happened to come up.
I remember a particular explanation my professor (whose degree is in physical anthropology) gave us for why he believed any differences found along racial lines should be met with skepticism.
He described a Japanese minority that consistently tested below the average Japanese population on IQ tests. However, the difference in test scores between the minority and majority groups only occurred when Japanese-raised individuals were tested. When you tested both groups of Japanese-Americans (raised in the US rather than Japan), there was no difference. Presumably this is because the minority group is no longer cultured to think they’re inferior.
I was just wondering if anyone else had heard of this study…
Sounds like an interesting study. Another question I’d have is how education affects IQ test scores. I know that IQ tests are only supposed to measure raw intelligence, but I’d be shocked if twins, one of which was well schooled and the other was not, would score identically (or even nearly identically) on this test. Anyway have know of some studies on this subject, or have I completely missed the boat?
There is an interesting study about American black Army kids in Germany.
They had they same IQ as any other German kid, so it is highly questionable that intelligence is correlated to race either way, even though African Americans do score lower on IQ tests in the US than their white counterparts.
That would raise some interesting questions though, the first one being, what happens to black kids that they do not live up to their genetic potential?
[/quote]
This paper pretty much answers all of those questions:
Like I said, everything from the Left is just wishful thinking and religiosity. Obviously, no one wants to believe that there are any differences, because that is un-PC and violates our sense of egalitarianism. But the science just doesn’t agree.
When talking about tested intelligence between races, we might need to specify Pre or Post Obama’s election.
Study Sees an Obama Effect as Lifting Black Test-Takers
[quote]Sloth wrote:
When talking about tested intelligence between races, we might need to specify Pre or Post Obama’s election.
Study Sees an Obama Effect as Lifting Black Test-Takers
LOL. Back to the spreadsheets.
[quote]orion wrote:
There is an interesting study about American black Army kids in Germany.
They had they same IQ as any other German kid, so it is highly questionable that intelligence is correlated to race either way, even though African Americans do score lower on IQ tests in the US than their white counterparts.
That would raise some interesting questions though, the first one being, what happens to black kids that they do not live up to their genetic potential?
[/quote]
As soon as the first study released its findings that blacks on average score one standard deviation lower than whites in IQ tests, the whole field of study was locked away. It’s academic suicide nowadays to seriously study any intelligence differences between races. If you even bring up the subject, you’ll be branded with a scarlet “R” before you can finish your sentence.
Nevermind that the results also said that Hispanics also scored lower than whites and that Asians scored higher than everybody.
Nevermind that this difference might be due to cultural effects rather than biological.
Nevermind that different types of tests might indicate different types of intelligence among the races.
Nevermind that further research might uncover a whole slew of opportunities that better suit blacks and Hispanics than what exists for them today.
Nevermind all that.
As soon as one study even hinted that “blacks are stupid”, the whole field of study was terminated. The tragic side-effect of mainstream academia shaming the whole field into oblivion is that we don’t have any scientific refutation of the claim that blacks and Hispanics score lower on average than whites and Asians. All we’re left with is the one study standing practically unopposed, because ultra-PC academia denies anybody a legitimate opportunity to oppose it.
But nevermind the fact that such study might lead to better methods of educating blacks and Hispanics, which would be good for everybody.
Nevermind that. We’re all the same, and damn any research that says otherwise.
I think that these IQ differences are strongly influenced by mans greatest asset, his ability to adapt. We get better at that what we do.
F.ex. to have quality hockey teams, somebody must do the work with juniors, and there must be much of juniors to get one A team.
PRCalDude is always happy to give evidence for the success of islamist junior work.
I read the paper that PRCaldude linked and it was very interesting. I found this snippet especially interesting:
“Based on
Lakatos?s (1970, 1978) criteria for evaluating research programs, and a philosophy
of science methodology that evaluates rival theories by generating multiple
strong inferences and assessing the preponderance and the consilience of many
lines of evidence, we believe the hereditarian theory has satisfied the criteria for
a ?progressive? research program, whereas the culture-only program has not.”
I hope these guys had tenure when they wrote that. ;>
Amazing what the PC police would do with that. It wouldn’t matter about facts or scientific objectivity — you’re obviously a Klan member for even thinking such things!!