Test Prop TRT Help

Pharma
1

Hey there, let me start by addressing the obvious: Test prop for trt seems really stupid. However, I’ve been on enanthate for around a year now, and have had a few issues including:
-Have trouble “dialing” in despite trying multiple different approaches to frequency/dose/etc. (and giving at least 6-8 weeks for them to take affect)
-Overall “low” mood despite all markers being ideal
-Poor libido: I can get it up, but I don’t really want to (even though I DO want to be able to want to if you get me)
-Skin reactions; may be a carrier oil thing, but my body breaks out with acne and rashes regardless of biomarkers/frequency/dose

So, after some inspiration from reddit users claiming to have their quality or life and libido “revived” by test prop, I’ve decided (with Dr’s permission of course) to run a little daily test prop protocol for the next few months.

The thought process behind this is:
-The short half-life of prop will give fluctuations in levels similar to diurnal rhythm (not exact, but about as close as you can get with injectables)
-Since prop is fast acting, you have a quick bout of higher androgenicity (which might improve libido via dht conversion) followed by a pretty drastic reduction in serum levels (which MIGHT aid in better sleep quality- I sleep like shit on enanthate for some reason)
-The ability to titrate up/down effortlessly, and FAST ( I hate waiting 4+ weeks to MAYBE feel good after an enanthate protocol change)
-As a bonus, there is some speculation that, due to prop’s short half life, you have less suppression on LH/FSH, and thus on your adrenals and CNS (although, since I obviously had low FSH/LH before, this might prove irrelevant, but maybe could help with pregnenelone/progesterone/etc)

So, my plan of action is to wait roughly one half life of enanthate (about 4 days), and then begin with prop at 8-10mg/day, titrating up as the enanthate leftover slowly leaves my system.

Now, here’s what I need input on:
-I’ve always done shallow IM in delts/VG, but since I’m moving to dallies, thought about trying subq. Anyone have experience with injecting prop IM/subq and which they prefer?
-In theory, prop peaks around 12 hrs. after administration (more or less depending on IM/subq). So, it would most-closely mimic natural physiology to inject at night, right? Although, I don’t want to get consistent with that and then have to worry about bringing it with me if I go out for the night or something lol.

  • Is that PIP really that unmanageable?

Thanks all!

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I am on Tprop. the max concentration is around 4-8h post injection. confirmed by blood work. (4h post 75ng/dl free T, 24h post injection 30ng/dl free)
subq does not give me PIP. i felt magnitudes better on Tprop daily. libido, mood, sleep.
you can make quick dose adjustments and will notice those on the same day. my sweet spot currently is 25mg/d. (which gives me the 75ng/dl peak)

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I am fully on board this train. I believe the body makes sense out of rhythms and being “primed for sex” is much about accepting a role of sex in one’s life that is not 24/7 accessible, and being comfortable and confident with potential partners when you’re not into it. My journey has in part been about accepting that when sex started for me it was about addressing a need I felt. If I didnt feel it I didnt give a shit. At some point it transitioned to an anxiety that I “needed” to want it and be able to perform all the time in order to be healthy or viable. Its been difficult to change mindset, but so many behavioral processes in the body only make sense in rhythm, or in periods of abundance and lack. Hunger->Satiety. Asleep->Awake. Alert → Relaxed. Interested → Bored. Would you address sleep issues by taking something that made you half asleep 24/7? What kind of diet could you implement if you never felt full or hungry? Confusing. Would you want to have to shit all the time or in response to necessary bowel clearance? Women’s monthly rhythms are a huge part of the entire structure for our understanding of fertility. The body is as or more responsive as it is productive. We are planned to interact, not merely exist. Most social interactions and biological processes are based on daily rhythms. Shouldn’t the chemicals we produce daily to support those behaviors be replaced in protocols daily with as close to daily-functioning replacement agents as possible? Further, chemicals are not behaviors, but drive and support them. Estrogen is not a behavior, for example, where copulation is. Estrogen influences copulation in myriad ways and copulation is pursued, initiated, performed, and enjoyed in myriad ways. There may not only be a “sweet spot” for one’s personal relative levels of androgens etc…, but also for the timing, rising, and retreating of those tides. There may even be a “sweet spot” that changes based on how you grow to view, approach, and desire sex. It may be that you need different replacement protocols if you psychologically believe sex to be something you go “out on the prowl to get” versus something you enjoy to validate a long-term relationship. And everything in between. In short, I think it’s super interesting and I’m excited to see people playing with different variables besides lab levels!

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Awesome- in that case, It would seem like morning injections would make the most sense then!

I’m currently “detoxing” from my protocol until I can get the prop in (hopefully just a day or two), which will put me roughly 5 days since my last injection. I figure that will be enough of a space to tell if my starting dose is too much.

When you say subq, are we talking belly fat, glute fat, etc? Also, what carrier oil is yours suspended in- I think mine is going to be grapeseed.

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I 100% agree! When I first got on TRT, I was stoked to “feel good” 24/7… ie strong in the gym, able to grind at work and school all day, etc. It’s odd how as I’ve gotten more adjusted to it, I now want to NOT feel good some times- like obviously, with exogenous androgens you’re always going to sit at the “pinnacle” of natural possibilities, but I think there’s something to be said for trying to emulate what every human body is designed to do. That being said, I don’t know if I’ll stay on this protocol for forever (never make promises you can’t be positive you’ll keep lol), but I’m actually really excited to try it and see what happens. Also, since I’m still really young for the TRT population, I realize that I’m kind of a lab rat when it comes to these things- most 20 year olds have years before they will consider it, and I’m scared that what works for 30-40+ year olds might somehow hinder some sort of growth/development mentally that I’m still yet to obtain. Hopefully, this method minimizes the risks from exogenous androgen treatment (although I knew the risks when we made the decision to start the treatment, so no regrets there).

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belly fat. which i still have plenty lol. yeah, grapeseed. empower pharma. i tried some UGL with MCT, but TBH got bad PIP from it. not sure if it was the. mct or the additives. 5 days sounds good.

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The newer oral testosterone achieves higher serum DHT versus injections and higher Free T than topicals, and has a 6 hour half-life and is dosed twice daily.

Steady states are achieved in 7 days!

Less suppressive than injections, and may make fertility more easily achieved.

Jatenzo, Kyzatrex and Orlando are three competing brands, the latter two have an option for cash only (average $159-$200 per month) without insurance.

These newer oral testosterone options also aren’t likely to cause erythrocytosis.

PK profiles->

IMG_0187
IMG_01871511×1474 183 KB

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I’m on Jatenzo @237 mg twice daily and this is the recommended starting dosage. My peak levels are 988 ng/dL and trough 12 hours later is 289 ng/dL, yet I feel the same as I did at at peak or 2 hours.

Strong erections and a vigorous libido occur regularly at trough.

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Thats a really interesting graph when you consider the curve a single large “TRT+” dose would get you in the morning taken once daily.

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This. The blood levels arent whats causing it per se, the flux is!

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Twelve hours after my morning dosage, = 289 ng/dL. I did try dosing Jatenzo once daily, it failure miserably.

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Interesting. Did you take 474mg once daily?

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Dr. Mohit Khera MD and Dr. Abraham Morgentaler have both stated testosterone actions on receptor sites continue for several hours after serum levels have declined.

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No, I did not. A urologist who prescribe Kyzatrex has some of his patients dose the second capsule mid afternoon (2 pm). His reasoning is keep your testosterone highest when most active.

I did double dose one day by accident, only figure it out when my Total T at 5 hours was 1052 instead of the usual 552 ng/dL.

I was so much stronger in the gym that day!!

I fully expect these newer oral testosterone to go mainstream in the next 10 years.

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I definitely can see daily dosing that suggested dose going poorly. I wonder if scaling the dose so the trough is desirable would create an outcome.

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Awesome, gonna try out subq belly. Thanks man!

17

Interesting…
I looked into the creams as I figured similar nature to prop as far as daily fluctuations, as well as the added benefit of dht conversion on the testes perhaps having libido-inducing benefits. Honestly just didn’t want to deal with the hassle of having to apply and then worry about transference and such- but, the oral might be a consideration if prop fails me