Well most of us have things we can’t change about ourselves despite our best efforts. Take the good with the bad right? At my best I get called mini-arnold or mini-rock all the time. Always ‘mini’ cuz I’m 5’7". Can’t do nothing about it!
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I have a buddy that I went to high school with. He had insane genetics for muscle building. When we were high school seniors he competed on a bodybuilding stage (full on bodybuilding, not classic, not physique) and took 2nd in the city of Louisville in the teen division. He was 5’1" and weighed 168 on stage. He said he was all natural and I believe him too. He quit because he refused to take steroids and he knew that he would have to if he wanted to make any real money or career out of it.
I guess my point is, we gave him a TON of shit for being short even though he was jacked as fuck and could’ve kicked any of our asses lol.
I just get called fat
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That is huge if he was even under 10% body fat. I have a buddy that is 5’2" (@blshaw, it could be worse), who is the most yolked person I have seen at like 175 and about the same body fat as me (16-18%). He is a former AAS user, but hasn’t touched gear in 5 years.
He is pretty strong (benches low 400s). He gets pissed because everyone assumed their cousin could lift more in high school than he does because of his height.
Yeah the 5’-5’2” range would be horrible for an American male. I mean you would get borderline stared at. I’m still in the 5th percentile but not so much so people would gawk by any means. One of the guys at my gym is a good sized 6’1”, not muscular like me, but still better than average. He always says “the big guy is here” when I walk in. I got pissed thinking he was poking me but he was like no I was paying a compliment. So some of the little man syndrome is in my head. I’ve got it it though like most manlets.
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As someone who’s 5’7” I resent the implication that we are a mini anything. 
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Day 8 Update:
Well I think I am finally starting to feel the tren just a little bit, my muscles feel tighter and more full, and I do feel like I am leaning out just a bit. My hunger is going up and I am getting the trendigestion after every meal. Luckily I generally eat super clean and quick digesting foods so the indigestion doesn’t last too long. When I eat something sugary my stomach starts to hurt, so this is just one more reason to not eat bullshit lol. I also had my first bout with tren cough this morning, but it wasn’t as bad as the two different times I had the coughs from NPP.
I’ll know for certain tonight, when I am at the gym, if it is really kicking in or not. As of right now there is a really good chance I will be cranking up the dose on test and tren next Tuesday though.
Day 9 Update:
Last nights workout was pretty good. No PR’s or anything crazy, but with the amount of work I did, and I didn’t leave the gym feeling wiped out, I think that means the tren is starting to work. Normally on just my TRT, Wednesday’s just destroy me because I am doing a ton of event work.
I am starting my mini-cut today. I weighed in at about 248.5 this morning and I need to get down to 241-242 before I start my water cut. I cut about 700 kcals per day out of my diet. I went from about 250p 90f 300c (actual values not known but this is a close guesstimate) to 300p 75f 130c (this is known and calculated. I have a spreadsheet I do my diet plan on). I know that is a big deficit, but I want to make this cut as quick as possible to establish my new baseline and give myself at least 4 weeks at my new weight for my body to become accustomed to it. This is also about how many calories I dropped on my last cut and that lasted 12 weeks. So I know I can handle it, but I don’t fucking like it one bit.
Day 10 Update:
Well my impatience and lack of discipline got me again today. I bumped it up to 35 mg/day this morning. I told myself to wait until Tuesday but just decided I couldn’t wait longer. I Feel like I started too low in the first place though. I’m not going to promise to wait X amount of days before bumping it up again, but I do feel better about 1 mg/lb. I am probably comparing this too much to the NPP, but I felt that after 3 days and I was at 1 mg/lb on that.
I am leaning out. I am not sure if it is a continuation of just getting back on TRT or if it is the tren working. I was making a lot of steady, linear progress on TRT only before jumping on tren, so it’s not like I’m busting plateaus.
I weighed in at 248.2 today, and I already hate this cut lol. But I am going to drop the weight… or just get fucking shredded and more or less maintain weight, I’m not sure which will happen yet, but I am good with either.
Overall no noticeable tren sides except for very mild insomnia and a little indigestion. I have been taking 250-500 mg magnesium about an hour before bed which seems to help tremendously, and I am still getting 7-8 hours sleep a night, and I eat clean enough that the indigestion doesn’t stick around too long and I have no problem getting all of my calories for the day. I think my mood has been fine (verified by my wife) and I haven’t had sweats. My BP is still good, has been measuring around 125/80 for the last few days and RHR is always right around 60.
I’m an asthmatic (specifically, exercise induced asthma) so my cardio has always sucked, I doubt I’ll notice a difference on tren.
Did you bump the test up too?
No, I was undecided on doing that just yet. I see people talk about letting the tren do the work so keep the test low to make sure it doesn’t supplant (supplant may not be the right word) the tren from the AR’s. I have no idea how much proof there is to that, and I don’t do my next test shot until tomorrow.
Thoughts?
I have heard conflicting things in regards to letting compounds do the work in relation to test. I have heard some say let the Tren, Deca or whatever do the work, I have heard some say limiting Test is a mistake.
It is probably just like a lot of stuff in this game. It is individual. I think experimenting a bit and finding what works for you is a good idea. Just try to keep your variables steady as your will power allows.
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Thanks for the response. I think what I’ll do is stay at 245 mg/wk of tren, and if I feel the need to bump something else up, it’ll be the test next
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Day 13 Update:
Currently running 245 mg/wk Tren A and 210 mg/wk Test C. Just this morning, I started Oxandrolone at 50 mg/day. Still running 500 IU HCG / wk as well.
I have noticed a little bit of a bump from the tren (by bump I mean my warm ups don’t take as long, my workouts feel better, and I don’t feel as wiped out after a hard workout), but overall I still feel like, 2 weeks into my NPP cycle, I was getting a lot more from the NPP than I am with the tren. I have only been running 245 mg/wk Tren A for 3 days. I’ll try to give it another week (If I’m being completely honest with myself it’ll most likely be 3-5 days) to see if the oxandrolone makes a difference, if it does not, I’ll bump up the test to probably 420 mg/wk.
I will say that my recovery has definitely improved while on tren vs just TRT alone, but I felt stronger with NPP, I do not necessarily feel stronger on tren.
EDIT: I didn’t mention sides. I still haven’t really dealt with any sides. My junk still operates normally, I haven’t had night sweats, my mood is actually improved vs TRT only, no gyno (or at least not more than I have had since I was 11-12 yrs old), blood pressure is still in the 125/80 range, RHR is usually right around 60 BPM. Again, still mild insomnia and indigestion, but they’re both so mild that it is easily dealt with. magnesium helps with my insomnia and as long as I eat whole foods (I’m sure I’ve talked enough about it that y’all know I’m on the vertical diet, which also happens to be a low FODMAP diet) and keep eating a low FODMAP diet, indigestion is very easily manageable. It only acts up when I start getting off my diet, so it’s even more reason to eat clean.
I think with the NPP, you put on water bloat which increased your strength. Were you running higher Test with the NPP as well? Both increase bloat, and bloat increases strength. With your Test dosage, I would not expect really any noticeable bloat, and Tren isn’t going to bloat you. But when you gain lean tissue with the Tren you will get stronger. Bloat strength is almost immediate. Lean tissue gain isn’t so immediate.
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This could potentially be the answer, I was running test at 525 mg/wk with the NPP (245 mg/wk for the first 4 weeks and then bumped up to 350 mg/wk for the last 10 weeks). Looking in the mirror I am definitely getting more lean with the tren, but the scale weight is staying the same. I’ll take a pic at the gym tonight to make it comparable to the pic earlier in this thread, which was also a gym pic.
It is possible I put on some water initially, I didn’t record my weight for that blast, but I am recording BW and BP daily with this blast. After about 10 weeks on cycle I was the leanest I have been in my adult life, but I was also running oxandrolone at that point. So I am not sure if the diet, the NPP, or the oxandrolone leaned me out, or if it was a combo of the 3.
I know me and I know that I am overthinking all of this. It’s the curse of being an overthinker and it is driving me crazy.
Sorry in advance if you mentioned this already, but I assume you are measuring your BP at home. If so, what brand of monitor are you using? I’ve tried 3 different ones and they’re all too small- even the ones that are supposedly “for big arms” (up to 17.5"). I grow tired of returning them to Amazon…
Yea I do it at home, I do the wrist cuff BP monitor. The brand is called CareTouch and I think I got it on Amazon for like $30. There does seem to be a bit of variability in it from measurement to measurement, so I usually take 3 measurements and average them out or just use the “middle” one.
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Day 14 Update:
I hit a pretty big PR on the viking press last night, managed to get 385. Previous best from about 3 weeks ago was 345. This is the one lift I feel like the tren is actually doing something. As I have previously mentioned I do believe it is helping my overall recovery, so I definitely like that. I think I can actually keep it at 35 mg/day for longer than a day or two, although I do plan to increase my test to 385 mg/wk soon.
Still no issues with sides other than the small things already mentioned, Oxandrolone gave me indigestion last time I ran it, I have not run it long enough yet to know if it still will this time around.
As previously mentioned, here is another pic. I cannot take a good freakin pic to save my life though. My gut is not distended despite what the photo looks like, but pushing my stomach out was the only way I could get my abs to show in the poor lighting, and you can see my obliques really starting to pop out. For reference, my arms are 18.5-19", and chest is 53-53.5". I have a bit of a wide frame.
I am definitely leaning out vs the last photo, even though it probably doesn’t look like it.
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Day 16 Update:
Well my coach has me on a taper for the next few days to let my body rest a little bit before going into the final block of competition prep. I am not entirely certain I needed it, but I’m sure in about 5 weeks from now I’ll be begging for a deload, which is exactly where I want to be.
With that said, I have been following my “RPEs” a lot more closely instead of just pushing everything to RPE 9-10 all the time. I think that was the single most significant factor with regards to my previous eye injury.
As far as the eye injury goes, I was cleared to lift full bore on Jan 14, I just got back from my eye doctor about 30 minutes ago, and even running all 3 of these compounds and lifting pretty heavy, my eye is still good to go, which is very good to hear.
I am bumping up my test to 385 mg/wk starting tomorrow. I do believe the tren is working at 245 mg/wk, but I’ll be interested to see if the bump in test gives a more noticeable change in performance/recovery.
The cut sucks… I started at 248, and after 1 week I went up to 250.5 on Monday morning and as of this morning I was 247.5 (yesterday morning I was 249). So I am down a whopping half pound after one week in a ~600-700 cal/day deficit. I forgot that my body likes to really be shitty and hold onto the weight for a week any time I try to drop weight. But usually after the first week it’ll come off more quickly. So I fully expect a 2 lbs/wk loss for 3 weeks which will get me exactly where I want to be.
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I hear this. I HATE cutting. Congrats on your progress so far and I’m glad the Tren is working well for you and you’re tolerating it well.