@anon10035199 appreciate your response. Correct, my current protocol is 300mg Test Cyp injected once a week. I was actually going to lower my dose starting this week to 220mg once a week. Would that help or even lower?
You need to try 100mg split up into two shots. Possibly even going Sub Q. Then go from there.
You are crushing your SHBG, like system is saying, and increasing your e2 to the point that you feel like shit.
I have a pretty high SHBG and even I would have e2 problems on that dose. Yours is in the dirt, you need to prioritize keeping aromatization low.
If twice a week is too much you can still do 100 once a week, some say there is no difference. But others swear by it.
Are you IM or sub Q? low SHBG guys tend to like Sub Q because of the slower release.
Don’t keep doing what your doing. its not working for you.
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I didn’t realize you were taking that much. Ct it and quick. @anon10035199 is right. 100 mg may be a drastic drop, but certainly cut it to 200 mg and go from there.
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@anon10035199 you’re right, I feel horrible and something needs to change. Currently on IM injections. Twice a week would be pretty tough but now I’m not sure if I should try 100mg or 200mg once a week (I know its not optimal) with everything considered. My total T levels are in the low 1000s on trough days so that’s not an issue its just my e2 and SHBG. With less Test that would be less e2 correct? @hardartery
Your levels need to come down, way down. My Free T is high normal with a Total T of 500 because I have low SHBG (16-22). You have more than double the levels you need and why you feel like crap, you also have more than likely triple the E2 you require.
Excess Free T = excess E2 in low SHBG men who has a lot of aromatization.
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Less test will equal less E2. Your E2 will probably fall right into line and leave you comfortable once you hit the magic dose. What you are going through is why I think guys should start low and work their way up, not high and then work their way down.
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Thanks guys. I’m truly grateful for your knowledge and experience. Its pretty sad I get more knowledge and questions answered from you guys than the providers I see and they’re the “experts”!
So just dropping my dose “drastically” should lower my e2 and Total/Free T numbers?
Continuing to inject 200 or more is a mistake. You need to give yourself time to stabilize at a lower dose. Then if you feel shitty, go up. I seriously doubt it though. You will probably be good with a TT of 600-700 on trough, maybe even lower.
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@lwatt just to add another example here, might be helpful, might not since we’re all different.
I’m taking 40mg EOD (140 a week) subq. Last bloods were:
SHBG - 38
Total T - 608
Estradiol, non sensitive - 25.6
Generally speaking, I feel really good, pretty stable all the time. I feel like I could feel a little better night of my shot, but overall I’m good.
I agree with the rest, go lower… More isn’t always better with testosterone. Split the dose, give it 6 weeks minimum and I bet you will feel better and more stable.
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Dropping your dose will alter those numbers. Bigger cuts in dose mean bigger drops when the half-lives roll off. Drastic cuts mean a harder drop, but it will get you down quicker than a gradual step down. 300 mg today is 150 next Thursday. If you inject 200 mg next Thursday you jump to 350 mg, but the following Thursday you’re at 175 mg before injection. If you inject 100 instead of 200, you will be 250 and then 125 on the following injection day. If what you need is 125, you will feel great right before you inject. If you need 175, you’ll pass good and be on the other side of the peak by injection day.
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@bcostigan41 thanks for sharing! Appreciate it
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@hardartery man this stuff isn’t as simple as just inject and go! I’ve been feeling super depressed lately and I’ve thought about going 1 or 2 weeks without an injection (or AI) then start back up. Would this do any good and help or cause more damage?
Your levels would decline and when you start back on TRT it will take longer to build up in your system prolonging the process.
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@systemlord But with my Total and Free T being so high, couldn’t I spare a week with no injections to allow my levels (and e2) come down a bit? I just want to feel well again
I would lean towards a cut dose. All the way to zero and back up could be bumpy.
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Well I personally don’t think there is such a thing as T levels being too high, it either affects other things or doesn’t. If it does affect other things like, HCT, E2, PRL, PSA, thyroid or Cholesterol then yea it is too high. But if none of those things are affected negatively, just because it is above range on a lab test doesn’t mean anything.
Men in the Columbian army have tested as high as 1500 ng/dl naturally.
Some guys don’t feel good at the higher T for some reason. I don’t know if t’s a matter of too much too soon or just a reaction to the free T.
Well that means the higher T is affecting something else though.
Usually it is related to HCT, the older you are the more susceptible you are to increased HCT levels with exogenous testosterone administration.
It could be. I have no scientific evidence to explain it, I just theorize that the body has to adjust to normal levels first and repair itself for a while. The higher dose is like nitrous in an engine with leaky seals for these guys.
Yea I totally agree that some men do not feel as well when their trough is up around a thousand, but some men do.
Also seem men need that much to alleviate symptoms.
Usually when men don’t feel good with high T levels it is because their free T is disproportionately high to their TT (low SHBG) or high HCT.
At least that is what I have seen through the years.
Also these men tend to be older. 45+
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