For what reason?
TRT = trading years off your life?
Not seeing the edits. Perhaps you are mistaken.
Heās right, I edited my post because it was way too long and turning into a semi rant.
As he said about the heart health monitoring, I want to see if there are any morphology changes over time that would warn me Iām on too much T. I donāt think this is something I would necessarily see on blood tests.
What I said initially in my post was that Iām not looking to feel normal. I want to feel great, optimized. Thereās no TOT forum but thatās what it would be called I guess, even though I donāt care about semantics.
I just believe thereās most likely a tradeoff at some point, and what I was saying is that Iād rather live 10-20 fewer years feeling amazing than living those extra 10-20 years feeling āok, I guessā. Thatās a tradeoff Iām happy to make.
Itās possible that there is no tradeoff and I could find myself feeling amazing at 26mg/day (182mg/week) and stay there and live even longer than I would have at 18mg/day. I donāt know and Iām not claiming to, just that the tradeoff is fine with me if thatās what it takes.
But I will absolutely give lower dosages a chance and see how I feel.
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Well then I guess your statement and their statement make complete sense.
Youāre right, sorry about that. Post felt too long for anyone to read through so I edited it. And thanks for confirming the heart monitoring thing; I feel itās something I might not see on blood tests and while Iām happy to trade off some years of my life if necessary in order to feel orders of magnitude better, Iām not going to be completely stupid and reckless either.
Perhaps Iām just not very knowledgeable on this, but how would you determine the difference between exercise related changes to the heart, which, Iād think, would be expected and potentially parhological ones from to much testosterone?
Genuinely curious.
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Cool, thank you.
Well that depends on whose reality we are discussing. 
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Thank you, I appreciate that coming from you, I have a lot of respect for the depth of the research you do.
2.5 weeks into 80mg 2x/week (160mg/week) protocol (4.5 weeks with the two initial weeks at 70mg 2x/week).
Physically the difference is starting to become obvious. Iām definitely putting on muscle and getting stronger. Several people have commented completely unprompted on my changes, including the girl Iām sleeping with who has no idea Iām taking Test. Itās apparently so blatant she canāt stop mentioning it.
Mentally Iām not feeling the focus and calm confidence I felt initially, Iām starting to procrastinate again and lose myself in my head. I also get aggravated by small things the way I did in the last few years, and Iām not as driven as I was for a bit at the beginning of TRT.
I think Iām definitely feeling highs and lows on 2x/week. Yesterday before my evening shot I was feeling particularly weak minded. More whiny and feeling sorry for myself, it was very noticeable.
Still my plan is to finish 80mg 2x/week for another 5.5 weeks, then try the same dose with ED injections to compare, and then try much less (18mg/day) and much more (26mg/day).
On a good note, libido is definitely up. Not what it was when I was 18yo, but maybe what it was when I was 34-35yo, so still a clear improvement.
To clarify 80 mg 2x 160 total a week?
Yes.
UPDATE:
Iāve been on 160mg/week (in 2 injections of 80mg) for now 11 weeks without changing my protocol at all.
Overall Iām feeling much better. Iāve put on 15lbs and lost 1% of BF in the process (from 12% to 11%), according to a fancy machine in my drās office. My lifts have gone up by 30-50% and I definitely have a much āharderā look.
I feel a lot more confident, the way I used to when I was younger. A lot of my social anxiety is gone (not completely though) and I tend to overthink things less than I used to (but still do more than Iād like to).
My doc has prescribed DHEA and Pregnenolone, both pharma grade micronized slow release, 25mg/day DHEA and 50mg/day Preg, because both are low.
The question is whether to start DHEA/Preg now or change my TRT protocol first, as doing both at the same time would obviously be a terrible experiment. The next TRT protocol I was going to try is 22mg/day, which is essentially (154mg/week) the same dose Iām on but with daily injections. If I start DHEA/Preg now I lose forever the opportunity to run the same TRT dose in 2x/week and ED injections and see how the difference affects me, and thatās a big deal.
Once I figure out whether daily or 2x/week injections work best for me, I could fine tune DHEA/Preg and then try 18mg/day and 26mg/day (or their 2x/week equivalent, depending on which turned out to work best for me) for TRT and it wonāt really matter that I introduced other variables in the meantime.
So i think thatās what Iāll do. Iāll switch TRT protocols at 12 weeks this coming Monday to 22mg/day and wait 8-10 weeks to see how I feel before starting DHEA/Preg.
After that, Iāll look into pharma grade GH, as my IGF-1 is pretty low. Iām also looking into peptides, specifically BPC-157 to heal two nagging tendon injuries, and I might start that in the next couple of weeks actually.
Also looking into daily Cialis. My erections are great but apparently it has a ton of other anti-aging/optimization benefits.
I would only change one variable at a time, otherwise you would not know what cause the good or negative outcome.
Have you had your SHBG checked again? Youāre thinking is that it would come down with exogenous T, not sure if there is research behind that but I digress.
Im not sure you are going to find much relief going from twice a week to 7 times a week. Maybe a little more stability, maybe. If your DHEA and Preg are low I would move to supplement those first and see how you are feeling after 14 days. Those changes should be pretty apparent.
My SHBG dropped to 40 from 80 before starting TRT. Itās been dropping steadily every time I got tested since starting TRT. First 70, then 60, and now 40. So at least in my case itās clearly dropping over time.
To be honest, the main reason Iām excited to try ED injections is from reading @dextermorgan 's log. Heās the only true TRT success story I can think of after 4-5 years of research and reading forums, etcā¦where it seems heās found a pretty much optimal protocol and is getting only benefits from it (both mental/emotional and physical), and he described feeling a huge difference between 2x/week and ED injections.
I started my TRT journey with ED injections but was changing my protocol every week or 2 weeks back then, so I never gave it a chance.
Another reason is that Iāve been getting a bit of acne on my back and actually today just saw a purple pimple of cystic acne on there. It doesnāt mean more are coming, but I think daily injections could just be healthier in a lot of ways, including for my heart.
Iām at 1300ng/dL for TT and 25ng/dL for FT on trough right now, but I know from experimenting with daily injections for a bit that on 22mg/day I was at 1700ng/dL TT, so I canāt imagine how high I am 24 hours after an 80mg injection, I could easily be around 24-2500ng/dL.
About DHEA/Preg, Iām reading so much contrasting info online, but no one really seems to have seen positive effects long term. A lot describe feeling great for 2-3 weeks and then horrible (panic attacks, built tolerance, gyno, acne, etcā¦). Some say anything > 10mg/day is way too much, others take 400mg/day. It seems thereās research showing itās an antagonist to GABA receptorsā¦(EDIT on this: Preg is a GABA agonist and Preg Sulfate is a GABA antagonist) Iām starting to think I should ask my doc for 5mg pills and start with that instead of 25mg pills, especially because theyāre the micronized pharma grade kind.
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Youāre right, if I go with DHEA/Preg instead of daily Test injections change of protocol, Iāll definitely do one and then the other, probably Preg first and then DHEA.
Haā¦yes his transformation has been substantial. There are others on here, or from the past, who have had success. Unfortunately success stories generally dont stick around. Ive had a lot of success with most of my protocols, some better than others. I even did EOD for a while @ 220mg a week. Ive run through UGL anastrazole and bottomed out my E2 so bad my knees and shoulders hurt for a month. Ive run through UGL tamoxifen thinking I needed it but in the end really just T twice a week and a bit of patience.
Keep us posted on your next step. Everyone learns from everyone else here even if its just anecdotal. āUnique voice among the many in this choir. Tuning into each other, lift all higherā - MJ Keenan & B Howerdel
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Thanks, I will. I decided I want to try ED injection with the same weekly dose (160mg/week) for 8-10 weeks before DHEA and Preg, one reason being that I know acne is a very common side effect of DHEA and I donāt want to have to stop taking it if it works otherwise because I start getting cystic acne or something that I wouldnāt get on ED T injections.
Anecdotally I know a guy personally whose acne problems disappeared when he switched from 2x/week to ED. So the plan right now is 8-10 weeks of ED injections starting this Monday, then try DHEA, and then Preg.
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