[quote]Therizza wrote:
Since when have the Swiss liked anything not Swiss? (besides money) You all act surprised, as if Swiss culture isn’t xenophobic to begin with.[/quote]
As someone that has now been an immigrant in Switzerland for several years, I can say that this is complete bullshit. The Swiss are no more xenophobic than any other country.
You do know that more than 20% of the people living in Switzerland are not Swiss?
A certain amount of worry is understandable, I guess, especially in these economically hard times.[/quote]
How do minarets relate to hard times?
Can you name one country which defines itself as a democracy, that has codified into its constitution an article that specifically targets and stigmatizes a specific religion. The Swiss people may not be any more xenophobic than others, but the country is sure giving a bad vibe.[/quote]
I like how you through democracy as a requirement, because if not, we’d have 95% of all Muslim nations. Good job.
Accusations of xenophobia is an overused tool of the left that they use to manipulate people. What the Swiss have voted for is to keep THIER country looking like it is THEIR country.
To have the proper perspective on this you need to look at what is happened to Western Europe. In the last twenty years countrys have gone from having almost no muslims to almost overnight having massive muslim ghettoes in many major cities.
If you go into one of those muslim ghettoes it is like you have stepped into another country. Because all the stores signs will be written in Arabic, very few people will be wearing western clothing, most of the women will be wearing burqas and there will be mosques whose architecture is totally incongruous with the rest of the city with towering watchtowers that make the place feel like some kind of mideastern Auschwitz.
Those watchtowers are how muslims really put their stamp on an area. It is a highly visible way of claiming a neighborhood and letting people know about it. It is just like how gangbangers spray paint their tags all over a neighborhood that they claim as theirs. And just like with gangbangers over time it drives people who don’t want to be around that out of the neighborhood increasing the ghettoization.
The Swiss are not stupid for banning muslims from putting their stamp on a neighborhood and turning it into a no go zone. The Swiss are wise for looking out for the best interests of themselves and their children.
[quote]lixy wrote:
Can you name one country which defines itself as a democracy, that has codified into its constitution an article that specifically targets and stigmatizes a specific religion. [/quote]
Turkey!!!
Now, which religion did Turkey specifically legislate against? And, why?
[quote]Therizza wrote:
Since when have the Swiss liked anything not Swiss? (besides money) You all act surprised, as if Swiss culture isn’t xenophobic to begin with.[/quote]
As someone that has now been an immigrant in Switzerland for several years, I can say that this is complete bullshit. The Swiss are no more xenophobic than any other country.
You do know that more than 20% of the people living in Switzerland are not Swiss?
A certain amount of worry is understandable, I guess, especially in these economically hard times.[/quote]
How do minarets relate to hard times?
[/quote]
I think you realize I was not referring to the ban on minarets but to xenophobia. In hard times with unemployment rising, people start to fear immigrants are taking away their jobs and there will be a certain resentment towards immigrants. This is nothing specific to Switzerland.
[quote]
Can you name one country which defines itself as a democracy, that has codified into its constitution an article that specifically targets and stigmatizes a specific religion. The Swiss people may not be any more xenophobic than others, but the country is sure giving a bad vibe.[/quote]
Look, if 400’000 muslims were able to live with 4 minarets for decades, not being able to build anymore will hardly have an impact on practicing their religion.
Apart from that, what is stigmatizing islam are the muslims themselves.
[quote]lixy wrote:
Today, a poll in Sweden about the same issue showed 26 procent want a ban on minarets.
Edit: Sweden has five mosques.[/quote]
You do realize that the polls in Switzerland shortly before the referendum said that only 37% would vote for the ban, when in fact 57% voted for the ban. So there is a chance even in Sweden a majority would vote for a ban.
[quote]chris666 wrote:
Can you name one country which defines itself as a democracy, that has codified into its constitution an article that specifically targets and stigmatizes a specific religion. The Swiss people may not be any more xenophobic than others, but the country is sure giving a bad vibe.[/quote]
Look, if 400’000 muslims were able to live with 4 minarets for decades, not being able to build anymore will hardly have an impact on practicing their religion.
Apart from that, what is stigmatizing islam are the muslims themselves.[/quote]
I am not arguing that 1) banning minarets has an impact on the way one can practice his/her religion, 2) Muslims aren’t giving a bad image to Islam.
I asked if you knew of a country which singles out (in a bad way) a religion in its most fundamental law. I don’t know of any post-1948, but I may be wrong.
[quote]lixy wrote:
Today, a poll in Sweden about the same issue showed 26 procent want a ban on minarets.
Edit: Sweden has five mosques.[/quote]
You do realize that the polls in Switzerland shortly before the referendum said that only 37% would vote for the ban, when in fact 57% voted for the ban. So there is a chance even in Sweden a majority would vote for a ban. [/quote]
I do. That was kinda the point I was trying to make.
[quote]Therizza wrote:
Since when have the Swiss liked anything not Swiss? (besides money) You all act surprised, as if Swiss culture isn’t xenophobic to begin with.[/quote]
As someone that has now been an immigrant in Switzerland for several years, I can say that this is complete bullshit. The Swiss are no more xenophobic than any other country.
You do know that more than 20% of the people living in Switzerland are not Swiss?
A certain amount of worry is understandable, I guess, especially in these economically hard times.[/quote]
How do minarets relate to hard times?
Can you name one country which defines itself as a democracy, that has codified into its constitution an article that specifically targets and stigmatizes a specific religion. The Swiss people may not be any more xenophobic than others, but the country is sure giving a bad vibe.[/quote]
Why are a people not allowed to dislike a foreign culture? The vibe is that of a people actually liking their place to remain looking like it’s theirs and slowly being saturated with another foreign culture.
They Just don;t like it. It should be reason enough.
And it should be reason enough for you to change your religion or shut up or leave.
[quote]chris666 wrote:
Can you name one country which defines itself as a democracy, that has codified into its constitution an article that specifically targets and stigmatizes a specific religion. The Swiss people may not be any more xenophobic than others, but the country is sure giving a bad vibe.[/quote]
Look, if 400’000 muslims were able to live with 4 minarets for decades, not being able to build anymore will hardly have an impact on practicing their religion.
Apart from that, what is stigmatizing islam are the muslims themselves.[/quote]
I am not arguing that 1) banning minarets has an impact on the way one can practice his/her religion, 2) Muslims aren’t giving a bad image to Islam.
I asked if you knew of a country which singles out (in a bad way) a religion in its most fundamental law. I don’t know of any post-1948, but I may be wrong.[/quote]\
You hold the race of the people who’s country you leech off of to such high standards. LOL.
But your people are the most oppressive and violent religious zealots on the planet. Ohh the Irony.
and
Hypocrisy - the act of pretending to have beliefs, opinions, virtues, feelings, qualities, or standards that one does not actually have. Hypocrisy is thus a kind of lie. Hypocrisy may come from a desire to hide from others actual motives or feelings.
[quote]lixy wrote:
I asked if you knew of a country which singles out (in a bad way) a religion in its most fundamental law. I don’t know of any post-1948, but I may be wrong.[/quote]
Once again, Turkey. (The country,I’m not calling you a turkey)
Now, please remind everyone which religion, in particular, Turkey singles out…
[quote]lixy wrote:
I asked if you knew of a country which singles out (in a bad way) a religion in its most fundamental law. I don’t know of any post-1948, but I may be wrong.[/quote]
Once again, Turkey. (The country,I’m not calling you a turkey)
Now, please remind everyone which religion, in particular, Turkey singles out…[/quote]
I don’t know. I just had a look at it, and I didn’t see anything of the sort. Please elaborate.
[quote]lixy wrote:
I asked if you knew of a country which singles out (in a bad way) a religion in its most fundamental law. I don’t know of any post-1948, but I may be wrong.[/quote]
Once again, Turkey. (The country,I’m not calling you a turkey)
Now, please remind everyone which religion, in particular, Turkey singles out…[/quote]
I don’t know. I just had a look at it, and I didn’t see anything of the sort. Please elaborate.[/quote]
Christianity it seems…Wierd, I thought they being swinging Jews from the gallows, but apparently they come down hard on Christians.
[quote]lixy wrote:
I asked if you knew of a country which singles out (in a bad way) a religion in its most fundamental law. I don’t know of any post-1948, but I may be wrong.[/quote]
Once again, Turkey. (The country,I’m not calling you a turkey)
Now, please remind everyone which religion, in particular, Turkey singles out…[/quote]
I don’t know. I just had a look at it, and I didn’t see anything of the sort. Please elaborate.[/quote]
You seem to like wikipedia sources, so check out this:
Also, from wiki:
[quote]
…In 2007, a series of events regarding state secularism and the role of the judiciary in the legislature have occurred. These included the controversial presidential election of Abdullah Gül, who in the past had been involved with Islamist parties;[36] and the government’s proposal to lift the headscarf ban in universities, which was annulled by the Constitutional Court, leading to a fine and a near ban of the ruling party.[37][/quote]
[quote]lixy wrote:
Today, a poll in Sweden about the same issue showed 26 procent want a ban on minarets.
Edit: Sweden has five mosques.[/quote]
You do realize that the polls in Switzerland shortly before the referendum said that only 37% would vote for the ban, when in fact 57% voted for the ban. So there is a chance even in Sweden a majority would vote for a ban. [/quote]
I do. That was kinda the point I was trying to make.[/quote]
So your point is a ban on minarets would also be approved by the majority of Swedes?
A ban would most likely be approved in most european countries. Maybe Muslims should stop sending out bad vibes.
“The Swiss have failed to give a clear signal for diversity, freedom of religion and human rights,” said Omar Al-Rawi, integration representative of the Islamic Denomination in Austria, which said its reaction was “grief and deep disappointment.”
Oh really? Just like Muslim controlled nations give a clear signal for Diversity, Freedom of Religion and Human Rights? You can’t be a homosexual, a member of a religion other then Islam or have a different belief in any Islamic nation, and you are crying about Switzerland? Clean up your own act first, you pathetic tool. It’s Muslim apologists like this that aren’t helping the situation at all.
There is such a double standard among Muslims it’s hilarious.
I don’t believe it’s correct to say that the Turkish Constitution singles out Islam in any way.
Rather it prohibits religion-driven government, without specifying any particular religion.
Of course, it’s correct that the Islamic religion is the only one that is any threat to the people for installing a theocracy, but the same principles would apply to any other religion that tried to establish a political party.
[quote]HynesKetchup wrote:
Oh really? Just like Muslim controlled nations give a clear signal for Diversity, Freedom of Religion and Human Rights? You can’t be a homosexual, a member of a religion other then Islam or have a different belief in any Islamic nation, and you are crying about Switzerland? Clean up your own act first, you pathetic tool. It’s Muslim apologists like this that aren’t helping the situation at all.
There is such a double standard among Muslims it’s hilarious.[/quote]
Islamic countries, in general, don’t claim diversity, freedom of religion or anything of the sort. And in all of them, with no exception, human rights and freedoms are getting better, not worse. And like I said before, Islamic countries don’t give a damn if you’re a Buddhist, a Zoroastrian or a Scientologist. Anything that’s non-Islamic is shot down.
Switzerland is (now) different in those regards.
The guy you quoted has been in Austria for half a century. What “own act” is he supposed to clean?
Islamic countries, in general, don’t claim diversity, freedom of religion or anything of the sort. And in all of them, with no exception, human rights and freedoms are getting better, not worse. [/quote]
RFLMAO!
“We only hung 200 gays this year, Abdullah! Surely the world must be impressed by our progress!”[/quote]
I don’t think impressing the world is the prime concern of gay-right activists or their opponents. In fact, I doubt it factors in at all.
But I know for sure that there is a public debate, that some majority-Muslim countries have made homosexual behavior legal or cut down on punishments in the past decade, and in countries with a sex-tourism industry, people turns a blind eye to the wealthy old male foreigner holding hands with the local male teenager.