Strong Words... Atomic Bomb

[Nate_Green]

It seems that if anyone on this site wants a bunch of replies to their own topic, they should just include XCelticX’s name in the Subject.

He brings the crowds.

-Nate

[dastang23]

As someone who is currently deployed let me tell you what I think. Maybe this reply is to late to be read but what the hell. As Americans we hold ourselves to standards that no one even tries to uphold. I am not supporting the actions of anyone in our miltary who screws up, honestly incidents like those performed by a certain female and a leash make me sick. We have a strict code of Values that we try to live by, try, we are all human. When we look at what we did to a group of people decades ago and wonder why or was it right we should not forget what other countries do to us. IF we have p.o.w.s we take care of them better than they usually have in their own county(in most cases). What happens to an American if he is caught??? Do you think the Geneva Conventions are abided by? YA f*cking right. IS killing civilans right no, is war hell, yes. Will it always happen, yes, What would you do to make sure your family was safe if they were threatened? “The End Justifies the Means” Niccilo Machavelie

[dfabri1]

Take the quote with a grain of salt. Oppenheimer was the ‘supervisor’ of the project. He was not directly responsible for the scientific contribution, that would be Edward Teller, Fermi and Ulaw. Mostly Teller, and if I remember correctly Oppenheimer and Teller hated each other like poison. Teller testified to the government that Oppenheimer had no understanding of the project and was in over his head.

Oppenheimer only spoke out like this and was against the futher development of atomic weapons after Teller threw him under the bus.

Read, Herbert York, The Advisers: Oppenheimer, Teller and the Superbomb (1976).

[Trailblazer]

[quote]Nate Green wrote:
It seems that if anyone on this site wants a bunch of replies to their own topic, they should just include XCelticX’s name in the Subject.

He brings the crowds.

-Nate[/quote]

LOL…yeah, no shit.

[Mufasa]

I just wanted to add a few points to an already interesting thread:

1. Oppenheimers statement (that started this thread) was one of the enthusiasm of the Scientist…think about it…what had been done was that the enoumous power locked within the atom…the “Power of the Universe”… had been a)identified b)manipulated and concentrated and c) a way had been found to release it. This was not a moral judgement on the eventual use of that power. (By the way, historically man has used Scientific advances as much for War as for peace…this time in history was no different).

2. There is a theme that keeps showing up in this thread that simply is not supported by the words of the participants even years later (read David McCollough’s “Truman”).

While the Bombs (in addition to our overall military and economic might) may have given us a position of strentgh after the War…make no mistake about it…the decision to use the Bomb was a military one, meant to hopefully end the war and to prevent millions of casulaties that would have resulted with the invasion of the Japanese mainland…

This was not a decision meant to strenghthen our position against the Chinese and Russians. That may have well been an after effect (albiet short lived) of dropping the Bombs…but that was not the primary reason for dropping them.

3. Historic documents and the words of many of the participants in the decision to use the Bomb are clear…Roosevelt would have come to the same decision.

4. For those passing moral judgments 60 years later, would it have been morally “better” to have literally millions of more lives lost, when you had weapons within your arsenal that could have (and did) bring a swift end to the War?

I think History would have been MUCH more cruel on Truman and all those who had to make this difficult decision had that been the case.

Mufasa

[pookie]

[quote]dastang21 wrote:
As Americans we hold ourselves to standards that no one even tries to uphold.
[/quote]

I’m sure most american soldiers do. But it takes very little events like Abu Graib to destroy all those efforts.

Especially when the Pentagon tries to bury the story, then minimize it’s impact.

Every little incident that gets caught on tape or film is shown ad nauseam on Al-Jazeera; don’t think that the enemy doesn’t know how to do its own propaganda.

Similarly, detaining prisoners indefinitely with no access to lawyers shows the world that you’ve got standards for americans and other standards for foreigners; that’s NOT a “higher standard”. Detaining people without due process is what Saddam and other despots do, not the US (or at least, not before this war).

Yes, it’s harder to live up to a higher standard; and yes, it’s extremely frustrating to play by rules that the enemy doesn’t follow. That’s the cost of keeping “the moral high ground”.

This war has had a whole bunch of missteps, from Bush using the word “crusade” to describe the war; to bombing of weddings, to video footage of marines shooting prostrate iraqis in a mosque, to desecrations of the Qu’ran… and on, and on. If there’s any Iraqis that still believe you “hold high standards” they must be a very small minority.

If only the american people would protest vigorously those egregious mistakes; instead, the small minorities that denounce those actions and called “unpatriotic”, “traitors”, accused of “giving support to the enemy” and so on.

[Will_Tagye]

Why do you feel so bad about the Japanese? Why aren’t you crying about how we fire bombed Dresden? Why is there a memorial in Hiroshima to the bombing and the Japanese people understand that war is war, and yet you are here crying about some shit that happened 60 years ago? Why is the largest number of tourists to the Pearl Harbor Memorial Japanese? Why are you wasting so much time posting when your results in the gym have been such shite?

You know no where else in the world do people spend so much time making villans out of themselves. It is pretty sad that the life of a 19 year old is so easy that they have to try to find something to feel bad about. I got an idea, how about you feel bad that your peers are risking thier lives overseas while you are beating up the military decisions of 60 years ago. Well, I bet you were too smart to waste yourself in the military. Is that what you tell yourself?

[ephrem]

…far from being an avid poster on the forums, i would like to bring this to your attention: the full transcript of ‘the fog of war’, and interview with Robert McNamara, former defense secretary for the USA; Errol Morris: Film

…i saw the movie when it was aired on the BBC a while back, and one thing stuck: he spoke about the firebombings on Japan. 76 cities were bombed, causing countless civilian deaths. One bombingraid on Tokio lead to the deaths of 100.000 civilians in one night. He said to be certain that if the USA had lost the war, the men who ordered the bombings were to be tried as warcriminals…

[XCelticX]

[quote]rainjack wrote:
You are mistaking my disdain for an utter fool such as you for roid rage. ANother subject you know absolutely nothing about yet feel qualified to comment on.

This is not roid rage. This is me defending what the greatest nation on the face of the earth did 60 years ago to provide a place for idiots like you spew their bullshit without fear.

You can call it whatever you want - but just know that speaking from ignorance like you have been doing doesn’t further your cause at all.
[/quote]

No rain, I haven’t seen a SINGLE person on this website(even the ones that don’t like me) reply to me with such utter disdain and anger like you do. Also, I don’t remember you ever being THAT much of an ass(cussing and cussing, insult after insult without saying anything meaningful) until recently, which is why I suggested your cycle could have something to do with it.

Why can’t you act your age and disagree with my intelligently instead of throwing around insults that make you feel like a ‘T-Man’.

And you take the chicken shit apologist way out. When did it become sad to defend what we did to end a World War and stop the Russians in their tracks? I guess Patton was a manic depressive then since he wanted to attack Russia after Germany was defeated.

I think it is terrible anytime innocent people die, especially 250,000. You suggesting that there is something wrong with that, and that it is just ‘chicken shit apologist’ behavior, shows me what little concern and sympathy you have for the lives of those people. Did I know any of them? No. Did the Japanese kill innocent people? Yea. That doesn’t make that massive loss of life a good thing that you should just shrug off, as anything else would be too apologetic LOL

Regardless of wether or not it was necissary, as a human being you should have some sympathy. Think of all the people who lost family members, what if it happened to you?

The one to be pitied is you. But your screaming ignorance begs the question - Why should I pity one that is oblivious to reality? It must be a very pretty world you’ve created in your head.

I DO sympathize with Japan for that massive loss of life, or murder, however you wana put it. But I also sympathize with the other countries that happened to(to lesser degrees thank god) such as America, Poland, Russia, etc.

You have to prove murder dill hole. You can’t just say it and make it so. I’ve asked you at least twice now to prove it was murder. But you revert to opinion. You even admitted that you haven’t studied this war, yet you know that ir was murder?

What a dick.

Murder was too strong a word, but hey you live and learn right. I’ve learned something from this thread, and I sure hope you have.

[quote]
To be honest, the only one who sounds like a little kid on a playground is you, but thats because you can’t write 2 sentences without a long string of insults and cussing… VERY mature.

I’m not going to feel bad for calling a spade a spade. You are full of shit, and most everyone on every thread you’ve started knows it. Can you not look around and see what a laughing stock you are on this website? People have made avatars out of your photos. They mock you at every turn. I’m just calling attention to what is obvious to everyone around here except you. [/quote]

No one else throws flames, insults, and angry words at me or anyone else like you do. You’ve made it a habit, one you shouldn’t be proud of. NO ONE has an avatar made out of my photos, and NO ONE mocks me at every turn(except you, thank god you’re bad at it). You need to realize that you are the only one doing what you are doing. Other people disagree with me, sure, but they do it without being a dick.

[XCelticX]

[quote]randman wrote:
Wait a minute. You start this thread with of how the U.S. strategy was off for choosing the target they did. You then suggest another target (a military station) and then you predict it would end the war. Yet…you admit that you’ve never studied the war!!! Are you really this much of an opinionated loser? What makes it worse is you’re sitting here defending all of your theories and opinions vigorously but you haven’t even studied the war. What makes it ten times worse is that your arguing with people who do know quite a lot about it from their comprehensive posts on the subject.
[/quote]

Being opinionated doesn’t make me a loser. You’re right, I haven’t studied the war, and I admitted it so that those who HAVE would share their knowledge.

[quote]
I’ve read more bullshit on this site lately from little boys under 20 years of age I’m starting to lose faith in the next generation. Are these the idiots that our schools are producing these days??? XCelticX you are the definition of an online forum troll. Go get edumucated, smart ass…[/quote]

I AM ‘edumucated’. Of course there’s always more to learn, but in this thread I am stating my opinion FROM WHAT I KNOW!

By the way genius, not having studied World War 2 in depth doesn’t equate to idiocy, trolling, being a smart ass, or being uneducated.

Also, you didn’t contribute a single thing to this thread. You didn’t even have one sentence in your post relating to the subject, so why try? If there’s a useless poster here, its you.

[XCelticX]

[quote]Massif wrote:
Here we go, smart ass. Pay attention.

You couldn’t understand what happened because you have a completely different frame of reference for their actions.
[/quote]

EVERYONE has a different frame of reference for the actions that were taken. We are all individuals who have lived different lives, been raised different ways, been educated differently, etc etc. You have a different frame of reference from those who made that decision to, does that mean YOU don’t understand either? By what you just said, yes.

You are judging their actions by what you have experienced in the last 20 years. Unless you had gone through World War 2, and had the social and cultural experiences of the 30’s and 40’s, you couldn’t possibly understand an action that was based on a person’s interaction with these variables. The mindset that allowed this decision to be made was a result of these variables.

So you’re proposing that if I had lived through the 30’s and 40’s I would have a completely different opinion on the decision that was made? So no one who did live through that shared my opinion or were opposed to the bombing? I don’t think so.

If I see a man who has had his family killed, I think “Poor bastard. I can’t imagine what he is going through”. Once again, I have no frame of reference, and therefore can’t comprehend what he is experiencing.

Once again, this has nothing to do with the bombing, unless you are suggesting that those who made the decision to drop the bombs had their whole families killed…

You could compare their actions to your experiences of today’s standards, but that doesn’t mean you understand them. In exactly the same way, I could try to imagine what the man whose family was killed would be experiencing, but to do so I would have to compare it to what my experiences were, which would be clearly inadequate for these purposes.

So, there you go. I told you “EXACTLY” how you don’t understand it.

PS It’s Great Saging Massif, bitch.

You told me “EXACTLY” how I don’t understand how a man who’s family was killed feels, and NOTHING more.

[XCelticX]

[quote]Sifu wrote:
xcelticx you are clueless and making bold statements about something that you obviously know very little about.

To compare the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki to happened to the jews is absurd.
[/quote]

Now I agree with you after hearing what some of the more educated members in this area had to say.

Let me clue you in on some facts.

Little boy, the first bomb which was used on Hiroshima was made with uranium. A sizable portion of which had been recovered from a german U boat that was on it’s way to Japan when Germany surrendered.

The Japanese had intended to use this same uranium for a dirty bomb attack on San Francisco three days before the Hiroshima bomb. We didn’t know if this uranium was for a dirty bomb or an atomic one. What we did know is what it could be used for.

How bout a reference to your source? That sounds pretty far-fetched to me, although I couldn’t say it is completely wrong. How would any of us know what the Japanese ‘intended’ to do? I don’t think they would reveal that information, even after the war.

Another fact is we didn’t just have a whole bunch of these things sitting around so we could just go ahead and waste a few. That is part of the reason why there was such a short time between attacks. We tricked them into thinking we had more.

If we gave them sufficient warning they would have moved all of their pows into their cities. As it was a few Americans were killed in those blasts but there could have been a whole lot more.

There also was the concern that if a bomb malfunctioned it could be recovered by the enemy and they would learn how to make their own. Which was another reason for using them on big targets.

Are you serious? I highly doubt many people were concerned about that… yea I can see the bomb just plopping into a street in the middle of Hiroshima without anything happening, then a bunch of Japanese finding it, disecting it, and dropping it on America…

The Japanese used biological weapons in China. One of the nastier ones was fleas infected with a virilent strain of bubonic plague. To this day in Northern China there are occasional outbreaks of the strain of plague that was created and used by the Japanese.

The Japanese leaders were not the least bit shy about sacrificing their people. Just look at the invasion of Okinawa. The American generals were expecting a million American casualties invading Japan.

They certainly weren’t surrendering and we had no way of knowing what the Germans had or had not given them.

Check out this article from the BBC:
Hitler ‘tested small atom bomb’
BBC NEWS | Europe | Hitler 'tested small atom bomb'

I’m not disagree that the Japanese did terrible things, and that plenty of them deserved to die for those atrocities. I just think its horrible that the civilians following those bloodthirsty fools had to die for them.

Interesting article…

[rainjack]

[quote]XCelticX wrote:
No rain, I haven’t seen a SINGLE person on this website(even the ones that don’t like me) reply to me with such utter disdain and anger like you do. Also, I don’t remember you ever being THAT much of an ass(cussing and cussing, insult after insult without saying anything meaningful) until recently, which is why I suggested your cycle could have something to do with it.[/quote]

Then you haven’t read many of my posts. This is T-Nation. Not Sunday school. People cuss. I cuss. I have cussed ad nauseum since I began posting on here over 2 years ago.

If you had bothered to read my p[osts in the steroid forum, you would notice that my temper is noticeably diminished.

You are wrong and you are ignorant of anything about me - so please stick to what you know.

If you will take a quick look around, you will see folks cussing at you all the time. Do they also get your expert diagnosis of roid rage?

Why can’t you act your age and disagree with my intelligently instead of throwing around insults that make you feel like a ‘T-Man’.

If you would gain some intelligence - that might be possible. But your own self admitted ignorance wrt WWII makes it impossible for you discuss anything in this thread intelligently.

You are a punk kid that, were you my child, would have a very sore ass for speaking and acting the way you do.

I think it is terrible anytime innocent people die, especially 250,000. You suggesting that there is something wrong with that, and that it is just ‘chicken shit apologist’ behavior, shows me what little concern and sympathy you have for the lives of those people. Did I know any of them? No. Did the Japanese kill innocent people? Yea. That doesn’t make that massive loss of life a good thing that you should just shrug off, as anything else would be too apologetic LOL

Tell me what good your cryiong and whining over something that happened 60 years ago will accomplish? That is chicken shit. Be a man - move forward and shut the hell up.

Regardless of wether or not it was necissary, as a human being you should have some sympathy. Think of all the people who lost family members, what if it happened to you?

I would be dead - and my family would be dead. It was WAR shit head. Newsflash - People die in a war. You seem to think that those 250,000 would be alive today had they not been bombed. You don’t know that. You are assuming outcomes that you have no business assuming.

Murder was too strong a word, but hey you live and learn right. I’ve learned something from this thread, and I sure hope you have.

No I haven’t. That’s because I studied WWII. Nothing new has been discussed here. Once again. This war happened 60 years ago. It’s in your history book - look it up.

[quote]No one else throws flames, insults, and angry words at me or anyone else like you do. You’ve made it a habit, one you shouldn’t be proud of. NO ONE has an avatar made out of my photos, and NO ONE mocks me at every turn(except you, thank god you’re bad at it). You need to realize that you are the only one doing what you are doing. Other people disagree with me, sure, but they do it without being a dick.
[/quote]

Sparky - look around you. Everyone flames you. Are you fucking delusional? Can you not see that you are a laughing stock? You have been called a troll by many folks.

The only ‘habit’ I have is that of not having patience with delusional idiots such as yourself. Take a poll. Start a thread and take a poll about how people view you if you won’t believe me.

Yes there is an avatar made out of your photo - I wouldn’t have said so otherwise.

I am the only one doing what I am doing? What the fuck is that supposed to mean? Do you want me to stop? I’ll stop when you quit posting ignorance and trying to pass it off as intelligence.

BTW - you were supposed to gathering proof that there were war crimes committed. What happened?

[XCelticX]

[quote]wtagye wrote:
Why do you feel so bad about the Japanese? Why aren’t you crying about how we fire bombed Dresden? Why is there a memorial in Hiroshima to the bombing and the Japanese people understand that war is war, and yet you are here crying about some shit that happened 60 years ago? Why is the largest number of tourists to the Pearl Harbor Memorial Japanese? Why are you wasting so much time posting when your results in the gym have been such shite?
[/quote]

LIKE I SAID: I feel bad for all of those who died unjustly in that and all wars, that includes ALL civilians.

The fact that something happened 60 years ago is NOT a good reason to stop discussing it. It was the biggest war the world has ever seen(and the only use of nuclear weapons in war), and you’re trying to make it out to be not important enough to talk about simply because it doesn’t directly affect us today…

LMAO at your gym comment. What the FUCK do my results in the gym have to do with World War 2, or my opinions? They don’t have anything to do with it, and its idiotic that you would try to connect the 2.

[quote]
You know no where else in the world do people spend so much time making villans out of themselves. It is pretty sad that the life of a 19 year old is so easy that they have to try to find something to feel bad about. I got an idea, how about you feel bad that your peers are risking thier lives overseas while you are beating up the military decisions of 60 years ago. Well, I bet you were too smart to waste yourself in the military. Is that what you tell yourself? [/quote]

Its not about feeling bad about something, its about finding the TRUTH instead of blindly following what our public school system throws at us in books. Don’t get mad at me because YOU don’t want to see outside of the box.

And yes, that is EXACTLY why I’m not in the military. I could sign up for it and take a chance at DYING without any real benefit, or I can stay a civilian, go to college, educate myself, have a good career, get a family, and everything else good in life. I’m not saying a soldier in our countries military can’t do those things, but they ALL take a big chance at having those dreams snuffed out by trying to ‘free’ a country that hates us… not to mention the fact that I didn’t vote for Bush, I hate the decisions he’s made, and I think it is VERY embarassing that a man of such LOW caliber can become the most important man in our country. Have you ever listened to him talk? He speaks alot of words, but never SAYS anything. And I’m not into invading a country that has nothing to do with 9-11, yet disguising it as just that. The sad thing is, alot of Americans are ignorant enough to believe that.

Anyway, that’s off topic, but that’s how I feel.

[XCelticX]

I want to thank you guys(especially Mufasa) for your posts. I’ve learned alot, and I realize that the Japanese leadership was ridiculously fanatic and sacrifical. I think the real victims are the civilians, of course, who had to put up with their leaders’ stubbourness and therefore paid the price through firebombings and later the atomic bombs. I find it hard to believe that after having Tokeo raped by bombings, the men in charge still wouldn’t surrender… but humans are capable of as much evil as good, I suppose.

[XCelticX]

[quote]rainjack wrote:
Then you haven’t read many of my posts. This is T-Nation. Not Sunday school. People cuss. I cuss. I have cussed ad nauseum since I began posting on here over 2 years ago.
[/quote]

I don’t have a problem with cussing, I do it enough myself. I just think you make yourself look like a fool by doing it over and over like a drunk energizer bunny.

If you had bothered to read my p[osts in the steroid forum, you would notice that my temper is noticeably diminished.

Diminish it in the OTHER forums.

You are wrong and you are ignorant of anything about me - so please stick to what you know.

Gladly, now you do the same.

If you will take a quick look around, you will see folks cussing at you all the time. Do they also get your expert diagnosis of roid rage?

Nope, but then again none of them diliberately find my posts so they can cuss and insult up a storm.

Why can’t you act your age and disagree with my intelligently instead of throwing around insults that make you feel like a ‘T-Man’.

If you would gain some intelligence - that might be possible. But your own self admitted ignorance wrt WWII makes it impossible for you discuss anything in this thread intelligently.

And your inability to respond decently and intelligently prevents you from doing the same.

I admitted I didn’t ‘know it all’ about WW2, as I’m sure you were just waiting to accuse me of believing. That doesn’t mean I can’t form opinions and discuss them based on what I do know…

You are a punk kid that, were you my child, would have a very sore ass for speaking and acting the way you do.

I would shoot myself if I were your child… you probably would’ve beat me to a pulp before I was 6 years old though.

I think it is terrible anytime innocent people die, especially 250,000. You suggesting that there is something wrong with that, and that it is just ‘chicken shit apologist’ behavior, shows me what little concern and sympathy you have for the lives of those people. Did I know any of them? No. Did the Japanese kill innocent people? Yea. That doesn’t make that massive loss of life a good thing that you should just shrug off, as anything else would be too apologetic LOL

Tell me what good your cryiong and whining over something that happened 60 years ago will accomplish? That is chicken shit. Be a man - move forward and shut the hell up.

So I’m only allowed to hold opinions and post about things that will accomplish something today? Don’t be ridiculous, that’s basically saying all historians are worthless.

Regardless of wether or not it was necissary, as a human being you should have some sympathy. Think of all the people who lost family members, what if it happened to you?

I would be dead - and my family would be dead. It was WAR shit head. Newsflash - People die in a war. You seem to think that those 250,000 would be alive today had they not been bombed. You don’t know that. You are assuming outcomes that you have no business assuming.

I never said they would still be alive today if not for the bomb, almost all would’ve died of old age. I’m sure more would’ve died in different kinds of bombings, or the invasion, if the atom bombs hadn’t been dropped.

I guarantee you there were alot of Japanese who had family members die at Hiroshima and Nagasaki but didn’t die themselves. Not all families live in the same city… and just because its a war doesn’t mean EVERYONE is gonna die genius.

Murder was too strong a word, but hey you live and learn right. I’ve learned something from this thread, and I sure hope you have.

No I haven’t. That’s because I studied WWII. Nothing new has been discussed here. Once again. This war happened 60 years ago. It’s in your history book - look it up.

If you’ve studied the war to any significant degree, you should’ve said something to counter the arguments I made, since you would know soooo much more about it lol

Admit it, you just came in here to rag on me and piss me off. In the process, you disagreed without saying anything to support your position.

No one else throws flames, insults, and angry words at me or anyone else like you do. You’ve made it a habit, one you shouldn’t be proud of. NO ONE has an avatar made out of my photos, and NO ONE mocks me at every turn(except you, thank god you’re bad at it). You need to realize that you are the only one doing what you are doing. Other people disagree with me, sure, but they do it without being a dick.

Sparky - look around you. Everyone flames you. Are you fucking delusional? Can you not see that you are a laughing stock? You have been called a troll by many folks.

A total of 2 people on this thread apart from you have posted what I would consider a flame. Flames are different from disagreement, you need to learn that.

If you are the only one calling me a laughing stock and delusional, where do you go off thinking that everyone is supporting you lol

The only ‘habit’ I have is that of not having patience with delusional idiots such as yourself. Take a poll. Start a thread and take a poll about how people view you if you won’t believe me.

Make a poll? LOL alot of people would view me as egotistical or a dumbass just for doing that, so no thanks.

Yes there is an avatar made out of your photo - I wouldn’t have said so otherwise.

Correction: There WAS an avatar made out of my photo, it only lasted a couple days. Don’t live in the past.

BTW - you were supposed to gathering proof that there were war crimes committed. What happened?

Do you HONESTLY think that there wasn’t a SINGLE American soldier who raped an Axis female, killed an innocent person, stole, or anything of that sort?

I don’t NEED proof for that, if you believe no U.S. soldier did that you are a helpless fool.

Soldiers from all of the countries involved did that, its human behavior. Our country is no exception.

[elevationgain]

[quote]XCelticX wrote:
I want to thank you guys(especially Mufasa) for your posts. I’ve learned alot, and I realize that the Japanese leadership was ridiculously fanatic and sacrifical. I think the real victims are the civilians, of course, who had to put up with their leaders’ stubbourness and therefore paid the price through firebombings and later the atomic bombs. I find it hard to believe that after having Tokeo raped by bombings, the men in charge still wouldn’t surrender… but humans are capable of as much evil as good, I suppose.[/quote]

This has been quite the thread…

When it comes down to it, I don’t think the lines can be split between a good side and an evil side. Both sides had particular intentions and the one thing that each side maintained was pride.

I’ve been to the peace park in Hiroshima, which was a definitely humbling, but hey, our leadership back then determined it was necessary, so that’s what had to happen, right? Walking around Peace Park, though, made me feel like the ugly American to a degree, lord knows I caught lots of looks from the Japanese.

Probably the same looks I gave them on the boat-ride out to visit the USS Arizona memorial in Hawaii.

I remember thinking,
“What the fuck? You fucking tourists are riding with me out to take a look at your forefather’s handi-work?”

It was an ugly, ugly war. The pride of the Japanese kept them from making clear decisions as the war came to a close, which in turn brought the swift and deadly end to the conflict.

GAINER

[Will_Tagye]

[quote]XCelticX wrote:
wtagye wrote:
Well, I bet you were too smart to waste yourself in the military. Is that what you tell yourself?

And yes, that is EXACTLY why I’m not in the military. [/quote]

Wow, good thing we just send the dumb people to make split second decisions with highly technical equipment that results in life or death. Someone should have told my USMC Infantry Squad Leader who had a full ride to Cornell, and all the Ring Knockers, in fact all the officers. I think you should say that in Jacksonville NC and explain what a waste all the Marines there are making of thier lives.

[rainjack]

[quote]XCelticX wrote:
Yes there is an avatar made out of your photo - I wouldn’t have said so otherwise.

Correction: There WAS an avatar made out of my photo, it only lasted a couple days. Don’t live in the past.
[/quote]

Your attempting to wax intelligent about a 60 year old war, and you have the gall to tell me not to live in the past? Wow.

The avatar is still there - It’s lasted for 5 months.

I will continue to follow you around and flame when neccessary - regardless of how you feel about it. You are a troll. You are not respected or liked around here. You embarass the t-nation website everytime you log on. You need to leave. And I will continue to call bullshit on your posts until you get the hint.

Does it make me look small? I could care less how you perceive me. I will be here for years to come, doing this very thing to the next XcelticX that comes along. It’s what I do around here - pest control.

[XCelticX]

[quote]wtagye wrote:
Wow, good thing we just send the dumb people to make split second decisions with highly technical equipment that results in life or death. Someone should have told my USMC Infantry Squad Leader who had a full ride to Cornell, and all the Ring Knockers, in fact all the officers. I think you should say that in Jacksonville NC and explain what a waste all the Marines there are making of thier lives. [/quote]

See, you only took the first sentence of my long explanitory post, and try to make me look like an ass with that. I never said the military only has dumb people. I just think it is unintelligent to take the chance at your life being thrown away by fighting in a war we don’t need to be fighting.

By the way, its too bad that your buddy from Cornell is stuck over there. Think of all the productive things a man of that intelligence could be doing with that time… but its his life and he decides what he wants to do with it, so I can’t judge him for that.