Strength Focus for Fat Loss

Training
21

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]GeneticSynergy9 wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@sput: thanks buddy for the tips on the weekly split and the breakdown for the ramp to max. I actually have that part down regarding how to ramp to 1RM but thought there much be a different way for the 3 RM. i guess its the same just stay with 3 reps for all the sets to max. Lol[/quote]

It’s similar. Start at 60-70% and gradually work your way up doing sets of 3 reps until you hit your 3RM. Normally we shoot for 6-8 sets to get there.[/quote]

Generally, I shoot for 6-9 sets, but based on my 10 and 20 second tap test, I am a quicker activator so recently I have tried making my ramp shorter, to the tune of 4-5 sets. Should I still be shooting for 6-8 or is this ok?[/quote]

I prefer 6-8 sets to get more mechanical volume in. And it’s not just a matter of activation but also on fine-tuning technique from set to set[/quote]

Understood, thanks! I will increment the weight slower to stay within 6-8 sets on my ramp.

22

@CT:

Are the Bi and Back recommendations after High Pull days the same for Normal, Strength, and Fat Loss Mode Layers?

23

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT:

Is the Bi and Back recommendations after High Pull days the same for Normal, Strength, and Fat Loss Mode Layers?[/quote]

Yes

24

I apologize guys I was off the spill for the past two weeks. So am I correct in thinking we can use any assistance lift on any day…not exceeding 15 min. Of 3-5 sets, 6-8 reps or 4-6 reps depending on the movement and not over train. Things for Bis, Back, OH Shoulder presses…etc.

25

@Brandon: You are correct

26

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
I apologize guys I was off the spill for the past two weeks. So am I correct in thinking we can use any assistance lift on any day…not exceeding 15 min. Of 3-5 sets, 6-8 reps or 4-6 reps depending on the movement and not over train. Things for Bis, Back, OH Shoulder presses…etc.[/quote]

Yes, but use an assistance exercise that hits muscles involved in the main lift of the day.

27

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
I apologize guys I was off the spill for the past two weeks. So am I correct in thinking we can use any assistance lift on any day…not exceeding 15 min. Of 3-5 sets, 6-8 reps or 4-6 reps depending on the movement and not over train. Things for Bis, Back, OH Shoulder presses…etc.[/quote]

Yes, but use an assistance exercise that hits muscles involved in the main lift of the day.[/quote]

Thibs: Whats the take on doing straight sets for back and bi as opposed to the Reg HDL and Max Rep recommendation. Just curious on work performed and what will lead to more optimal results.

28

[quote]brandon76 wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
I apologize guys I was off the spill for the past two weeks. So am I correct in thinking we can use any assistance lift on any day…not exceeding 15 min. Of 3-5 sets, 6-8 reps or 4-6 reps depending on the movement and not over train. Things for Bis, Back, OH Shoulder presses…etc.[/quote]

Yes, but use an assistance exercise that hits muscles involved in the main lift of the day.[/quote]

Thibs: Whats the take on doing straight sets for back and bi as opposed to the Reg HDL and Max Rep recommendation. Just curious on work performed and what will lead to more optimal results. [/quote]

To be honest, you can pretty much do anything you want for the biceps and lats work. Personally I like to use intensity techniques with biceps work (e.g. 1 & 1/2 reps, partials + full or 8 reps/10 sec rest/max reps, for example). They important thing is to stay away from neurally demanding methods.

29

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
you can pretty much do anything you want for the biceps and lats work. Personally I like to use intensity techniques with biceps work (e.g. 1 & 1/2 reps, partials + full or 8 reps/10 sec rest/max reps, for example). They important thing is to stay away from neurally demanding methods.[/quote] What if we use a lower rep range for lats and bi’s (5-6 reps),
but hold each rep a bit more at the peak contraction ?

30

[quote]tolismann wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
you can pretty much do anything you want for the biceps and lats work. Personally I like to use intensity techniques with biceps work (e.g. 1 & 1/2 reps, partials + full or 8 reps/10 sec rest/max reps, for example). They important thing is to stay away from neurally demanding methods.[/quote] What if we use a lower rep range for lats and bi’s (5-6 reps),
but hold each rep a bit more at the peak contraction ?
[/quote]

That’s fine… it’s not the number of reps that makes it neurally stressful, but the load.

31

@ CT:

Gotta love this Spill for the summertime. So question: if we wanted to do an Arm Spec day on a Sat for 4 weeks…would this Fat Loss Layer Split be acceptable to follow to keep weight down then a little carb cycling on the Arm Day to spark some growth (heavy carbs).

Or for that matter use this split for a normal eating week, then add the arm day on the weekend. Using this plan to keep the volume down.

32

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@ CT:

Gotta love this Spill for the summertime. So question: if we wanted to do an Arm Spec day on a Sat for 4 weeks…would this Fat Loss Layer Split be acceptable to follow to keep weight down then a little carb cycling on the Arm Day to spark some growth (heavy carbs).

Or for that matter use this split for a normal eating week, then add the arm day on the weekend. Using this plan to keep the volume down. [/quote]

Yeah that’s not a bad idea. I personally do not like arm days (I find them boring) but if you are into that sort of things it is not a bad strategy.

The only possible problem is doing too much triceps work, which can affect the subsequent pressing workouts.

33

California Summer has hit…you know what time it is…MAG-10 Slushies!

34

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
California Summer has hit…you know what time it is…MAG-10 Slushies! [/quote]
Shut up brandon It was 50 today in michigan and that was concerted nice.But I still have been breaking into the mag slushies,just gotta turn the heat up that’s all haha.

35

Yo JP, Ill trade you for a month.

36

@CT :

Im doing the Fat Loss CS style plan for dropping some weight, while doing the Fat Loss Layers Setup. With Plazma and 6 pulses with 2 Finis and a low carb meal at night. Question is can I get away doing 15 minutes of assistance work after the 5 layer days…or should I just stick with Bis and Back on High Pull days and not do any extra overhead shoulder press, tri cable press downs?

37

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT :

Im doing the Fat Loss CS style plan for dropping some weight, while doing the Fat Loss Layers Setup. With Plazma and 6 pulses with 2 Finis and a low carb meal at night. Question is can I get away doing 15 minutes of assistance work after the 5 layer days…or should I just stick with Bis and Back on High Pull days and not do any extra overhead shoulder press, tri cable press downs? [/quote]

I’m yet to see anybody cause damage to their progress by doing 15 minutes of assistance work at the end of layer workouts provided that the exercises/methods used are non-stressful on the CNS.

HOWEVER let me ask you this question:

Considering that you are in a fat loss phase, and that building muscle will be VERY difficult due to the lowered nutrients and caloric intake… do you think that assistance exercises will really help you build more muscle mass during that time?

Let’s be honest, most people in a fat loss phase will be happy to maintain muscle mass. Those who are doing things perfectly might hope for a few pounds of gains (something like 2-3lbs over 6-8 weeks). Do you think that adding 15 minutes of assistance work will really help you gain more muscle? My experience is NO it will not.

When eating above maintenance, yeah it might help. But not really when you are in a fat loss phase.

To me doing more work when you are in a fat loss phase is mostly a psychological thing… you BELIEVE (although it is not true) that doing more work will get you leaner while adding muscle.

So basically, you can do 10-15 minutes of low-stress assistance work. It should not hurt. But I garantee you that it will not help either. So it’s a matter of “is the psychological boost you’ll get from doing assistance work, worth an investment of 15 minutes per day?”

38

Fineeeeee,

Agreed. lol

39

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT :

Im doing the Fat Loss CS style plan for dropping some weight, while doing the Fat Loss Layers Setup. With Plazma and 6 pulses with 2 Finis and a low carb meal at night. Question is can I get away doing 15 minutes of assistance work after the 5 layer days…or should I just stick with Bis and Back on High Pull days and not do any extra overhead shoulder press, tri cable press downs? [/quote]

I’m yet to see anybody cause damage to their progress by doing 15 minutes of assistance work at the end of layer workouts provided that the exercises/methods used are non-stressful on the CNS.

HOWEVER let me ask you this question:

Considering that you are in a fat loss phase, and that building muscle will be VERY difficult due to the lowered nutrients and caloric intake… do you think that assistance exercises will really help you build more muscle mass during that time?

Let’s be honest, most people in a fat loss phase will be happy to maintain muscle mass. Those who are doing things perfectly might hope for a few pounds of gains (something like 2-3lbs over 6-8 weeks). Do you think that adding 15 minutes of assistance work will really help you gain more muscle? My experience is NO it will not.

When eating above maintenance, yeah it might help. But not really when you are in a fat loss phase.

To me doing more work when you are in a fat loss phase is mostly a psychological thing… you BELIEVE (although it is not true) that doing more work will get you leaner while adding muscle.

So basically, you can do 10-15 minutes of low-stress assistance work. It should not hurt. But I garantee you that it will not help either. So it’s a matter of “is the psychological boost you’ll get from doing assistance work, worth an investment of 15 minutes per day?”[/quote]

CT, I’m in complete agreement with you that building muscle in a calorie deficit is almost impossible, but what about the feasibility of bringing up strength weak points while dieting? Is there a higher probability of this being accomplished while in a calorie deficit? Specifically, I’m wondering about grip strength and upper back strength? Would performing grip work (like you’ve suggested in another thread) and overhead holds after every workout be too much additional work?

40

[quote]cmryan_21 wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]brandon76 wrote:
@CT :

Im doing the Fat Loss CS style plan for dropping some weight, while doing the Fat Loss Layers Setup. With Plazma and 6 pulses with 2 Finis and a low carb meal at night. Question is can I get away doing 15 minutes of assistance work after the 5 layer days…or should I just stick with Bis and Back on High Pull days and not do any extra overhead shoulder press, tri cable press downs? [/quote]

I’m yet to see anybody cause damage to their progress by doing 15 minutes of assistance work at the end of layer workouts provided that the exercises/methods used are non-stressful on the CNS.

HOWEVER let me ask you this question:

Considering that you are in a fat loss phase, and that building muscle will be VERY difficult due to the lowered nutrients and caloric intake… do you think that assistance exercises will really help you build more muscle mass during that time?

Let’s be honest, most people in a fat loss phase will be happy to maintain muscle mass. Those who are doing things perfectly might hope for a few pounds of gains (something like 2-3lbs over 6-8 weeks). Do you think that adding 15 minutes of assistance work will really help you gain more muscle? My experience is NO it will not.

When eating above maintenance, yeah it might help. But not really when you are in a fat loss phase.

To me doing more work when you are in a fat loss phase is mostly a psychological thing… you BELIEVE (although it is not true) that doing more work will get you leaner while adding muscle.

So basically, you can do 10-15 minutes of low-stress assistance work. It should not hurt. But I garantee you that it will not help either. So it’s a matter of “is the psychological boost you’ll get from doing assistance work, worth an investment of 15 minutes per day?”[/quote]

CT, I’m in complete agreement with you that building muscle in a calorie deficit is almost impossible, but what about the feasibility of bringing up strength weak points while dieting? Is there a higher probability of this being accomplished while in a calorie deficit? Specifically, I’m wondering about grip strength and upper back strength? Would performing grip work (like you’ve suggested in another thread) and overhead holds after every workout be too much additional work?[/quote]

From experience, strength can improve more easily than muscle mass when on a caloric deficit. This is especially true of areas that were neglected before (like grip strength).

However I also know that strength in big movements, especially pressing movements (bench, pverhead press, squats) is highly dependant on body mass whereas pulling movements are much less dependant thus strength can improve more easily on those exercises while losing fat.