Do we also not need to do calf training, or just heavy leg work?
Did someone say not to do calf training?
Towards the end Mentzer preached slowing down. 5/5 cadence. John Little just posted the video today of Mentzer training Reinhardt right before he died. Emphasized the cadence numerous times in the 1 hr video. Actually also mentioned SS, saying it was too slow
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I think Mentzer recommended 4/4 actually and 4/2/4 where applicable.
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All rep speeds are nonsense and purely arbitrary or preferential. The science says it doesn’t matter. Anyone who got results on SS would have gotten it with something else. I’ve never found it to matter trying anything from 1/1 to 10/10. I prefer a “natural” rhythm ensuring I can feel the muscle while training safely.
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I’d say it does matter, but only in one respect: If you keep the same cadence all the time, you WILL stagnate.
I thought that. Go watch the video on John Little’s fb or yt
Yes ,
Bret Contreas article
Exercise. Gastroc EMG mean/peak
BW Single Leg Calf Raise. 105.0
175.0
180 lb Lever Calf Raise. 88.0
130.0
360 lb Lever Calf Raise. 134.0
211.0
270 lb Explosive Lever 124.0
Calf Raise. 175.0
270 lb 10-Second Pause
Lever Calf Raise. 99.6
177.0
225 Parallel Squat 73.1
263.0
263.0 EMG reading for the gastrocnemius muscle during squats with only 225 lbs is impressive.
Mentzer and Yates showed forearms needed little or no direct work. Science shows direct arm work offers very little return on investment, and EMG work makes one question the value of direct calf work, especially for non-competitive folks like me!
Marc
Not understanding your point?
Showed THEIR forearms needed little or no direct work. My own results tell me otherwise! Same with Calves. No One-Size-Fits-All applies here!!
For neurological gains, I would agree. But I went from 4/4 to 10/10 when I was pure HIT back in the day and it didn’t matter for size. What mattered for me moving away from stagnation was getting more volume and frequency, and less intensity.
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I have found direct calf training to help a bit, but nothing to show for direct forearm training. Forearms are my worse body part, so maybe just genetic for me.
For the average person, seeking only modest strength/mass gains and/or maintenance, minimizing forearm/arms/calf/neck direct work would be okay as long as torso and legs were trained hard!
Marc
I hope that I clarified my position! Even I train these areas however. Age may cause a rethink! After all—
The BIG routine had no direct calf work!
The Colorado Experiment had no calf direct work!
But a non-bodybuilder could benefit from torso and legs trained hard. Occasionally hit areas such as calves and forearms, but prioritize compound exercises done with good form.
Clarified…thx
i train calves and forearms…only one set, calves twice a week and forearms once a week…probably dont need to, but why not
I would train the neck, but have no harness or neck machine to utilize
Casey is another bad example: 1) He’s naturally stocky, 2) his legs are short 3) the calve connections/inserts are really long (just like his forearms). He probably had pretty damn good calves before ever darkening a gym doorway – his whole Legs probably! Arthur surely understood this too, as you see many Colorado workouts that were 8-10 exercises for the upper body and only 1 set of squats!!
Also, Full Squats probably bring in more calf stim than any other compound free weight exercise. And, there’s a LOT of calf stim when one uses the Duo-Squat!
No argument here. I train 3 times/week: Alternating Push/Quads and Pull/Hams workouts. I hit calves for 1 or 2 sets every 2 weeks. I usually do 1-2 forearm exercises every Pull workout, alternating between flexor, extensor, and brachiradialis focus. Torso gets most of the sets and exercises. My upper legs do well with a few compound movements, with iso ones peppered in every 3rd workout or so.
Thanks for your reply!
I mostly agree with you
However, pictures show during the Colorado Experiment that Casey’s calf muscles grew during the experiment with no direct work
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Thanks for your reply
Sounds like you have a great workout schedule
I like it
I am getting older and can not recover from too many exercises.
I am entrenched into failure training. It seems to fit me
I do me, U do U ! Lol
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I wasn’t trying to compare or criticize workout schedules, just show that though I believe in Direct Calf work, it’s only a small percentage of my overall workout volume. I’m 60 myself, and if I went all-out Positive Failure, I’d be training only 2/wk, with about 6 exercises per workout!
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