Smoking Meat

Off Topic
21

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:
What kind of meat/cuts are you smoking? What does your smoker look like?

Filling up a truckload of wood is cheaper and better than buying chips IMO.

Most people over think smoking. I’ve built or picked up every smoker I’ve used for less than 40$.

Opinions are strong and everyone has their own methodologies, but here are some of my thoughts. I rarely go over 4 hours smoking time depending on the cut.

Turkeys can be precooked in an oven then smoked if need be. A 15lb bird thawed needs about 4 hours on the grill. Less if precooked. I prefer hickory, but mesquite and oak work. Generally just use season salt.

Ribs. No reason to long smoke them. An hour +. Garlic salt. Pork really holds the smoke, so any kind of hardwood.

I stay away from sugary tomato based sauces, because they burn. I only finish the meat with the sauce if used. Stubbs is my favorite.

Flat cut brisket time depends on the size. Don’t overcook, just salt pepper and smoke. I hate brisket with a fat cap.

Chicken thighs, an hour depending on the heat. Season with anything.

[/quote]

As you say, everyone has their own opinions and methods. With that said, what you are prescribing is more “grilling” than “smoking”. You can’t just cook some meat with some wood smoke thrown in and call it smoking.

No way a slab of ribs will be ready in a little over an hour at 225-250, which is standard smoking temps. That is unless you boil your ribs first which many wouldn’t consider real smoking anyway.

Smoking chicken takes longer than an hour as well. Grilling chicken with indirect heat then maybe an hour is more like it.

Typical cook times for pork are around 1.5 hours per pound at 225-250. So a 6lb shoulder will be up around 8hrs or more.

[/quote]

Does smoke not flavor the meat with shorter cooking times?

BTW, I knew someone would bring this up. Thus my caveat.

[/quote]

LOL

Putting BBQ sauce on baked chicken flavors it, but it doesn’t make it BBQ’d chicken.

Throwing your caveat in doesn’t make what you recommended for smoking any more valid. Your times and suggestions are consistent with grilling. That’s fine, but the question wasn’t about grilling.

I would assume the OP would want proper info for smoking meat, which requires more than “smoke flavoring” obtained by burning some wood while grilling. Which is perfectly fine, BTW, and I’ve done it while grilling myself for that added bit of flavor, but it’s not smoking.

[/quote]

ha! Overcooking meat via the highly scientifically accepted method called smoking has ruined more meals and quality cuts of meat than I care to remember.

I was trying not to turn DB’s thread into an epic battle about grilling/smoking methods. Too late…lol

[/quote]

Just because the meals you had sucked, doesn’t mean the method sucks. It’s a difficult thing to get right, and really easy to mess up.

It’s totally fine if you are more comfortable cooking faster at higher temps to avoid ruining a meal. It’s a lot of time to waste if you don’t get it right. Some of us keep doing it because it’s a challenge far above grilling and can produce some awesome tasting meat.

Epic battle? Uh…OK. The two methods are quite different. All I said was your advice was suited for one, not the other.

22

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]Captnoblivious wrote:
What kind of meat/cuts are you smoking? What does your smoker look like?

Filling up a truckload of wood is cheaper and better than buying chips IMO.

Most people over think smoking. I’ve built or picked up every smoker I’ve used for less than 40$.

Opinions are strong and everyone has their own methodologies, but here are some of my thoughts. I rarely go over 4 hours smoking time depending on the cut.

Turkeys can be precooked in an oven then smoked if need be. A 15lb bird thawed needs about 4 hours on the grill. Less if precooked. I prefer hickory, but mesquite and oak work. Generally just use season salt.

Ribs. No reason to long smoke them. An hour +. Garlic salt. Pork really holds the smoke, so any kind of hardwood.

I stay away from sugary tomato based sauces, because they burn. I only finish the meat with the sauce if used. Stubbs is my favorite.

Flat cut brisket time depends on the size. Don’t overcook, just salt pepper and smoke. I hate brisket with a fat cap.

Chicken thighs, an hour depending on the heat. Season with anything.

[/quote]

As you say, everyone has their own opinions and methods. With that said, what you are prescribing is more “grilling” than “smoking”. You can’t just cook some meat with some wood smoke thrown in and call it smoking.

No way a slab of ribs will be ready in a little over an hour at 225-250, which is standard smoking temps. That is unless you boil your ribs first which many wouldn’t consider real smoking anyway.

Smoking chicken takes longer than an hour as well. Grilling chicken with indirect heat then maybe an hour is more like it.

Typical cook times for pork are around 1.5 hours per pound at 225-250. So a 6lb shoulder will be up around 8hrs or more.

[/quote]

Does smoke not flavor the meat with shorter cooking times?

BTW, I knew someone would bring this up. Thus my caveat.

[/quote]

LOL

Putting BBQ sauce on baked chicken flavors it, but it doesn’t make it BBQ’d chicken.

Throwing your caveat in doesn’t make what you recommended for smoking any more valid. Your times and suggestions are consistent with grilling. That’s fine, but the question wasn’t about grilling.

I would assume the OP would want proper info for smoking meat, which requires more than “smoke flavoring” obtained by burning some wood while grilling. Which is perfectly fine, BTW, and I’ve done it while grilling myself for that added bit of flavor, but it’s not smoking.

[/quote]

ha! Overcooking meat via the highly scientifically accepted method called smoking has ruined more meals and quality cuts of meat than I care to remember.

I was trying not to turn DB’s thread into an epic battle about grilling/smoking methods. Too late…lol

[/quote]

Just because the meals you had sucked, doesn’t mean the method sucks. It’s a difficult thing to get right, and really easy to mess up.

It’s totally fine if you are more comfortable cooking faster at higher temps to avoid ruining a meal. It’s a lot of time to waste if you don’t get it right. Some of us keep doing it because it’s a challenge far above grilling and can produce some awesome tasting meat.

Epic battle? Uh…OK. The two methods are quite different. All I said was your advice was suited for one, not the other.

[/quote]

Do you smoke meat on a regular basis?

Epic battle, was humor.

23

[quote]
Do you smoke meat on a regular basis?

Epic battle, was humor. [/quote]

As often as I can. Why?

24

OKay, so I thought I’d update you guys on my progress. First of all, thanks for all the advice!

I smoked a couple of whole chickens first. I figured I’d start with something real cheap and hard to fuck up. I used a dry rub, mostly thyme, rosemary, some lemon peel, a little bit of cayenne pepper, and some turbinado sugar. I smoked the chicken at about 225 degrees, which was a little low. 250 would have been better. It took about 4 hours, maybe a little longer, to smoke. I used mesquite wood chips. It came decent, but the skin was REALLY smoky and the meat itself wasn’t that flavorful. It had an excellent moisture level and texture, though, and made great sandwiches with the leftovers.

For my next meal, I went straight for the fucking kill and got two USDA Prime prime ribs (boneless). I tied them up nice and tight to promote even cooking throughout. I made a wet rub of minced garlic, Sierra Nevada Stout mustard, horseradish, lime juice, rosemary, thyme, sea salt, crushed black pepper, dried red chile peppers, and some olive oil. I rubbed the shit out of the whole prime ribs with this rub, coating it completely and liberally. I put those fuckers in the smoker over a mixture of mesquite and applewood (mostly apple) at 300 degrees and slowly let the temp drop down to about 225, then maintained that temp until I hit about 125 degrees internally. I pulled them out and let them sit for about 20 minutes under some foil, carved, served with garlic mashed potatoes and green beans, ate everything, then fucked the shit out of my fiance, twice.

I bought four tri-tips last week and smoked all of them. I used a dry rub of 4 parts crushed black pepper (crushed as coarsely as possible), 4 parts sea salt, 1 part onion powder, 1 part chili powder (which I make from scratch; see: DBCooper chili thread), 1 part garlic salt, 1/2 part cardamom, 1/2 part turbinado sugar, and 1/2 part allspice. I usually keep a big Ziploc bag with this rub and then add stuff to it depending on what I’m cooking. For tri-tip, I usually don’t add anything other than a little extra chili powder and extra salt.

I smoked all four at once at 225. The tri-tips were all about 2 lbs, the smallest being 1.89 lbs and the largest being 2.11lbs. Normally, I go to Costco, but the place was a zoo so I went to Safeway instead. I used a mixture of mesquite and hickory, mostly hickory. The smallest one took about 2.5 hours and the largest took just over 3 hours. I smoked them to about 130 degrees and let them sit for 10 minutes under some foil while I grilled up some red onions and green bell peppers and toasted some French rolls. I sliced everything up for sandwiches and had to stop halfway through the first one to jerk off. It came out that well.

Now that I’ve had a few smoking experiences under my belt, I’m going to start getting heavily into some of the websites recommended here. Thanks again, and I’ll keep you guys posted. Feel free to offer more advice, recipes, criticisms, whatever.

25

DB have you ever tasted competition BBQ? Especially any from KC or Memphis? I grew up around KC BBQ and my brother has done a few competitions and placed well in ribs. One of the things that peeves him is that people think “fall off the bone” is the proper preparation for all barbecued meats. Usually that means the meat is overcooked.

My suggestion is to find all the recipes you want online, but try to work on one yourself. Pick whatever meat you like, and whenever you smoke that specific cut only use your own recipe. Let it evolve for a few years and you might have a secret dry rub on your hands. I think this method will give you more feedback on actually improving your BBQ skills.

26

[quote]CroatianRage wrote:
DB have you ever tasted competition BBQ? Especially any from KC or Memphis? I grew up around KC BBQ and my brother has done a few competitions and placed well in ribs. One of the things that peeves him is that people think “fall off the bone” is the proper preparation for all barbecued meats. Usually that means the meat is overcooked.

My suggestion is to find all the recipes you want online, but try to work on one yourself. Pick whatever meat you like, and whenever you smoke that specific cut only use your own recipe. Let it evolve for a few years and you might have a secret dry rub on your hands. I think this method will give you more feedback on actually improving your BBQ skills.[/quote]

There’s a place in SF called Brothers. It’s on Divisadero and run by a couple of brothas from KC. It’s a lot like that place that Francis Underwood eats at in House of Cards. They have the best BBQ ribs ever.

I’m going to stick with smoking tri-tip primarily. I’ll be experimenting on my own with other cuts as well, but tri-tip is dirt cheap out here so I think it’s a good cut for me to develop my own shit with.

27

AHH! finally something I have first hand experience with, GRILLIN! I own a Primo Oval XL smoker /grill. This thing makes anyone a world class smoker. Before this I had to get creative with the grill set up and charcoal set up. 90 % of your results are going to be from charcoal selection ( must use natural lump charcoal) and the ability to maintain airflow, which will set your temperature.

I cannot recommend enough, the charcoal brand ROYAL OAK or the Big green egg brand. RO is available for about 1/2 that of BGE and is at Wal-Mart.

Does your smoker have a separate fire box? If so this will be EASY, if not, you’ll need to offset cook as best as possible. For example if your grill is rectangle, simply place the lump charcoal on one side of the grill and the food on the other. if you have a round, smoker, you still do this only as best you can, as shown here… amazingribs.com/images/pix/weber_setup.jpg

A few critical notes to make this easy for you. I’m going to be tossing a ton of shit out so hopefully I won’t lose you.

terms -
SMOKING - lower temps, longer cook times. The goal here is to cook slowly so that the smoky flavor is maximized and the meat is cooked tenderly.
GRILLING - higher heat, quick cook times.

If you don’t have a few meat thermometers, get some. Grilling / smoking stuff is easy IF you know what temperature it is. Take the guesswork out of this. get a few thermometers.

  1. the drip pan under the meat. This is not to moisturize the meat, that’s impossible, it is to catch the meat drippings and not vaporize them, so that your meat tastes like wood smoke and not smoked fat drippings. Additional water pans in the grills DO help to SLOW the meats drying out, in gas grills and shitty smokers where there are way too many vents / openings.
  2. do not light all the charcoal in the grill when SMOKING things (grilling, as in a steak or burgers, is different. Then you light it all so everything cooks evenly). Only light one spot and let the wood slowly burn around the firebox. This makes for a nice slow cook which is what you are after plus ensures your charcoal burns for many hours.
  3. LOW TEMPS AT FIRST = Better smokes because most absorption occurs up to an internal temperature of about 140 F, the meat will continue to take on smoke flavor past that point by a process called adsorption (notice different spelling from “absorption”).

Note also that smoke flavor and “smoke ring” are different phenomena. This is a source much confusion among BBQ cooks and frequently when they say one they mean the other. Smoke ring formation does cease at around 140 F when the proteins begin to coagulate. There is not a necessary connection between these two phenomena however. You can have smoke flavor with no smoke ring, and it’s even possible to have smoke ring with no smoke flavor by using a nitrate cure in a certain way.
4) BRINE your stuff. This makes your meats super juicy, at first through osmotic action. Then as a result your stuff, particularly birds, will be juicy when done. This is easy. simply put your chicken in a gallon freezer bag or big bowl full of water, add a handful of salt, soak for a few hours, overnight if possible. This really works. This is one of those truly notable difference makers.
5) Relax your steaks / chops before grilling. In your marinade bag or a zip lock freezer bag place your meats.now, soak the bag in warm water for 20 min or so. This will warm the meat and literally relax it. Must like our warmed muscles. Then place the meat in the grill on low-ish temp flame at first. For “smack yo momma” steaks, check out the “reverse sear, Finlay method”

last thing… burgers are thoroughly done, when the juice oozing out of them is clear. doneness is pretty much on par with the juice so use that as a guide.

On steaks, a quick feel check goes like this. feel your cheek, that’s RARE, cheekbone / upper lip, that’s medium, forehead is well done.

Check out the Primo smoking forum. There several Pro grillers who post here regularly. There is a tremendous wealth of man skillz here that will swell your man card account to epic proportions.

28

another very good resource