[quote]pushharder wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
What is really going to blow your mind, would we even be here? If Adam and Eve never sinned they would have lived forever as perfectly created beings, so the need to multiply would be gone…
[/quote]
No.
Genesis 1:28 (before the fall) commanded, “God blessed them and said to them, ‘Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth…’”
Reproduction was part of the plan before sin entered the world.[/quote]
Beat you to it. Neener.
It is always amusing when you see someone asking a bunch of questions with the expectation that they cannot be wrong because the other side is automatically wrong in principle.
Varccam’s Razor
Occam’s razor cuts both ways. When wielded by one barber, it shaves away one type of complexity. When in another barber’s hands, another. After you lather up the first two chapters of Genesis, lay on the steaming hot towels, and swipe lovingly and carefully with the razor, you are left with a smooth, clean conviction that the story happened just as written, and there can be no other explanation. I, who have been sharpening the razor the whole time you’ve been singing and lathering, swipe even closer to the skin, and see that all that is left is a fable…an excellent fable, to be sure, with a great moral… but a metaphor nonetheless.
But don’t take my word for it. Ask any Jew who studies this every year, in the language it was written in, and knows more about the history, culture and linguistical gymnastic abilities of the people who committed the story to paper (figuratively speaking: it wasn’t paper at all, but lamb skin, probably).
Or have you already, and just didn’t like the answer?
[quote]magick wrote:
It is always amusing when you see someone asking a bunch of questions with the expectation that they cannot be wrong because the other side is automatically wrong in principle.[/quote]
Yes, but it’s a rare pleasure. We almost never see this on T-Nation. Especially not on PWI.
[quote]zecarlo wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
If it’s any consolation, God made it so that after marriage, sex seems like a drudgerous chore for a lot of people. [/quote]
I haven’t had anyone’s wife complain. [/quote]
Good fucking answer 
If it’s about all about ‘‘control’’, so do the exact same ‘controlling’ rules apply with Muslims regarding Sex before marriage?
They have the same alleged metaphoric creation story of Adam and Eve as well.
[quote]Karado wrote:
If it’s about all about ‘‘control’’, so do the exact same ‘controlling’ rules apply with Muslims regarding Sex before marriage?
They have the same alleged metaphoric creation story of Adam and Eve as well.
[/quote]
Yes. No sex before marriage in Islam.
And the Eden story is a little different in the Quran.
In Christianity, the identification of the serpent with Satan is implied, but in Genesis he is just a literal snake. After all it would make little sense for God to punish all species of snake for ever after for the deeds of a disobedient angel who was only disguised as a snake.
In the Quran, the antagonist is specifically identified as Satan. He was banished from heaven for refusing to bow down to the humans that God had just made out of clay, and got his revenge by tricking Adam and Eve (not just Eve, notably) into eating from the forbidden tree (which Satan tells them will give them immortality and power).
Yes, God is angry when he discovers what Adam and Eve have done, and he kicks them out of the Garden. But Adam prays for forgiveness, and you know what God does?
He forgives them.
Slightly different story.
Proving once again that no matter what many people think, the God of Christians and the
God of the Muslims are two very different people and not the same whatsoever…not ‘‘people’’ but, you know…lol.
'‘But we worship the same Gaaaawddd"…Are these people out of their fuckin’ minds?
Or maybe it’s the same God, just different people have different ideas about him, so they tell different stories. Hence the huge disconnect between the jealous wrathful God of the Israelites and the loving, forgiving God of the Christians. Different messenger, different message. Same God.
It’s like a smoker needing to quit for a month to win a prize, the urge to smoke magically disappearing for a month doesn’t prove their commitment to quitting. To be tested they’ve to feel that urge and abstain from it.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Varccam’s Razor
Occam’s razor cuts both ways. When wielded by one barber, it shaves away one type of complexity. When in another barber’s hands, another. After you lather up the first two chapters of Genesis, lay on the steaming hot towels, and swipe lovingly and carefully with the razor, you are left with a smooth, clean conviction that the story happened just as written, and there can be no other explanation. I, who have been sharpening the razor the whole time you’ve been singing and lathering, swipe even closer to the skin, and see that all that is left is a fable…an excellent fable, to be sure, with a great moral… but a metaphor nonetheless.
But don’t take my word for it. Ask any Jew who studies this every year, in the language it was written in, and knows more about the history, culture and linguistical gymnastic abilities of the people who committed the story to paper (figuratively speaking: it wasn’t paper at all, but lamb skin, probably).
Or have you already, and just didn’t like the answer?[/quote]
Why do you insist I ask a contemporary Jew? Why must ancient Jews’ opinions be so carelessly discarded? Does the 21st century Jew have some special revelation that makes his view transcendent? Can the ancient Jew be consulted?
Or have you already, and just didn’t like the answer?
[/quote]
I tried telephoning an ancient Jew, but they told me that Mr. Kissinger wasn’t taking any calls.
If you wanted to know something about military tactics, I suppose you could learn a lot from reading Xenophon, but you’d be silly if you left off there. We’ve learned a lot since Xenophon, and a modern tactician’s opinions are probably more applicable to present conditions.
The 21st century Jew has come from a tradition of debate and study of the texts that has parsed and dissected every single word of the Torah, in order to squeeze out every last drop of meaning. They probably understand it a lot better than the people who first read it, simply because they’ve been thinking about it for a lot longer.
Not only that, but they have another advantage over the 21st century BC Israelite: a greater understanding of the natural world and the universe. If a modern Jew were to receive an inspired scripture from God on a mountain in Israel, the first part of it would probably be a lot different from Genesis 1 and 2. Because even though God doesn’t change, people do. We have the same basic needs, wants, and impulses as we did five thousand years ago, but our level of understanding is quite a bit different from that of a sheep herder on the banks of the Euphrates.
For the record , I am all for sex before marriage
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
For the record , I am all for sex before marriage :)[/quote]
Don’t get the wrong idea. Sex before marriage is honored in the breach rather than the observance.
[quote]SexMachine wrote:
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
For the record , I am all for sex before marriage :)[/quote]
Don’t get the wrong idea. Sex before marriage is honored in the breach rather than the observance.Shit If I were to guess from religion ,sex is ok with any one or thing , marital or not
Show of hands - who here HASN’T fornicated?