Resume: Include References or Not?

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]Testy1 wrote:

I guess what irked me the most was the last line, “Don’t ask about vacations or flex time or any crap besides whether it is OK to work through lunch and stay late.”

Fuck that, if I’m working for you I want to know what I’m getting myself into. But I’ve worked the mega hours and it’s not for me. If you don’t get the best deal for yourself going in, no one else will.[/quote]

Which is a fair enough comment and desire. But by asking the question, the employer (me) thinks “aha, this guy is a slacker.”

That may not be a fair belief, but that is my belief. If you must ask those questions, ask HR or whoever is not the hiring person.

Note, my points are “on how to get the job.” Not “how to get the job you want.”

Obama’s anti-business policies have gifted us with 10% unemployment, 17% if you count the people who just quit looking for a job.

The times when an employee could be selective about his or her employer are largely over. With eternal unemployment insurance, it’s too big a risk for the employer to hire a clunker employee and fire him or her.[/quote]

This kind of attitude is fine if you are looking for people to flip burgers. However, truly skilled workers are still a precious commodity and should not just settle for whatever job they can get.

I don’t mean to make this personal, but it is this disconnect that makes for high turnovers when times are good, which in the end costs you money. Further, if you think Obama is the cause of where we are, you really should get out more.

[quote]Testy1 wrote:

This kind of attitude is fine if you are looking for people to flip burgers. However, truly skilled workers are still a precious commodity and should not just settle for whatever job they can get.

[/quote]

Personally, I wouldn’t ask any questions about pay, benefits, or anything compensation related during an interview. Seems too mercenary. To me, the interview part is to see if a) the work is what you want to be doing and b) if you would be a good fit in the company. Compensation can wait until negotiations.

Of course this only applies to jobs where there is an interview and separate compensation discussion. Labor jobs I assume you negotiate at the interview and a decision is made.

No need to give references. They need to ask your permission before contacting references. It is considered highly unprofessional to do so. They may ask you this question at the interview (on contacting references). The best references are written by your referees - work to get these from them. Take them with you to job interviews.

I didn’t realise this was a general thread on giving advice on Resumes. In that case -

  1. Only state achievements, stating responsibilities is ridiculous if they don’t actually lead to an achievement.

  2. Be specific with dates joining and leaving companies. If you’re really smart you’ll also state “reasons for leaving” and be as professional as possible in this. Don’t say “moved for better pay”.

  3. Keep personal particulars off like marital status, height, weight, DOB - I’ve seen them all in resumes and none of it’s required. Perhaps privacy laws are different in the USA but in Asia and Europe where I have recruited people I see these details alot and none of it is needed.

  4. Keep fonts simple and readable, this is not an art contest or graphic design project.

  5. Leave off personal interests unless it impacts your job or selection. Telling me you like water sports means nothing, telling me you sailed unassisted half way around the world tells me you’re a leader and know how to handle yourself in tough situations.

If you’re still sending resumes by post rather than email on online applications - learn to PDF documents and email people.

[quote]johnnytang24 wrote:

[quote]Testy1 wrote:

This kind of attitude is fine if you are looking for people to flip burgers. However, truly skilled workers are still a precious commodity and should not just settle for whatever job they can get.

[/quote]

Personally, I wouldn’t ask any questions about pay, benefits, or anything compensation related during an interview. Seems too mercenary. To me, the interview part is to see if a) the work is what you want to be doing and b) if you would be a good fit in the company. Compensation can wait until negotiations.

Of course this only applies to jobs where there is an interview and separate compensation discussion. Labor jobs I assume you negotiate at the interview and a decision is made.[/quote]

You are right in that a person would be nuts to bring this up in the first interview. Usually that is just a feeling out period for both sides. I’m sure Jewbacca doesn’t come off in an interview like he did in that post, but I can say if he did, I would thank him for his time and GTFO.