Real Fascism Example

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
41

[quote]lothario1132 wrote:
Varqanir wrote:
Well no. If the government seized control of all of the barbershops in the country and dictated how they would cut hair from that moment on (for the glory of the Fatherland, of course), and sent thugs and secret police to ensure that hair was getting cut as per government mandate, that would be fascism.

Look, I hear ya guys, but…

But let’s say that instead of the state per se, it’s the mighty Islamic power structure (which might as well be the state anyway, and is rallied behind as all important, while the individual is not important) that sends out the hair cut requirements which are enforced through brutal methods or even penalty of death.

Then that’s not “Islamofascism”?

Come on, fellas. Call it what it is. I know it sucks to see things like a “Bushie” even in a small way, but this is reality. These guys are bad. Really bad. And I don’t feel like lumping them together as some nebulous association under an umbrella of a catchphrase is hurting a damn thing. We are talking about human cumstains here who have no regard for anything besides what they deem as righteous or acceptable. I don’t want to reason with these fucks, I want to talk to the rational muslims who AREN’T religious fascist assholes. Those are the guys who can do something reasonable and will respond and respect others and their right to exist.

Give me the muslims, not the violent islamofascist jihad motherfuckers.[/quote]

Well then they are collectivists, subgroup religous, subsubgroup Islamic…

Your original post however implied that Bush?s moves were in no way even related to fascism whereas a bunch of thugs IS fascism.

I am arguing that the power structure that is built with Homeland Security, “unorthodox” interpretations of the Geneva Convention, Constitution and the Bill of Rights, i.e centralization of power and re-interpreting fundamental documents by the executive is at least a step in the direction of fascism.

There is no visible line drawn in the sand, get centralized and authoritarian enough and you have a fascist system.

I stand by my example of the WOD. Not at all a federal issue, but federal agencies seem to thrive in that environment, ignoring state legislature, misguiding the public when it comes to the dangers of illegal substances and last, but not least, para-military police to enforce all this.

To claim that fascism does not stand a chance in the US, even though it is alive and well in areas of the public live where people allready have been scared into submission is dangerously myopic…

When do you think would be the right time to adress those issues? When they are allready playing by Bagdad rules or when they still try to uphold the decorum of a nation governed by laws?

42

[quote]orion wrote:
I stand by my example of the WOD. Not at all a federal issue, but federal agencies seem to thrive in that environment, ignoring state legislature, misguiding the public when it comes to the dangers of illegal substances and last, but not least, para-military police to enforce all this.[/quote]

Damn I hate the WOD, but it’s not fascism. The feds have a legitimate beef in this as long as there is foreign involvement or interstate commerce involved with the smuggling of drugs. (kinda how they declared them illegal in the first place, it’s a legal mess IMHO)

Those paramilitary “police” are there to enforce the federal will, and it is a legitimate thing which is overseen by the other branches of our government. This isn’t BlackOps stormtroopers crashing into doors and shooting the place up with no repercussions. They need warrants, they need the mandate of the Congress to get funding, etc., it’s got the checks and balances which are not present in a real fascist… policy? I guess that might be the right word.

We just get to hear about the spectacular failures when they get the wrong address to invade and such – which does happen. There are legal recourses in these cases, the courts get involved, there are reviews, the due process of law is preserved. Once again – not fascist. There is real accountability here.

[quote]To claim that fascism does not stand a chance in the US, even though it is alive and well in areas of the public live where people allready have been scared into submission is dangerously myopic…

When do you think would be the right time to adress those issues? When they are allready playing by Bagdad rules or when they still try to uphold the decorum of a nation governed by laws? [/quote]

You have made a really good post, and I like how you’ve argued your points. I just can’t bring myself to agree with them when the evidence points to otherwise.

Still, good job though, Wreckless.

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[quote]lothario1132 wrote:

We just get to hear about the spectacular failures when they get the wrong address to invade and such – which does happen. There are legal recourses in these cases, the courts get involved, there are reviews, the due process of law is preserved. Once again – not fascist. There is real accountability here.
[/quote]

Do these legal recourses include court trials where the defendants are not allowed to inform the jury that

  • there are medical cannabis laws in their state?

  • they have a serious disease that falls under those laws and could be treated with cannabis?

  • the only reason they grew it in the first place were the two paragraphs above?

Are these trials happening even though no state line was crossed?

Looks like a trial where the outcome is fixed, in a case that was never a federal issue in the first place.

So, it is only a federal authoritarian policy, that usurps powers it does not really legally have, frequently misleads the public, fixes trials so that the oucome is sure and frequently ignores state legislature and the freedom of the individual to do with their body whatever they fucking want to do with it.

I am not insisting on calling that a fascist policy, perhaps you have a better word for it?

44

Those people are savages, they need another 500 years or so. Nixon originally said something similiar to this about another group of people (can you guess who?)

But what we have here is not fascism, just simple tyranny and mob rule. Fascism is really a 20th century phenomenon, an economic system more than anything else. Fascism is government-sponsored corporatism, i.e. government working hand-in-hand with big business in order to shape society, to make a nation’s economy more “efficient” for the elite few who control it. Hence the trains are said to run on time (even though they really didn’t, in 1930’s Italy).

You know what fascism is? Welfare. Social Security. Price Controls. Anti-Trust laws. The Federal Reserve System. I’m not making this up. Most people don’t have a shred of a clue about the real meaning of fascism.

Should you choose to enlighten yourself, you can start by reading the book titled, “Friendly Fascism: The New Face of Power in America”.

Also see:
‘Origins of the Welfare State in America’ By Murray N. Rothbard

and

‘What Has Government Done to Our Money?’

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ARTICLE2/doodoo.html

You see, it’s a lot more complex – and subtle – than jackboots and paramilitary uniforms. Fascism needn’t be associated with extreme nationalism or domestic tyranny. At least, not until it’s latter stages.

45

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Great post, lots of good quotes. I too believe that we’ve been set up by powerful people. They did so under the guise of helping the poor, downtrodden, and so on. This was their excuse to expand the size of government and to slowly become more intrusive in our lives. Hence the Great Society Program and other such evil plans.

The problem is, which was voiced by many Germans in the 1930’s, what to do? The mainstream parties run this country and most people don’t care. They don’t understand that creating a government that extorts from one group to pay another is destructive and simply empowers the ‘transfer agent’.
In summary, we’re screwed.[/quote]

Agreed. I think it would be very naive and short sighted to assume that powerful men who had a hand in shaping this country at the turn of the 20th century did not look ahead and get a glimpse of the future they were creating. That all of the large scale social engineering programs and the rise of the 20th century welfare state occured by chance.

Power and corruption are not conspiracy theories, but realities of human nature. Economics haven’t changed, either.

You, however, do not have to go down with a sinking ship. If the country is deteriorating, let it. Always let nature run it’s course, and adapt to the new reality that is taking form.

As one of the few individuals who understands the political and economic realities of the world today, you should use this to your advantage over the ignorant masses, in order to secure your own prosperity…when the time comes.

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[quote]Nominal Prospect wrote:

As one of the few individuals who understands the political and economic realities of the world today, you should use this to your advantage over the ignorant masses, in order to secure your own prosperity…when the time comes.[/quote]

Massive tax-evasion and swiss bank accounts?

47

[quote]orion wrote:
Nominal Prospect wrote:

As one of the few individuals who understands the political and economic realities of the world today, you should use this to your advantage over the ignorant masses, in order to secure your own prosperity…when the time comes.

Massive tax-evasion and swiss bank accounts?[/quote]

I prefer Austrian Sparbuch accounts myself. :wink:

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[quote]Varqanir wrote:
orion wrote:
Nominal Prospect wrote:

As one of the few individuals who understands the political and economic realities of the world today, you should use this to your advantage over the ignorant masses, in order to secure your own prosperity…when the time comes.

Massive tax-evasion and swiss bank accounts?

I prefer Austrian Sparbuch accounts myself. ;)[/quote]

Anonymous “Sparbuecher” are no longer possible…

Sorry…

49

[quote]orion wrote:
Varqanir wrote:
orion wrote:
Nominal Prospect wrote:

As one of the few individuals who understands the political and economic realities of the world today, you should use this to your advantage over the ignorant masses, in order to secure your own prosperity…when the time comes.

Massive tax-evasion and swiss bank accounts?

I prefer Austrian Sparbuch accounts myself. :wink:

Anonymous “Sparbuecher” are no longer possible…

Sorry…
[/quote]

Damn. Always sad when a haven falls.

Okay, then, how about a Panamanian bank account in the name of a Panama bearer share corporation?

50

[quote]Nominal Prospect wrote:

[/quote]

You see, Orion, even if your country has seen fit to do away with those delightful anonymous accounts, your economists still kick ass. Ludwig von Mises was to money what Ludwig van Beethoven was to music.