I mean I could make it even more “complicated” by talking about the fact that training a muscle in one state isn’t the same as stressing it at different lengths… 
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I think this is part of the reason people get carried away with volume also. 4 sets of flat bench, I need upper chest so 4 sets of incline, what about lower chest? I know 4 sets of decline. I need something to work chest with a good stretch so will do 4 sets of flys, now I need some thing for peak contraction so will do 4 sets of pec dec. That’s the main work done so now let’s get a good pump and finish off with some machine work and drop sets.
You can do all of that with two movements.
1 - A movement that hits the clavicular pecs like hammer strength incline, where the resistance curve is ascending
2 - A cable crossover mechanical drop set where you train the pecs in the lengthened position with a descending resistance curve at first, then moving back towards the machine where the resistance curve will be descending.
That would cover pretty much all bases. Then the next session you could do an incline press to overload the mid-range. Then follow that up with cable crossovers again supersetted with dips.
You don’t need a ton of different movements if you understand what length you’re both training the muscle in, and what length you’re stressing it in.
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How would you apply this to back and delts? Seems to be harder than for say chest or biceps.
Not if you understand resistance curves and what length the muscle is working in. It’s not difficult at all.
Paul do you recommend the fortitude training ebook on hypertrophy?
Yes. Great book.
I think we can sum up a lot of this thread with a quote from Dante Trudel (creator of DC):
“Here is my personal opinion on volume training…it’s a way for people who cannot generate inhuman intensity during a set to make gains. If that sounds like a “putdown” so be it, I am sorry. Volume training to me is the long way to achieve trauma whereas there are shorter more productive ways of going about it.”
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Having started DC training I have to agree with that. I looked at the training and thought it was way too little volume but it’s brutal if you get the weight right and put the effort in. Although the sets per week don’t fit the recommendations on here at all.
Depends how you define a set, bit of a blurred line there. If you counted the rest pause as 3 sets and could even count the weighted stretch hold as a set, then it would fall in line.
Remember though that the DC routines you see posted are pretty old now and I have read that Dante feels its outdated, if you look a bit more into Dantes more recent training it’s much more like what Paul describes.
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For me it’s fun to read, learn, and experiment. I’m a tinkerer by heart. Sometimes I just have to bite the bullet and find the training form that best suits life at the moment, and I’ll still experiment within whatever constraints may arise.
I would probably have been further along if I had just kept my head down and done really basic stuff, but as it is now I’ve gotten to participate more with the community here and I have a better inner guide when I need and/or want to change things up. I don’t feel at a loss if I get injured, I’m now confident to work around that on my own. By having fretted over details, I now know that I don’t have to.
I suppose the real issue is when trainees never get past that point, or don’t get anything “meta” out of their nerdyness.
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What would you say is ideal for optimum strength and performance- for an athlete ?
Accessory work done ala dc training,
Strength lifts done for multiple sets of low reps at 70-90% ?
Or would you still work up to one top set of a varying rep range when desiring pure strength?
This comes back to why I tell people you can’t maximize growth and strength at the same time.
For maximizing strength (you said optimizing so it’s the same to me) the SAID principle reigns supreme. You need to do what it is you’re trying to get best at. That applies to everything in regards to training.
So why would you use a method like DC, that is more metabolically and cellular driven to improve neural function in a select few lifts?
Base Building covered everything I believe about developing maximum strength. And at no point at my strongest was I doing highly stressful metabolic work.
Again, you’re trying to create a specific adaptation to a stimulus. What stimulus are you providing and is it effective for creating that adaptation?
SAID - do what it is you’re trying to get good at
Stimulus - training it in a method with the proper stimulus to…
Create the desired adaptation
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You got any links, i had a quick google but only found some of his Instagram stuff (i can’t see it all as i don’t have an account).
I’m just waiting for the PC Hypertrophy book to come out!
He talks about it on this insta post here, says warm up and then 1 top set either rest paused or straight set depending on exercise. I read some other stuff on intense muscle forum but cant link that and would have to look for it again.
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? Sorry coach not sure what SAID is.
Cheers, I’ll have a look through that forum.
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That’s what he likes for advanced guys though, I think he still likes the 2 way for pretty much everyone else.
Reading this great thread is amping me up for another go on this. I tried before but, I like my strongman circuits and deads. I should cut these out for a bit and give Dr S another proper road test.
Paul - are know you two are good friends but what is your take on his peri-WO formula? I recall throwing large doses of stuff in here - 5g taurine, tyrosine and all sorts!