Politics of Fear and Greed

Off Topic Politics and World Issues
1

I am sickened by the way the neo-cons on this site have transformed an ostensibly non-partisan, neutral bodybuilding site into a right-wing propaganda mill. You don’t like poor people? Keep it to yourself. Some asshole with a website said that Kerry is gay? Why tell me about it? You don’t think the role of government is to provide for its citizens what they can’t provide for themselves? Fine. Vote for whoever you want, but don’t try to convince me that your guy is better than my guy, or that I’m “out of the mainstream.” There is an ongoing genocide in Sudan - anyone have anything to say about that? Of course not. But Kerry sure is a pussy.

The lessons the neo-cons took from the progressive '60s: everything is political, and there is comfort in numbers. The result - a neverending din of republican propaganda designed to assimilate. You like money and don;t like liberals. I get it. Now why not shut up and hit the gym for a while?

2

Most of the site still is non-partisan and non-political. Letting the Republican voters have their say in the politics forums hasn’t changed the rest of the site. If the views of these guys get you so worked up maybe you should just stay out out of the politics forums.

3

It’s not that I don’t like poor people, I don’t like being poor and I feel like the Democratic Party wants to keep me poor. As soon as I start making major money, they want to take it from me.

If I own a business, they want me to decrease my profit margins, no more new employees.

No more right of self protection. (gun control) Cops can’t be everywhere.

Pour money into a failing education system that will not work (hint; money ain’t the problem, stupid parents and lack of discipline are the problem)
This also gives them more of a reason to dig deeper into my already stretched pockets.

4

We are at work in Sudan. And we’re doing it the John Kerry way - letting the U.N. take the lead.

Don’t like that? Why? Should we have troops over there? Isn’t that exactly the lefts gripe against Bush’s handling of Iraq?

Why is the right voicing their opinions is such a horrible thing? Where is your outrage at left-wing kooks like Lumpy? or Vroom? or Elk?

I find it very insulting that the left, and those nutless wonders known as undecided, seem to have ad nauseum use of the First Amendment, but those of us on the right that actually have something to say are told to sit down and be quiet.

If you don’t like what is said here, please feel free to do one of two things - fight back, or get the hell off of the political forums.

One thing that will not be happening, however, is me sitting down and quietly watching this country acquiesce to the loud mouthed liberals. I have the right to free speech, and I will be using it.

5

DrS:

I think there is a bit to much sterotyping in your post.

  1. I want lower taxes as I do not think that anyone should be punished for hard work. Furthermore, I don’t think government is as efficient with my money as I am.

  2. I think John Kerry is a good man. I really do! I refuse to demonize someone just because I disagree with his politics. I just don’t think he should be President.

  3. I would rather we fight terrorism abroad than on the streets of our cities. George Bush has done that. He has taken the fight to them. And I do think that Iraq, while they may not have weapons of mass destruction, sponsored a good deal of that terrorism. How many attacks have there been on our shores since 9/11? Zero! Thank you Mr. President.

  4. I think marriage and family is the backbone of our society. I know it’s not a perfect institution, however legalizing gay marriage will not help the matter. There are many reasons for this, you can either check some of my previous posts, or wait for a better time to get into this one. By the way 65% of all Americans agree with me. Are they whackos?

  5. My other views are not much different than most Americans. work hard, play by the rules and try to treat people as you would like to be treated, within the constraints of our current system.

If the above makes me a “neo-con” as you put it, I think there are more of us than people like you!

Next time, try not to sterotype. It’s okay if you are liberal, and it’s okay that I’m not. It’s America, you gotta love it!

6

DrS,

I know what has caused you to come unhinged: Your candidate is going to be beaten badly.

Please don’t fret, it’s for the good of the country (and the world) that W. will have another four years.

I would like to offer you some free advice. Instead of posting another Howard Dean/Al Gore-like temper tantrum, perhaps you could re-evaluate your position.

Is it possible that your hatred of Bush has an irrational component to it? In all seriousness, can you really totally dismiss all of us? There are some very thoughtful posters on this forum. Are we all wack-jobs?

I know you are angry, but anger often clouds people’s perceptions. Hysterical, blinded anger rarely leads to constructive results on a personal or national level.

Have you looked inside yourself?

Have you considered giving W. a second look?

I encourage you to challenge some of your beliefs.

By offering no viable candidate and no coherent message, your Democratic party is on the verge of becoming completely irrelevant. Wouldn’t you rather do a little self-anaylsis before they become the modern day Whigs?

Thanks for your attention,

JeffR

7

[quote]DrS wrote:
I am sickened by the way the neo-cons on this site have transformed an ostensibly non-partisan, neutral bodybuilding site into a right-wing propaganda mill. You don’t like poor people? Keep it to yourself. Some asshole with a website said that Kerry is gay? Why tell me about it? You don’t think the role of government is to provide for its citizens what they can’t provide for themselves? Fine. Vote for whoever you want, but don’t try to convince me that your guy is better than my guy, or that I’m “out of the mainstream.” There is an ongoing genocide in Sudan - anyone have anything to say about that? Of course not. But Kerry sure is a pussy.

The lessons the neo-cons took from the progressive '60s: everything is political, and there is comfort in numbers. The result - a neverending din of republican propaganda designed to assimilate. You like money and don;t like liberals. I get it. Now why not shut up and hit the gym for a while? [/quote]

This is amusing.

First off, I take it from your handle that you are a doctor, which would imply some reading-comprehension skills. What part of the forum title “Politics and World Issues” led you to believe you would not be exposed to political opinions on this area of the site?

Secondly, while all of the nasty conservatives have the gall to put up their opinions, which have offended your delicate sensibilities, what did you title your post? “The Politics of Fear and Greed.” No, nothing partisan about using a title like that to describe the politics of conservatives. No, it’s 100% love, joy and buying the world a Coke…

BTW, I love how you throw the title “neocon” out there. Do you have a working definition for that? I know bluey does – you can tell he has a coherent idea of what he thinks a neocon is, even if there’s not necessarily an agreed defintion. But what do you think it means?

Your post reminds me of the normal whining from the non-thinkers on the left: Republicans are mean and try to divide America – We hate Republicans and they are evil. Notice a certain, funny thing about the juxataposition of those two ideas? Wouldn’t the demonization of Republicans actually contribute to the dividing of America, and to the bitterness of the political discussion? Imagine this: Republicans may just get offended when liberals, in an ad hominem tirade, call them fearmongers, Nazis, etc., instead of actually attempting to address the arguments presented.

I’m sorry the forum isn’t a comfortable echo chamber of liberal ideas as is Harper’s or the NYT editorial page. You can continue to wallow in the name calling of more liberal environs, or you can examine your ideas and try to think. I enjoy debating and discussing with thinking liberals [notice the juxtaposition with the above - thinking liberals are interesting - I don’t mean this as a criticism of them] – they make me sharpen my own ideas, and sometimes even change my mind. But if you prefer to be an ostrich, stick your head back in the sand, but don’t whine that people actually have the temerity to discuss politics on the “Politics and World Issues” forum.

8

Looks like the pot is calling the kettle black! :wink:

9

vroom - I would be a right-wing kook, BIG difference

10

Bah, doesn’t anyone have an opinion of their own? Is everyone here so stupid that you can’t disassociate yourselves from your parties? There’s more than a few predefined agendas out there, get a life.

I don’t like either party, but it’s obvious as hell that Bush is one of the worst presidents this country ever had. He needs to be taken down. There’s nothing patriotic about the patriot act, the tax-cuts for the rich are disgusting and no matter what happens to Iraq, it doesn’t take away the fact that it was based on a lie and had been a long time priority of the Reps.

I can’t believe there are still people who think Bush is fit to be president of anything other than a deserted island. This man is a moron who can barely make a press-conference without saying something idiotic.

The whole world laughed at America throughout these four years, it’s just a shame, an embarrassment to have such a fool for a leader.

We aren’t Republicans and Democrats - THEY ARE. We are the voters. And instead of defending some asshole’s agenda why not become smart voters for a change?

11

JeffR - my candidate in all likelihood won’t be on the ballot. Your insinuation that my distaste for right-wing America is irrational (or is that non-Objectivist?) is exactly what I was talking about. As for Bush/Kerry, if you’re so confident that Bush will win, why are you still trying to persuade everyone who will pay attention to vote for Bush?

BB - A neocon is a conservative who believes in unregulated free enterprise, privatization, and trickle-down economics - an economic conservative, as opposed to a traditional conservative, more concerned with social issues. I have no problem with either, except that neoconservatives have also realized that their economic ideals will require a lot of persuasion and disinformation, as their policies will be bad for the majority, and a majority is what is required in a democracy. Enter websites, talking heads, Fox News, pundits, books. Again, free speech, fine with me. I don’t pay any attention. But then my cousin puts me up on a website where I learn about nutrition, some workouts, and improving my physique for rugby season (I’m a medical student) and I have to read about how democrats are socialists, how protestors are anarchists, and other right-wing bullshit. Rather than informed and balanced discussions about fact and policy, I’m subjected to tirade and opinion from the far right, most of whom I doubt have seen the inside of a gym since the Ford Administration. Dissenters are instantly characterized as ultra-liberal.

If your motivation for posting a thread or link is to inform or spark meaningful discussion, then I have no issue with you. But if your agenda is to persuade, influence public perception, or convince me that 2+2=5, then you should be ashamed, as far as I’m concerned.

All that is to say, I am officially announcing my retirement from the Politics and World Issues forum on the T-Nation website. Knock yourselves out.

12

DrS,

“All that is to say, I am officially announcing my retirement from the Politics and World Issues forum on the T-Nation website. Knock yourselves out.”

Don’t be a cry-baby. Be a T-Man and learn from your errors. If you can’t argue effectively, learn. You won’t become a more informed voter unless you test your ideas against well-informed people.

If your ideas are strong, they can withstand scrutiny.

By the way, I don’t think I have to convince people to vote for Bush, Bush and Kerry are doing that very effectively.

Thanks,

JeffR

13

w2097,

I think everything you said in your post was an error!!!

Congratulations!!!

I’ll bet it feels good for you to get 100% on something!!

By the way, are you voting for Kerry?

Thanks for the terrific post!!!

JeffR

14

DrS,

This is absurd. Dont chide me to “go hit the weights”. You have no business doing so, as I hit plenty of weights.

I guess I could go on about how we are all
entitled to our opinions…and we like discussing them here occassionally. However, you wild-eyed rant doesnt deserve that dignity.

Instead, I’ll give you some free advice…get fucking lost.

15

conservatives vs. neo-conservatives

Traditional conservatives believe in small government that does little but secures boarders and law and order.

Neo-conservatives believe in MASSIVE government (world government if possabile). They care little about secure boarders infact they openly support open boarders and mass movement of peoples. They also up hold the right of government to engage in what ever social enginering utopia they desire.

Traditional conservatives are local or national in focus. Concerned about local issues.

Neo-conservatives are global and inter-national focused. Concerned about re-making the world in their image.

And never the two shall meet.

16

DrS:

If indeed you are a medical student and have the balls to get through residency (which I doubt given your cry baby “I’m going to take my toys and go home” disposition), some day you might become a “real” practicing physician confronted with six-figure malpractice premiums. Let me know how you’re feeling about the domocratic party then.

17

DrS:

Goodbye and take care.