Yes, but some want to make this guy out to be Jesus. Maybe he didn’t deserve to get shot but getting shot doesn’t make him a saint. And dishonest people who engage in unethical and possibly illegal activity, tend to have that manifest in most areas of their lives. So, it’s not exactly unrelated.
One would hope they would check your paper work, if they offer to do so, prior to setting the appointment.
Some lead you on, in good faith you get treated, then say surprise and tell you it’s your responsibility to check. You’ve already filled out their paperwork and don’t have a leg to stand on, so out of pocket or sold to collections it is.
And they do this shady shit on the backend when billing insurance too….
Fun fact, when signing a document your signature is only accepting information above it, so if you ever have awkward intake forms where you sign at the top under mundane information and the meat is underneath, you’re probably about to deal with some bullshit. But you’re not obligated, until you complete the transaction and sign for that too.
My worst experience was an optometrist. I wear contacts and had my annual exam done at a new place after my old guy retired.
The whole process felt like a car dealership from the moment I walked in. It just had a very manipulative sale sort of vibe.
They had the weird intake form mentioned above, with lots of hard to decipher fees and lingo on how they’re applied below. I’m fully insured and at the end my visit came out something like $970 out of pocket, and I did pre verify coverage myself. Should’ve been like $35. They explained it later at the end of the story for context as “non insurance related office fees”.
Then they tried to sell me contacts but the dumbass had two options on her computer screen when she turned it around.
Same brand, same contact, but one was packaged in bulk for a year and the other was in monthly packages totaled to a years worth which cost 10x as much. Insurance, which was integrated in to their program, was willing to pay for the legitimate year package. Likely a unit cost thing they negotiate on the backend. They would not pay for the rigged up bundle. But this is what the optometrist was trying to sell to avoid the insurance rate annd hit me with full retail plus mark-up out of pocket. But she mistakenly left the real deal visible.
I knew exactly what was happening and called her on it. Saw it on her face and then she got bitchy. Like the typical attitude women get when you catch them doing something wrong.
Not ashamed to admit it I figuratively tore her a new asshole.
I refused to pay not only for the contacts but also the appointment itself, and her last threat was of course collections.
We revisited her contract and the signature thing, I let her know I’d have a lawyer call if necessary and she smirked. I’m sure she’s heard it a million times. And, she did send me to collections. Also and, I actually do have a lawyer on retainer. And he did call. They reversed action pretty quick and never engaged further, which was a good thing because I would’ve pursued out of spite and I’ve never sued anybody. Not a sue happy guy.
Anyways, had I been someone else without a general understanding of how insurance and contracts work, I likely would’ve been completely gaslit in to thinking my insurance was shit and I was stuck paying costs.
Doctors are not our friends. They’re business people too, out for profit, and maybe first. Some are ethical and some are not. It’s all a big mess.
1 Like
Thats the first thing I do. If they don’t accept that, no sense in going further.
Yeah. When there’s money on the line I get a lot less trusting. Especially when they’re making as much off of selling the credit card/plan as they are off of the dental procedures.
I also wonder if by turning it into credit card debt it doesn’t do a run around some of the legal restrictions regarding medical debt.
It does. It becomes personal debt as soon as you put it on a personal line of credit.
Now technically we owe what we agree to, but that kicks back around to cost to begin with.
It’s unfortunate medical groups can be so sneaky about billing, however.
I’m sure their bills are walked a lot, and one reason they jack up prices is because they’re calculating what they can recoup if they sell to a collector.
Still, for those of us paying on the up and up it sucks to be the sucker they dump it all on.
1 Like
Yeah. One step back from public view is that it has value on the market for consumer credit debt.
My brother is in the local plumbers union and ran into this. His coverage changed as a result of contract negotiation. He didn’t find this out until he went to the dentist and was “issued” a card under some dubious prearranged understanding between the practice, the union, and the issuer of the credit card.
Then he found out he was on the hook for the entire billing amount.
So he and about 25 other people started pushing shit uphill through their union channels, demanding answers as to why they went from premium coverage to none at all.
So the word they got was that their union reps didn’t know that was how it worked (bullshit). And it saved them- the union members $15 per month!
Their reps sold them down the river en mass to a credit card company, and I’m sure that the reps, attorneys one and all, knew exactly what they were signing on for and recieved some great incentives $$$ for switching their old plan to this new one.
I don’t know much about unions but it’s my understanding the protections they offer can often be mired in bureaucratic red tape and leadership greed.
In general, adding a 3rd party with potential for ulterior motives to an already complicated process is a recipe for frustration. And allowing credit companies to enter the fray is a horror movie.
The optometrist I mentioned had her whole pitch wrapped around “medical credit”, which is a lie from the title.
The nearly $1,000 non-insurance related office charges were all neatly bundled in a way that patients could conveniently enter a credit backed payment plan that would see their balance hit $0 just in time for the next appointment if they wanted to, and, their line of credit would be wide open again!
It’s all very predatory and packaged as “care”, so people buy it. It’s a doctor! A pillar of the community.
And of course the doc has no clue. That’s what the billing department does. Even though he owns the practice.
Not to be confused with a top role in a megalith of a corporation who delegates literally everything a few chains down. And this little plug is for Zecarlo because I anticipate a logic leap for a comparison.
Yeah. They closed the deal on 2000 people by getting a couple to agree to it.
Yeah. That definitely capitalizes on the trust engrained in the family doctor archetype. My one buddy that worked at a major university- he literally has no idea about billing and whatnot. Transplants, sure. Billing, nope. My heart guy, maybe a little. He’s part of a professional group that practices through local hospitals. And I landed there via the ER, so 
.
Health and hospital systems are the businesses that hire doctors. Usually in those scenarios doctors are employees filling their specific role and probably are unaware. They just show up and turn the screws they’re responsible for.
The doctor owned groups andsole proprietorships are another story. Typically in my experience they’re better.
I guess I’ve been lucky because I’ve never had any major issues with my insurance, from medical to auto to homeowner.
I just got new insurance at the beginning of the year through work. My pharmacy is Express Scripts. I’m on 3 meds that I can pay LESS for out of pocket at Walgreens than Express Scripts charges me through my insurance. One of them is $700 less for a three month supply than what Express Scripts charges.
Statistically, you are the norm. By far.
Terrible news.
For the record, Brian was CEO of United Healthcare, which was a company under the broader umbrella of UnitedHealth Group, as is Optum, a pharmacy they own.
Brian had zero controlling interest over Optum. Two separate entities.
Pharmaceuticals are absolutely marking up prices. Same companies that sell pills they make for pennies at thousands of dollars per pill.
It’s a major problem because the question of supply and demand is skewed when it’s literally life or death.
If you want to find real greed, look at the cost leaders. Every time.
1 Like
Guess a generation of Cali Dem politicians deserve to die then. For sure cali would be better off.
Replace Cali Dems with all.
So aiding attempts to hiring medical staff and etc. doesn’t allocate resources?
So denying treatment for profit isn’t greed?
It’s not broken. It’s working the way it’s intended.
No .
This doesn’t happen, Castoli. And if it did the lawsuit would be so big greed would reverse. This has already been discussed. Go back and read. For comprehension.