yippee… you kicked the ass of an anorexic college student…
Now go to your local kindergarden and kick the ass of every little commie bastard that shares his toys without charging for it.
On his personal website it refers to him as an educator, religious leader, and an author. He is the founder of both a television network and a university of which he is president and chancellor. He has been on the Council for National Policy. He also has a law degree.
That makes him an authority figure and a person of influence.
He has a large audience that looks to him for spiritaul and moral guidance.
Public figures in positions like this need to have a certain amount of common sense and judgement about what comes out of their mouthes. Tact and diplomacy are virtues.
And any shephard with a flock simply should not make blunt statements about people who they think should be murdered.
Maybe my analogies aren’t exact, but they were simply provided to show examples of when speech needs to be monitored and some internal censoring needs to be applied by the speaker. I believe in freedom of speech, and I believe in civil liberties, but I also believe there are cases when words can have too much power. Remember, Charles Manson never killed anybody.
[quote]reddog6376 wrote:
First, who ever called Pat Robertson an authority figure?
Second, his audence isn’t children.
Third, he didn’t say he was going to murder anybody, he was expressing his opinion that the gov’t should do it. Which is certainly free speech.
You’re really stretching for that one.[/quote]
- Mr. robertson said that the venezeli=uian pres. should be “taken out”, not assinated. Although you and i know that “taken out” in street slang means killed, in the jargon of the upper class rich folks it means " gotten rid of by fireing, demoting, imprisoning, etc. Mr robertson is too high class to understand us poor folks, and was raised that way. God bless…
[quote]John K wrote:
On his personal website it refers to him as an educator, religious leader, and an author. He is the founder of both a television network and a university of which he is president and chancellor. He has been on the Council for National Policy. He also has a law degree.
That makes him an authority figure and a person of influence.
He has a large audience that looks to him for spiritaul and moral guidance.
Public figures in positions like this need to have a certain amount of common sense and judgement about what comes out of their mouthes. Tact and diplomacy are virtues.
And any shephard with a flock simply should not make blunt statements about people who they think should be murdered.
Maybe my analogies aren’t exact, but they were simply provided to show examples of when speech needs to be monitored and some internal censoring needs to be applied by the speaker. I believe in freedom of speech, and I believe in civil liberties, but I also believe there are cases when words can have too much power. Remember, Charles Manson never killed anybody.
[/quote]
That’s absolute horse shit, and you know it.
If it were Jesse Jackson, or Al Sharpton that had made those remarks (If the facts be known, Sharpton did way worse than just talk about murder) you wouldn’t be saying a damn thing about it. Let’s hear your rage over their comments. Where is your “they must be silenced” bullshit in the face of Louis Farrakhan’s hate filled vitriole?
The ONLY reason you are taking this convoluted position is because you want the right wing silenced. It’s a typical ploy used by the left to try and silence the right. Only the right won’t lay down and take this without a fight. You guys actually have to provide some TRUTH to your position - something the left wouldn’t know if it slapped them on the ass.
At the very least, have a little honesty. Antioher thing the left has whored out to the highest bidder.
[quote]Clark Call wrote:
Ok, I am done with this one, I know I said I was bowing out before. This arguing about the evil of communism and the murders of the Soviet Union and other regimes is pointless when you are doing so with a Soviet-Cuban that loves totalitarianism yet lives in Canada because he couldn’t stand living in Cuba.
[/quote]
You have accused me several times of putting words in your mouth, and using “trickery”, and then you post something like this? I have consistently said I am not a fan of Castro, and I consider the USSR evil. I have also, however, pointed out that the US was on the same page. But I guess it’s pointless arguing with an American about the evils of imperialism and the muders of their government. You don’t become a world superpower and stay there without doing evil things. You can either accept it, and be ok with it, or keep denying it, and be a hypocrite, it’s up to you.
I’m a “commie” in the sense that I believe that at some point, the goal of production will have to shift from generating wealth to satisfying needs, or the inability to meet needs will become increasingly inadequate. You see, a free-market is a huge step up from feudalism, but it does have it’s limitations, and I think these will become more and more severe with time. I don’t think you can “force” communism through revolution, and I certainly don’t think you can have such a thing as a “communist country”. I am a business student, and I plan on making myself obscenely wealthy. You will find me surprisingly conservative, but that doesn’t mean I have to ignore opposing information. But I like your mental image there. If thinking of me as a pot smiking hippie sitting around in cafes, knock yourself out.
I don’t downplay them, I question them, and with good reason. And stop calling communism a type of government, that is retarded.
No, they’ve had some pretty great leaders, but in a situation like that, there’s very little you can do. They’ve also had some pretty terrible leaders, and they certainly didn’t help things. For the record, I don’t use any drugs (including alcohol and nicotine).
Being anti-war has very little to do with economic systems; being rude even less. You made an ass of yourself. You are a bad cliche, how does that make you feel?
You are a hero. You took a situation that could have easily been diffused, and turned it into an excuse to flex nuts. You seem pretty insecure to me.
[quote]
Kind of warms your heart, I thought commies were all about peace. I have some great hippie asskicking stories I will have to share sometime. [/quote]
You champion the cause of needless violence under the guise of patriotism, and even throw in terms you don’t understand to make it better. Don’t worry though, it doesn’t even matter if they were right or not, as long as you can kick their asses, you are the MAN. Grow up, and stop skipping classes.
Great point by Andrew Sullivan:
Yet another expression of his version of Christianity from Pat Robertson. Recall that Robertson was on the list of people consulted by the administration on the Supreme Court nomination. He’s not an outsider, even though every sane conservative says he is the minute he opens his mouth and says something hateful again. He was once a credible presidential candidate. The test of mainstream Republicans’ integrity is if they do not simply denounce this comment but denounce Robertson and his political machine. He is their Michael Moore. Instead, you get mealy-mouthed and exhausted-to-the-bone attempts to blame it on the liberal media.
[quote]pittbulll wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
pittbulll wrote:
I think aleksander is speaking about Ideal Communism. Ideally communism is not bad. Just as Ideally a Democracy or a Republic would be superior to what we have today
He is talking about a Utopia that cannot exist.
It is the atheist version of debating how many angels can fit on the head of a pin.
Do you consider Labor Unions or welfare to be communistic?
[/quote]
Of course not. Labor unions are necessary to keep balance in the capitalist system.
Welfare is to take care of those unable to take care of themselves.
Both are often abused, but corporate CEOs also abuse power too.
[quote]John K wrote:
…
I’m still a capitalist, but I do not believe you can trust the market to make the right decisions without some intelligent oversight.
Zap Branigan wrote:
Capitalism = less government control = freedom.
Communism = more government control = subservience.
[/quote]
I agree, that is why I said less control and not no control.
Everyone that lives in a society needs oversight.
I don’t trust corporate CEOs any more than I trust used car salesmen and trial lawyers.
[quote]hspder wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
orion wrote:
…
If that someone is a fascist, a communist or a fanatic muslim really doesn?t matter to me.
…
It matters to me. All of these ideologies are evil. All should be resisted.
Absolutely agreed. However, there’s a very, very large difference between resisting and persecuting. And that’s orion’s point – and mine, for that matter.
[/quote]
Pat Robertson is as loathesome as Al Sharpton.
I do not propose persecuting or assasinating Hugo Chavez at this point in time, however I will not stand by while some “useful idiots” (Stalins term) sing his praises, but do not acknowledge his many faults.
.
[quote]Clark Call wrote:
Zeppelin795 wrote:
Actually ClarkCall it is you who’s a victim of propaganda. Your statement about ballot-stuffing and death squads prove it. This all emanates from the U.S. gov. and their corporate conterparts. Once you look beyond the corporate media propaganda to non-corporate news sources you will begin to have the information that is needed to understand the world.
And if you really want to talk about terrorism why don’t we start with one of the biggest organizations located in Washington D.C. But nah, I guess that would challenge your ideas of American mythology so I suppose it’s just easier to keep your head in the sand and pretend all is going well.
What is with all this corporation bashing, it makes me feel like Im in the Berkley student union. I am afraid you are the one with the proverbial “head in the sand”. I have been to more countries than you can point out on a map and speak more languages than you can comprehend. My experience far outweighs your “Daddy’s putting me through college” communism that you espouse. As far as getting my news from “corporate sources”, you consider “El Univeral” and “El Mundo” from Venezuela bastions of American corporate propaganda. If you would get off your knees from in front of Michael Moore for just a moment, you will notice that all of the theories you claim as your own have been tried and all failed miserably.
I imagine you get your news from Mother Jones or some other kooky communist publication. That is fine, but don’t expect to be accepted for holding on to ideas that have proven to be disastrous and foolhearty.
Do I claim that the United States government is infallable, can do no wrong? Absolutely not, mistakes have been made since the beginning of time. But to say that since our system has a few flaws, that we should scrap the entire idea and grab hold of some of that really successful socialism. Foolish.
I love America and I disdain people that hate our country, including many of it’s own citizens. People like you have had freedom for too long. You need to be reminded what real totalitarianism is, not what you think it is. The fear of being sent to a prison camp and working 18 hour days until the skin peels off your bones. Having commisars kill your children in your own living room. The fear of being shot execution style and buried in a mass grave or how about a good old beheading. I suggest you either come to grips with reality and see the real truth behind what you claim to be a perfect form of government[/quote]
Where did I say I esposed communism? I just pointed out that Venezula has a sovergn right to choose it’s own leader even if he is hostile to U.S. corporations. And Robertson is a fool for what he said!
Where did I say that I hated my country? I simply disagee with the policies of the Corporate State. Did Russians who disagreed with the policies of the USSR hate their country? Were they anti-russians for doing so? Does your disdain reach to all of the war veterans who protested this war? Are they anti-american?
All the murderous things you mention that have happened in totalitarian states may not happen in so-called “free” countries like ours but that is testimony of how well the propaganda system works here. The corporate/state quells it’s citizens through that system of lies.
How many innocent people has this country murdered directly and by proxy? The number must be staggering.
Unfortunately it’s citizens don’t know about it due to the orchestrated cover-up by the corporate media.
If you read the corporate press and that’s it then you are a victim of mass media propaganda - period.
LOL~!
[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
pittbulll wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
pittbulll wrote:
I think aleksander is speaking about Ideal Communism. Ideally communism is not bad. Just as Ideally a Democracy or a Republic would be superior to what we have today
He is talking about a Utopia that cannot exist.
It is the atheist version of debating how many angels can fit on the head of a pin.
Do you consider Labor Unions or welfare to be communistic?
Of course not. Labor unions are necessary to keep balance in the capitalist system.
Welfare is to take care of those unable to take care of themselves.
Both are often abused, but corporate CEOs also abuse power too.[/quote]
I see both as being forms of socialism.
[quote]Zeppelin795 wrote:
How many innocent people has this country murdered directly and by proxy? The number must be staggering.
Unfortunately it’s citizens don’t know about it due to the orchestrated cover-up by the corporate media.
[/quote]
I’d like to know some examples of this. And before you start, I don’t consider casualties of war (combatants or “collateral damage” civilians to be murder). Please use examples post WWI, as they are more relevant.
[quote]The ONLY reason you are taking this convoluted position is because you want the right wing silenced. It’s a typical ploy used by the left to try and silence the right. Only the right won’t lay down and take this without a fight. You guys actually have to provide some TRUTH to your position - something the left wouldn’t know if it slapped them on the ass.
At the very least, have a little honesty. Antioher thing the left has whored out to the highest bidder.[/quote]
Rainjack, unfortunately, the left and right are identical in this way… as much as you rail against the left for it, the shoe fits both feet.
What to do?
[quote]vroom wrote:
The ONLY reason you are taking this convoluted position is because you want the right wing silenced. It’s a typical ploy used by the left to try and silence the right. Only the right won’t lay down and take this without a fight. You guys actually have to provide some TRUTH to your position - something the left wouldn’t know if it slapped them on the ass.
At the very least, have a little honesty. Antioher thing the left has whored out to the highest bidder.
Rainjack, unfortunately, the left and right are identical in this way… as much as you rail against the left for it, the shoe fits both feet.
What to do?[/quote]
Please cite an example of the right doing this. Just because you say it is so doesn’t make it true.
And please spare me the whole WMD bs.
Rainjack, the right and the left both cry about things they don’t like and wish it would go away.
Do you ever cross the center line? I know I do…
[quote]buffballswell wrote:
What the hell is this jerk-off thinking, publicly calling for the assassination of Venezuelan president Hugo Chavez. For those not in the know, Venezuela happens to be one of the nations top importers of crude oil, and with gas prices approaching
wallet exploding prices, this has to be one of the most deep-fried and stupified public statements made in recent history.
So, I hereby call for the assassination of
Pat Robertson. Two in the chest one the head, Retard. Your thoughts please.[/quote]
My thoughts exactly.
He reads in his special bible that it’s ok to kill people. The guy is obviously a raving lunatic.
And besides, killing him would be much cheaper than prosecuting him.
[quote]Wreckless wrote:
He reads in his special bible that it’s ok to kill people. The guy is obviously a raving lunatic.
And besides, killing him would be much cheaper than prosecuting him.
[/quote]
I got your hatred for you right here, vroom.
Care to reconsider any of your other accusations in the face what what you buddy just said?
[quote]rainjack wrote:
It’s amazing how quickly the wacky left will crawl out if the woodwork after statements like this.
I guess this is another example of the first amendment only applying to the wacked out left.
Do I agree with Robertson? Absolutely not.
Does Sheehan have any more right to say the shit she has been saying than Robertson has to say his?
Staple his mouth shut? Give me a break. [/quote]
It’s amazing how quickly the wacky right will use the words “wacky left”
after statements like this.
Who’s wacky? Surely Pat Robertson is.
Who’s a traitor? Surely Novak is.
So put Robertson in an asylum and Novak in jail, and then well talk wacky left. But with these 2 on the loose, please, never mention “wacky left again”.
I’ll keep pointing your friends out to everybody, when you mention “wacky left” ever again.
And how dare you compare Sheehan to your wacky friend. What did any Republican pig sacrifice in this war? Dubious doesn’t even loose his sleep over it. He’s on vacation and hanging loose.
“Wacky left” indeed.
The moron put the entire US military in a vice, but he’s hanging loose.
Looks like he’s AWOL.
Again.
Lower in rank have been dishonorebly discharged for smaller offences.