I’d agree with that
Time and patience. Many of the issues I had corrected themselves once the only option I had left was time and patience. Wish I would have tried that first but I’m not very patient.
I hope that’s the case. I’m now approaching 8 weeks of 200mg/wk, daily IM, and I’m feeling worse than ever. I have just retained the side effects and lost the initial sexual improvements I saw. I think I noticed the (few and slight) sexual improvements drop off after the change from cypionate to enanthate in week 4-5. Perhaps I “restarted the clock,” as some of you say. Or maybe I metabolize enanthate differently. It’s hard to say.
I’ll have bloods in a week or so. If there’s anything notable, I’ll post them here and make changes as needed. If they look perfect, well… I’m not sure.
I may try a lower dose of TRT + a DHT derivative like anavar/oxandrolone.
School stress has been immense lately, so existing health issues + hormone-fluctuation-induced anxiety have sent me into a complete tailspin.
On top of that, I am unable to really exercise (aside from walk) due to the histamine-triggering effects of exercise that TRT has given me.
I’m considering taking some time off grad school until I can get my health issues straightened out. I feel way too foggy, unmotivated, and unfocused continue on in my current state.
I hope I can look back at these posts and laugh one day.
What other medications and supplements are you taking?
I’ve been dependent on benzos for years (but they’re unrelated to the sexual problems). SSRIs left me with those.
Drug/supplement changes since starting TRT:
- NAC - 2 pills 2x / day (helps increase mental clarity / improves sleep / reduces oxidative stress)
- magnesium glycinate (sleep)
- antihistamines - as a bandaid for the histamine rashes I’ve been getting since starting TRT
- vitamin d3 and k2 (sometimes)
Hey just FYI, this doesn’t have a great reputation for increasing libido (actually the opposite in my experience).
Masteron would be better DHT choice (if we’re allowed to mention that in the TRT forum). Sorry if we’re not
It’s been so short a time since you started. Have patience. Your body will probably recover.
Don’t change anything. It takes time man. TRT is not a quick solution. It took the body years to break to this state. It takes time to regain health. Just be careful of taking anything that could potential make it worse.
BENZOS definitely causes me sexual problems 
Even though I felt like shit, I stuck out the 8 weeks on 210 mg/wk. Things started with some improvements (return of morning wood, harder and longer lasting erections, windows of libido, increased muscle mass/body hair, increased vascularity), but around week 5-6, the improvements started to fade and I started feeling worse and worse. My trial essentially followed an inverted U-curve, and at week 8, my erections were very weak (impotence, essentially) and morning wood was absent.
I was hoping to find some abnormalities and correct my course accordingly, but bloods look surprisingly good, as far as I can tell.
^ for exact numbers and reference ranges
T over 1500
Free T outside range
E2 in control (under high end of range)
Prolactin and Progesterone slightly elevated, but nothing that should cause impotence
Lipids are slightly elevated relative to were before starting TRT, and RBC count is up but still in range. I don’t really have any concerns on these fronts.
The high progesterone is really interesting, considering I had normal progesterone before starting TRT, and I’m shutdown. So, the preg-prog conversion must be occurring from adrenal output – potentially very high adrenal output. And this is in line with my symptoms. While running these high doses of testosterone, I started experiencing very high levels of anxiety, while I’m normally very blunted and have a very diminished fear/anxiety response (as well as all other emotions).
Since I lost all sexual benefits and was experiencing such major anxiety (could hardly open my email without a knot in my stomach) + other weird side effects like the histamine reactions, I decided to drop the dose down to 150 and assess how I felt. Within a week, I felt better on all fronts. I don’t feel “good” – but just close to baseline again. I certainly don’t tolerate high doses of TRT well, in spite of my good blood numbers. I’m not sure why.
I guess my next course of action will be running a replacement dose (like 150mg/wk) while adding on a DHT derivative or two. I believe this might be beneficial, as most T is aromatized in the brain. Using DHT derivatives can more easily upregulate androgen receptors in certain areas of the brain, even if they are’t as “androgenic” as testosterone.
@highpull Any thoughts about how to move forward given these apparently good blood numbers yet poor overall response to the high doses of T?
My doctor said staying on a lower dose of TRT and adding oxandrolone may be a reasonable option. I’m really unsure of the correct direction at the moment. These “post-drug syndrome” cases are complicated, and unfortunately we sometimes don’t respond to substances in the same manner as the vast majority of the population does. I’m open to any suggestions, though.
@enackers I’ve been on benzos for a long time, and while I agree they are awful drugs to be dependent on, my daily dose now feels like water. It doesn’t have any impact on sexual function. If anything, drugs that raise GABA and reduce glutamate (like alcohol) actually help my sexual function, paradoxically.
I think you are on the right path. While not common, I have guys that do much better with the lower end doses of testosterone.
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I’m a pfs case. Been all over the place with various forms and doses of trt for about a year.
I went as high as 120mg per week and felt like it was too much. Was way over range T and E2, also. Tried to add hcg 500x2 a wk and go off test. Didn’t work at all when I got way down, as everyone expected.
I’ve settled in on about 90mg a wk and felt better lately with lower hcg at about 200x2 a wk.
Morning wood, mood, strength, cognition all pretty good. The hcg is kicking in but it took me 2 and 1/2 months or so. Sensitivity improving finally. Main issue still orgasms feel like a dud but think they might be starting to come back slightly. Hoping anyways. Seemed like less hcg is more in my case.
Anyways, long way of saying why not try a low dose of hcg and give it a good few months before the DHT stuff. I’ve heard of guys crashing after raising their DHT way over range and worry it might happen to you.
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Was this with hcg?
No, I hadn’t started hcg yet. I do 45mg now every 4 days. Feel fine. I could probably raise it a touch more, but, when I was 60mg every 3,5 days too much for me.
Thanks for the input. I’ve read a lot of reports around here about guys seeing improvements over more prolonged periods of time in some cases, so I didn’t want to jump the gun and get off the higher doses if my body was still in the “adaptation phase.” Maybe it was; maybe it wasn’t. Typically, progression seems more linear, though. In my case, it seems the improvements I initially noted were fading.
Either way, since I couldn’t work or focus on school, it was not really a feasible trial for the time being, and may be something to revisit at a later date should other protocols not work.
Thanks for the input. I’ve noticed a lot of guys in the PFS community recently reporting success with HCG.
I believe JoeKool cured himself with and thus popularized the long-term, low-dose HCG protocol. Fantastic news. I know a couple guys in the PSSD community who have tried it without luck, though. One even crashed pretty hard on it.
I believe, while there is serious overlap in symptoms and both are essentially conditions relating to abnormal hormonal signaling, PFS and PSSD are qualitatively different in some respects, and that cannot be overlooked when developing a treatment plan.
We have recently had some guys improve on base T + oxandrolone and/or trenbolone.
There is a risk of crashing with every substance. At the end of the day, you have to decide how miserable you are and calculate loose risk/reward ratios, based on both anecdotal evidence and the available literature. It’s a tough spot to be.
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Intersecting about the BENZOS.
You need to realize TRT can take months. Your dose and levels are good. Now sit at that dose for the next 3-4 months . Don’t change anything at all . It takes a year for us to realize max benefit and then year 2 you continue to feel better/ 2-3 months isn’t much time
That’s fair. All the side effects (insane anxiety, exacerbated CNS sensitivities, lack of appetite, sleep issues, brain fog, histamine reactions) were too much to bear with my current responsibilities. If I have some time in the future where I can “power through” such effects for the light at the end of the tunnel, I may give high doses another go.
Even then, there’s no guarantee that I’d ever stabilize. It might exhaust my adrenals and push me in the wrong direction. Our bodies are all so individual that it’s difficult to say.
As of right now, I feel better on the lower doses and will run some alternative trials that won’t interfere with life’s current responsibilities majorly.
I second the Masteron comment. Anavar completely killed my libido and ability to have an erection around 12 days in @ 50mg/day. Masteron on the other hand made me feel like I NEEDED to have sex multiple times a day and on the days I didn’t get it multiple times I felt crazy. I was taking 150mg/week divided into daily doses.
The only negatives I saw personally were hair loss at the scalp and body hair gain. Some folks report it murdering their lipids so you may want to check yours before you start to have a base line and I wouldn’t recommend being on it for long lengths of time regardless. It’s not really a long term solution.
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Some psychiatry medications are known to block DAO in the intestine, wich prevents histamine to be absorbed in high quantities into the bloodstream from high histamine food (fermented foods, mainly), diazepam is specially strong DAO inhibitor
High histamine causes insomnia, loss of appetite, gastritis (h2 blockers are used fo gastritis), anxiety,cortisol jolts, headaches, bad memory, itchy skin, tinnitus (I read somewhere that histamine potentiates NMDAR or something), and I think even problems regulating body temperature.
I know a particular case that the guy though he was on diazepam whitdrawal when in reality just had histamine intolerance probably due to years of diazepam and because the symptoms kinda overlaps
The histamine thing could be that you just absorbing to much because DAO deficiency and accumulates in the body through the food, although histamine intolerance seems extremely rare…
Also high cortisol will negate the effects of androgens because cortisol blocks the AR receptor by itself and lowers androgen production as a plus. And testosterone also blocks the GR receptor, probably one mechanism of his anti catabolism effects
Interesting that a non-aromatizable DHT derivative could wreck both your libido and EQ. It doesn’t even have any affinity for PRs, to my knowledge.
Anyway, I guess I’m looking more at substances to run long-term without sides. I know every steroid – hell, every drug – affects your biology in some way, but if I could run low-dose TRT + maybe mesterolone or oxandrolone, or even both, then it might improve the ultimate DHT:E2 ratio I’m trying to achieve.
I wish TRT alone worked for me, and it’s still on the table…
I just don’t know where to begin. I started at 210mg/wk, ran that for 8 weeks, and it taxed the hell out of my adrenals and spiked progesterone significantly. Any idea why this would happen? If anything, the testicular production should lower pregnenolone and thus progesterone/other downstream steroids.
Now, was my body still an adjustment period? Maybe. But usually there is some linear progression with regard to seeing positive results. I was going backwards, if anything. I couldn’t unfortunately ride it out due to responsibilities the insomnia/anxiety/other symptoms were interfering with to see if these issues would resolve in more weeks or months.
I would say the first several weeks were good, sexually, before taking a major nose dive. I wish I had some magic graphing function that charted the hormones level over time – onto which I could map dates when I was feeling good and feeling ultra shitty and why.
Alas, it seems TRT is extremely individual, and it comes down to long roads of trial and error.