i wont…money is obviously faster all around its plain as day on the screen…castillo could be saying that because pac attacks more than money, and pac comes wit some nasty 4-5 punch combos that dont lose velocity. also his sparring partner is going to be impartial anyways
[quote]cutthoat25 wrote:
fnf wrote:
cutthoat25 wrote:
fnf wrote:
FightinIrish26 wrote:
Pretzel Logic wrote:
You never know what a beating like he took against Margarito will do to a guy, look at Margarito-Mosley. A KO is not out of the question but a standing TKO or stoppage from cuts is more likely. If both guys come in ready it’s tough to call. Cotto is slower and not real elusive plus he will stand in front of Pacquiao, but he has beaten faster more busy fighters before.
I agree. Pac is not faster than Zab Judah or Mosely, and he doesn’t hit harder than Margarito or Mosley.
\
Hopkins a few months ago on ESPN said Pac is faster than Zab and possibly faster than Mayweather. I tend to agree with him more than you, Irish. But May is much more accurate than Pac.
When Pac fights a natural welterweight, he’ll possibly come in at 147-149. The natural welterweights will come in at 155+. Add that to their reach and strength, Pac will always be at a hitting disadvantage, but Pac will always have a speed advantage.
ok not trying to start shit with u, but since when is hopkins the authority on boxing talent? he himself was a good fighter, but that doesnt make him a good judge of talent. i dont think manny is anywhere near as fast as floyd, but who the hell am I to judge talent? lol…if pac gets past cotto we will get see both may and pac in the ring, then we can judge there hand speed, movement and footwork
I know Hopkins isn’t the gospel, I’m just throwing out names on what people said of other fighters. I do believe Pac is faster than Zab but not Mayweather because of Mays accuracy and timing.
Now I’ve been following May since the beginning of his career and before Pacquiao. And to me, RJJ and May are the most gifted fighters I’ve ever seen. They do things that can’t be taught, and there’s no need to mention any of it if you’ve followed their careers.
Do I want to see May fight Pac? Yes and no. It would be an exciting fight but I don’t want to see Pac lose, and it does nothing for Mays legacy. The last 3 fights of Mays have been smaller opponents. It’s time for May to fight opponents his size and not blown up lightweights. But the almighty $$ will have him fight Pac, if Pac can get past Cotto.
agreed…u just layed it all out right here…but how ginormous would that fight between pac and money be? pac wont let money play D and pic him apart…pac will press him and has enough speed to make mayweather stay on his toes…floyd will be forced to trade with pac…but again i think mays ability and natural ring generalship will take over the fight[/quote]
From my observation, the 2 main differences between May and Marquez, 2 counter-punchers, is Mays speed and power. You give May the openings that Marquez had against Pac in their second fight, May KOs Pac. Damn, that was hard to type that! lol
But unlike Irish, I believe Pac has gotten better as a fighter since the 2nd Marquez fight. Yes Diaz sucked and DLH was old, but Pacs balance, head movement, and use of combinations were much, much better and were obvious his last 3 fights. Emanuel Steward said it best during the 1st round of the Pac-Hatton fight, “his ability to hit and simultaneously slip a punch was phenomenal”.
Pac does have a KO chance vs May, and he does have the endurance to bring it all 12 rounds. But he has to take some shots to get in.
We’ll see if this goes down after the 14th, cuz Cotto is a “Bad Man” (said with Ali’s voice)!
[quote]fnf wrote:
From my observation, the 2 main differences between May and Marquez, 2 counter-punchers, is Mays speed and power. You give May the openings that Marquez had against Pac in their second fight, May KOs Pac. Damn, that was hard to type that! lol
[/quote]
True.
I am not saying he wasn’t better- he is. Much better than when I first saw him, where he just had a big left hand and that was it.
However, to say that he is as good Floyd Mayweather is reaching. Mayweather will do exactly what he did to Marquez, exactly what he did to DLH- counter all night, and roll off all of the punches. It’s going to be a much more boring fight than you guys think it will be, and it will be a typical Money masterpiece.
He has a chance to KO Mayweather in the way that all fighters have a chance to be KO’d by “That Punch” when they step in the ring. His chances, however, are neither magnified nor diminished because he’s Manny Pacquaio.
If there’s one rule in every sport, it’s that great defense always beats great offense. The best pitchers will always beat the best hitters, the best defense will always beat the best offense in football.
Mayweather has fought plenty of fighters that have all kinds of power. Castillo had that kind of power in his prime, Corrales had that much power in his prime, DLH had that much power.
With Mayweather, it’s not “getting inside” that’s going to win. You’re not Joe Frazier fighting Muhammud Ali. You’re fighting a guy that has unparalleled defense, who rolls and ducks all kinds of shots, and will let you get inside and still beat you there. On top of that, he’s got a tremendous chin that has left him NEVER even officially knocked down in his career.
He will catch the southpaw Pac coming in with big left hooks, and then slip away. He will dance and duck away from Pac’s left, and land potshots, using his far better reach and almost supernatural accuracy. Pacquiao will not have a chance to knock him out, and I believe that it would be something of a lopsided decision.
I don’t know if you watched the Floyd fight with marquez. I have never seen some one demolish a top 2 pound for pound fighter in that fashion. Floyd shows over and over what he’ll do to smaller guys, and even I give him crap for it.
But aside from a Tarver-eque miracle punch, he will not beat Floyd Mayweather Jr.
Cotto gonna knock him out.
AS a final note on that post, if you want to see what that fight will look like, look to Hagler-Leanord.
No matter how much power you have, if you can’t hit him, you won’t win.
[quote]fnf wrote:
I know Hopkins isn’t the gospel, I’m just throwing out names on what people said of other fighters. I do believe Pac is faster than Zab but not Mayweather because of Mays accuracy and timing.
Now I’ve been following May since the beginning of his career and before Pacquiao. And to me, RJJ and May are the most gifted fighters I’ve ever seen. They do things that can’t be taught, and there’s no need to mention any of it if you’ve followed their careers.
Do I want to see May fight Pac? Yes and no. It would be an exciting fight but I don’t want to see Pac lose, and it does nothing for Mays legacy. The last 3 fights of Mays have been smaller opponents. It’s time for May to fight opponents his size and not blown up lightweights. But the almighty $$ will have him fight Pac, if Pac can get past Cotto.[/quote]
I agree with all this.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
fnf wrote:
From my observation, the 2 main differences between May and Marquez, 2 counter-punchers, is Mays speed and power. You give May the openings that Marquez had against Pac in their second fight, May KOs Pac. Damn, that was hard to type that! lol
True.
But unlike Irish, I believe Pac has gotten better as a fighter since the 2nd Marquez fight. Yes Diaz sucked and DLH was old, but Pacs balance, head movement, and use of combinations were much, much better and were obvious his last 3 fights. Emanuel Steward said it best during the 1st round of the Pac-Hatton fight, “his ability to hit and simultaneously slip a punch was phenomenal”.
I am not saying he wasn’t better- he is. Much better than when I first saw him, where he just had a big left hand and that was it.
However, to say that he is as good Floyd Mayweather is reaching. Mayweather will do exactly what he did to Marquez, exactly what he did to DLH- counter all night, and roll off all of the punches. It’s going to be a much more boring fight than you guys think it will be, and it will be a typical Money masterpiece.
Pac does have a KO chance vs May, and he does have the endurance to bring it all 12 rounds. But he has to take some shots to get in.
He has a chance to KO Mayweather in the way that all fighters have a chance to be KO’d by “That Punch” when they step in the ring. His chances, however, are neither magnified nor diminished because he’s Manny Pacquaio.
If there’s one rule in every sport, it’s that great defense always beats great offense. The best pitchers will always beat the best hitters, the best defense will always beat the best offense in football.
Mayweather has fought plenty of fighters that have all kinds of power. Castillo had that kind of power in his prime, Corrales had that much power in his prime, DLH had that much power.
With Mayweather, it’s not “getting inside” that’s going to win. You’re not Joe Frazier fighting Muhammud Ali. You’re fighting a guy that has unparalleled defense, who rolls and ducks all kinds of shots, and will let you get inside and still beat you there. On top of that, he’s got a tremendous chin that has left him NEVER even officially knocked down in his career.
He will catch the southpaw Pac coming in with big left hooks, and then slip away. He will dance and duck away from Pac’s left, and land potshots, using his far better reach and almost supernatural accuracy. Pacquiao will not have a chance to knock him out, and I believe that it would be something of a lopsided decision.
I don’t know if you watched the Floyd fight with marquez. I have never seen some one demolish a top 2 pound for pound fighter in that fashion. Floyd shows over and over what he’ll do to smaller guys, and even I give him crap for it.
But aside from a Tarver-eque miracle punch, he will not beat Floyd Mayweather Jr.
We’ll see if this goes down after the 14th, cuz Cotto is a “Bad Man” (said with Ali’s voice)!
Cotto gonna knock him out. [/quote]
Irish, I’ve watched every Mayweather fight. Twice! I was very impressed by the the May win, but styles do make fights, and I knew Marqeuz had no chance no matter what anyone said. But Marquez has no where near the speed or power of Pac at a higher weight, and that’s the big difference between the two.
I’m taking Pac by decision over Cotto.
If Pac fights Floyd, I’m taking Pac by KO, but no money will be coming out of my wallet in Vegas if you know what I mean. It’s fun to discuss boxing with one of the few boxing fans left.
Peace
By the way, I never said Pac is as good May skillwise.
Marquex is also a counterstriker Pac will be on May’s ass the whole fight.
[quote]drewh wrote:
Marquex is also a counterstriker Pac will be on May’s ass the whole fight.[/quote]
Floyd’s one of the best counter punchers around. Pac always has trouble with them (like you said with Marquez). I think Floyd’s tailor made to beat Pac.
[quote]Reef wrote:
drewh wrote:
Marquex is also a counterstriker Pac will be on May’s ass the whole fight.
Floyd’s one of the best counter punchers around. Pac always has trouble with them (like you said with Marquez). I think Floyd’s tailor made to beat Pac.[/quote]
Yea. Pacquaio likes guys that will bang with him- hence Roach wanting Hatton, then Cotto.
Guys that counterpunchers give him problems though. Roach has even said so.
[quote]Reef wrote:
drewh wrote:
Marquex is also a counterstriker Pac will be on May’s ass the whole fight.
Floyd’s one of the best counter punchers around. Pac always has trouble with them (like you said with Marquez). I think Floyd’s tailor made to beat Pac.[/quote]
Floyd is THE best counter puncher around. Period.
[quote]fnf wrote:
If Pac fights Floyd, I’m taking Pac by KO, but no money will be coming out of my wallet in Vegas if you know what I mean. It’s fun to discuss boxing with one of the few boxing fans left.
Peace
Money’s defense wont allow pac to get that knockout. pac would have to wear down money to get the shot he would be looking for…also money being the BEST counter puncher to ever step in the ring, that alone will givew pac-man fits. Manny is an animal when fighters trade with him, hes too fast for his opponents, BUT we all know Mayweather doesnt like to get hit and will not let Manny touch him.
Lets say Pac touches up money a couple times when they start trading, floyd will stop and turn it into a boring fight and put on a boxing clinic. end of fight with a lop sided decision. Ive never seen Manny fight some one who didnt walk right into his storm…and stil if money did decide to trade i think money is still faster, and way more accurate than manny. however if money did stand and trade it greatly increases the chances of manny doing enough damage to get a win (decision or KO), odds would still be in Mayweathers favor though. I just think he a better all around fighter.
that didnt come out right…fuck! i
Money’s defense wont allow pac to get that knockout. pac would have to wear down money to get the shot he would be looking for…also money being the BEST counter puncher to ever step in the ring, that alone will givew pac-man fits. Manny is an animal when fighters trade with him, hes too fast for his opponents, BUT we all know Mayweather doesnt like to get hit and will not let Manny touch him.
Lets say Pac touches up money a couple times when they start trading, floyd will stop and turn it into a boring fight and put on a boxing clinic. end of fight with a lop sided decision. Ive never seen Manny fight some one who didnt walk right into his storm…and stil if money did decide to trade i think money is still faster, and way more accurate than manny. however if money did stand and trade it greatly increases the chances of manny doing enough damage to get a win (decision or KO), odds would still be in Mayweathers favor though. I just think he a better all around fighter
Pac is my favorite fighter and countryman so no matter what, I’ll take him over anyone!
[quote]fnf wrote:
Pac is my favorite fighter and countryman so no matter what, I’ll take him over anyone![/quote]
Hahahahhaha. Ahhhhh now I get it, you’re Filipino. This makes all the sense in the world.
I’m just breaking your balls… honestly, you seem to know your stuff about boxing, so I can’t give you shit. Many of your countrymen, unfortunately, do not.
its just great to hear that people love boxing still. not enough good athletes in the sport. I’ve even thought about switching from football to boxing just to see if i can help out…LOL!
[quote]cutthoat25 wrote:
Money’s defense wont allow pac to get that knockout. pac would have to wear down money to get the shot he would be looking for…also money being the BEST counter puncher to ever step in the ring, that alone will givew pac-man fits. Manny is an animal when fighters trade with him, hes too fast for his opponents, BUT we all know Mayweather doesnt like to get hit and will not let Manny touch him.
Lets say Pac touches up money a couple times when they start trading, floyd will stop and turn it into a boring fight and put on a boxing clinic. end of fight with a lop sided decision. Ive never seen Manny fight some one who didnt walk right into his storm…and stil if money did decide to trade i think money is still faster, and way more accurate than manny. however if money did stand and trade it greatly increases the chances of manny doing enough damage to get a win (decision or KO), odds would still be in Mayweathers favor though. I just think he a better all around fighter[/quote]
Hatton gave Floyd problems when he got inside, and it looks like Manny has more power. Is Floyd bigger? Yea, but this isn’t a mismatch. Manny is probably one of the few smaller guys that can legitimately fight Floyd. The real question is if Floyd will take the fight or not.
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
Hatton gave Floyd problems when he got inside, and it looks like Manny has more power. Is Floyd bigger? Yea, but this isn’t a mismatch. Manny is probably one of the few smaller guys that can legitimately fight Floyd. The real question is if Floyd will take the fight or not.[/quote]
Manny does have more power, but they’re not the same kind of fighter. Pac is a boxer-puncher while Hatton is a swarmer. Say what you want about Ricky, but he got inside like it was nobody’s business… Pac doesn’t really have that style though.
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
Hatton gave Floyd problems when he got inside, and it looks like Manny has more power. Is Floyd bigger? Yea, but this isn’t a mismatch. Manny is probably one of the few smaller guys that can legitimately fight Floyd. The real question is if Floyd will take the fight or not.[/quote]
Yeah i guess i made it sound like a mismatch, and thats not wut i was trying to say. I got caught up trying to prove my point, Im actually a fan of both fighters…TO ME its just plain to see whos better.
If this fight were to happen another factor will be, who can adapt to the fight? Ive seen floyd change course and go in different directions, hes very experienced at this. Manny seems to do the same thing in his fights…end it with a thousand punches! What will Manny do when he cant touch Floyd? or if maybe he’s landing punches, but not consistently like he’s used to? how will Manny react to this? Same thing goes for Money, what will he do when Manny hits him with w/a 3-4 punch combo and LANDS IT? Mayweather has never been touched like that before, and Manny will land on him he’s fast enough. This would just be fun to watch because of the speed between the 2 fighters and the supreme athletic ability.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
fnf wrote:
Pac is my favorite fighter and countryman so no matter what, I’ll take him over anyone!
Hahahahhaha. Ahhhhh now I get it, you’re Filipino. This makes all the sense in the world.
I’m just breaking your balls… honestly, you seem to know your stuff about boxing, so I can’t give you shit. Many of your countrymen, unfortunately, do not.[/quote]
I’m like you Irish with Hatton. Take him no matter who’s he fighting.
And you gotta admit, watch a Pac fight and it’s never boring.