Objectivity

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
61

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Scuba19 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Scuba19 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
…or you can deny that America is 37th in the category of health care…[/quote]

I really wish people would stop throwing out that completely inaccurate statistic. That ranking was done by the World Health Organization, which by the way is part of the UN. More importantly, they stopped doing those rankings in 2000 because they were very inaccurate due to there being just too many variables to take into account.
[/quote]

The report was dated 2000, but I could find nothing to dis credit the report, I would be interested in seeing some valid proof to your assertion[/quote]

http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=9236

Seriously, last summer there were a lot more sources stating that the WHO rankings were inaccurate. Wikipedia (yes, I know) even stated that the rankings were stopped because they were inaccurate and there were just too many variable to take into account.

Even if you don’t believe me, you can’t deny that the lifestyles that Americans live compared to other countries don’t come into account. Not to mention that our record keeping practices are vastly different from other nations (infant deaths, etc.).

[/quote]

While I do have some Libertarian views and think some things especially when it comes to personal freedom would be best if left as Libertarian as possible , You can not (IN MY VEIW) have a Country that is so complicated (NOT) be over sighted by some one looking out for the little guy. I agree our GOV. has way too many problems. But the Free market would rape us all. (IN MY OPINION)

The Cato Institute is A (LIBERTAIRIAN ORGANIZATION) and there for not objective, it would be like going to the GOP or the DMC. for objective info.

Your other link what specifically did you want me to look at, at first glace it appears to bolster my case?

Thanks :slight_smile:
[/quote]

The sentence under the title. I pasted it below.

“The World Health Organization’s ranking of the world’s health systems was last produced in 2000, and the WHO no longer produces such a ranking table, because of the complexity of the task”

That sentence speaks volumes. If they stopped doing it because it was so complex, the level of complexity must be truly astounding. That means that it was probably inaccurate, had a lot of room for opinion and bias injection, etc. Not to mention we are talking about the UN here.

62

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves?

63

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.

64

[quote]Scuba19 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Scuba19 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Scuba19 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
…or you can deny that America is 37th in the category of health care…[/quote]

I really wish people would stop throwing out that completely inaccurate statistic. That ranking was done by the World Health Organization, which by the way is part of the UN. More importantly, they stopped doing those rankings in 2000 because they were very inaccurate due to there being just too many variables to take into account.
[/quote]

The report was dated 2000, but I could find nothing to dis credit the report, I would be interested in seeing some valid proof to your assertion[/quote]

http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=9236

Seriously, last summer there were a lot more sources stating that the WHO rankings were inaccurate. Wikipedia (yes, I know) even stated that the rankings were stopped because they were inaccurate and there were just too many variable to take into account.

Even if you don’t believe me, you can’t deny that the lifestyles that Americans live compared to other countries don’t come into account. Not to mention that our record keeping practices are vastly different from other nations (infant deaths, etc.).

[/quote]

While I do have some Libertarian views and think some things especially when it comes to personal freedom would be best if left as Libertarian as possible , You can not (IN MY VEIW) have a Country that is so complicated (NOT) be over sighted by some one looking out for the little guy. I agree our GOV. has way too many problems. But the Free market would rape us all. (IN MY OPINION)

The Cato Institute is A (LIBERTAIRIAN ORGANIZATION) and there for not objective, it would be like going to the GOP or the DMC. for objective info.

Your other link what specifically did you want me to look at, at first glace it appears to bolster my case?

Thanks :slight_smile:
[/quote]

The sentence under the title. I pasted it below.

“The World Health Organization’s ranking of the world’s health systems was last produced in 2000, and the WHO no longer produces such a ranking table, because of the complexity of the task”

That sentence speaks volumes. If they stopped doing it because it was so complex, the level of complexity must be truly astounding. That means that it was probably inaccurate, had a lot of room for opinion and bias injection, etc. Not to mention we are talking about the UN here.[/quote]

I agree it says that but it is a stretch to say that the info in that study was flawed

65

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.

66

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

You have to realize that the consumers control the corporation. If people don’t buy their product(s), then they will cease to exist. Everyone complains about Wal-mart and the loss of jobs to over seas, but it is their actions which have caused this.

The consumers have the control in a free market.

67

[quote]Scuba19 wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

You have to realize that the consumers control the corporation. If people don’t buy their product(s), then they will cease to exist. Everyone complains about Wal-mart and the loss of jobs to over seas, but it is their actions which have caused this.

The consumers have the control in a free market.[/quote]

That is what big business wants you to believe, what would change from the way thing work today? Why do not the consumers control the market? I contend the same reasons would prevail in a free market.

68

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think?

69

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think? [/quote]

IMO taxing me and my hard work for someone else to use that money for social entitlement programs is rape. If you don’t like bank bonuses, then stay out of the business, or get a job as a banker. We can have any job we want in the USA, and the option is open to do whatever you want.

70

Objectivity is only possible if there are universal principles that we all accept as being true. If morality is relative, then there truly is no such thing as right and wrong, just right or wrong FOR YOU.

Too much Platonism in this thread…

71

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Objectivity is only possible if there are universal principles that we all accept as being true. [/quote]

Is that^^ a “universal principle”?

72

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think? [/quote]

So don’t invest your money in industries or companies that employ compensation policies you don’t like. Otherwise, frankly their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Taxes are not voluntary. Investing is voluntary. Get that straight.

73

[quote]Rockscar wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think? [/quote]

IMO taxing me and my hard work for someone else to use that money for social entitlement programs is rape. If you don’t like bank bonuses, then stay out of the business, or get a job as a banker. We can have any job we want in the USA, and the option is open to do whatever you want.
[/quote]

It is not rational for me to live my life with out banks, no more than it would be rational for me to invest my money for any other purpose than to acquire something of value

It is a myth that you can have any job you wants some people would be happy at Mickey Ds right now

We live in a society that make group decisions on how to spend our collective money, I am opposed to spending it on killing people in other counties, like Iraq and Afghanistan. It is not rape it is the price I pay to live in America

74

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Objectivity is only possible if there are universal principles that we all accept as being true. If morality is relative, then there truly is no such thing as right and wrong, just right or wrong FOR YOU.

Too much Platonism in this thread…[/quote]

I would call your post borderline nonsense :slight_smile: sorry maybe if you elaborate I would understand

I agree what is better for me may not be as good for you , but there are many things that are good for everybody

75

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Rockscar wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think? [/quote]

IMO taxing me and my hard work for someone else to use that money for social entitlement programs is rape. If you don’t like bank bonuses, then stay out of the business, or get a job as a banker. We can have any job we want in the USA, and the option is open to do whatever you want.
[/quote]

It is not rational for me to live my life with out banks, no more than it would be rational for me to invest my money for any other purpose than to acquire something of value [/quote]

Please tell me how anyone or anything forces you to invest in bank stocks?

If you’re not invested in them - the decisions of the board’s compensation committee are none of you business. If you think those decision are your business, please tell me why.

[quote]We live in a society that make group decisions on how to spend our collective money, I am opposed to spending it on killing people in other counties, like Iraq and Afghanistan. It is not rape it is the price I pay to live in America
[/quote]

Right - taxes are involuntary; and you have little control over what the State does with your money. Exactly my point.

76

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think? [/quote]

So don’t invest your money in industries or companies that employ compensation policies you don’t like. Otherwise, frankly their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Taxes are not voluntary. Investing is voluntary. Get that straight. [/quote]

It would be irrational to invest your money for any purpose than to gain something of greater value, otherwise you would just save your money

See you are wrong salaries being none of my business, if I own a small part of that business than I (SHOULD) have a small say, I personally believe I have a Bank deposit that is one thousandth of their total deposits I should own one thousandth of that bank. And have an equal say. Banks should not be in the stock market.

I did not say taxes were anything else and I totally understand investing is voluntary, what did I say that made you think other wise. Is it so you can be right about something? Well you are right about that :slight_smile:

77

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Rockscar wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think? [/quote]

IMO taxing me and my hard work for someone else to use that money for social entitlement programs is rape. If you don’t like bank bonuses, then stay out of the business, or get a job as a banker. We can have any job we want in the USA, and the option is open to do whatever you want.
[/quote]

It is not rational for me to live my life with out banks, no more than it would be rational for me to invest my money for any other purpose than to acquire something of value [/quote]

Please tell me how anyone or anything forces you to invest in bank stocks?

If you’re not invested in them - the decisions of the board’s compensation committee are none of you business. If you think those decision are your business, please tell me why.

[quote]We live in a society that make group decisions on how to spend our collective money, I am opposed to spending it on killing people in other counties, like Iraq and Afghanistan. It is not rape it is the price I pay to live in America
[/quote]

Right - taxes are involuntary; and you have little control over what the State does with your money. Exactly my point.

[/quote]

I agree with you who you are arguing with, I do not agree that I should have to except what ever the board should designate

78

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Rockscar wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think? [/quote]

IMO taxing me and my hard work for someone else to use that money for social entitlement programs is rape. If you don’t like bank bonuses, then stay out of the business, or get a job as a banker. We can have any job we want in the USA, and the option is open to do whatever you want.
[/quote]

It is not rational for me to live my life with out banks, no more than it would be rational for me to invest my money for any other purpose than to acquire something of value [/quote]

Please tell me how anyone or anything forces you to invest in bank stocks?

If you’re not invested in them - the decisions of the board’s compensation committee are none of you business. If you think those decision are your business, please tell me why.

[quote]We live in a society that make group decisions on how to spend our collective money, I am opposed to spending it on killing people in other counties, like Iraq and Afghanistan. It is not rape it is the price I pay to live in America
[/quote]

Right - taxes are involuntary; and you have little control over what the State does with your money. Exactly my point.

[/quote]

Katz, I think you either have an inability to understand what I am writing or your way of debating is to make the conversation about something else. I KNOW INVESTING IS VOLUNTARY AND I KNOW PAYING TAXES IS NOT. Do you understand me :)?

79

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think? [/quote]

So don’t invest your money in industries or companies that employ compensation policies you don’t like. Otherwise, frankly their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Taxes are not voluntary. Investing is voluntary. Get that straight. [/quote]

It would be irrational to invest your money for any purpose than to gain something of greater value, otherwise you would just save your money

See you are wrong salaries being none of my business, if I own a small part of that business than I (SHOULD) have a small say, I personally believe I have a Bank deposit that is one thousandth of their total deposits I should own one thousandth of that bank. And have an equal say. Banks should not be in the stock market.

I did not say taxes were anything else and I totally understand investing is voluntary, what did I say that made you think other wise. Is it so you can be right about something? Well you are right about that :)[/quote]

If you think it’s “irrational” to invest in banks - then don’t invest in them. If you think it’s rational, then do so. Either way there is no force; it is a voluntary transaction. You agree so far, right?

Regarding “deposits” argument, that’s even skating on thinner ice my good man. You have a choice in where you want to deposit your money. You even have a choice about whether or not you hold it in a bank. If you disagree with a banks compensation policies, then don’t have a checking or savings account at that bank. You agree so far?

The salaries of bankers is none of your damn business. Please tell me exactly why it’s otherwise. I eagerly await your answer, friend.

80

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]katzenjammer wrote:

May I ask, who do you think makes up the “free market”? We’re going to rape ourselves? [/quote]

While we can own small shares of any public Corp. we have very little say on the way a Corp runs. The CEO, CFO, all the vice Pres. All the officers, control the corp. I may also say they are the ones that can Rob that Corp through extravagant Salaries and Compensations.

I think when the Congress fashioned the Laws pertaining to the Corporation; they never imagined the machines that runs our world today.
[/quote]

Who is we?

WE - I - can own a company; I can start a company; I can run a company.

WE - I - can own shares and I can participate in the growth of a company.

WE - I - enter into a relationship with a company freely and of my own volition.

If a company has compensation policies that you disagree with, then don’t invest in it.

If you don’t invest in a company, their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Now, all the complaints you mention DO IN FACT APPLY TO THE STATE - which is a power that you cannot control, a power that compels you to pay taxes and is not a relationship that is freely entered into; nor can you compete with or invest in it - and yet, the State DOES have a great deal of power over you.
[/quote]

Remeber this is a rational convesation , you invest your money to make a profit , just like everybody else.

As far as my complaints applying to taxes . People have been complaining about taxese since Christs time

Banks favor paying executives big bonuses over paying stock holders divadends , why is that do you think? [/quote]

So don’t invest your money in industries or companies that employ compensation policies you don’t like. Otherwise, frankly their compensation policies are none of your damn business.

Taxes are not voluntary. Investing is voluntary. Get that straight. [/quote]

It would be irrational to invest your money for any purpose than to gain something of greater value, otherwise you would just save your money

See you are wrong salaries being none of my business, if I own a small part of that business than I (SHOULD) have a small say, I personally believe I have a Bank deposit that is one thousandth of their total deposits I should own one thousandth of that bank. And have an equal say. Banks should not be in the stock market.

I did not say taxes were anything else and I totally understand investing is voluntary, what did I say that made you think other wise. Is it so you can be right about something? Well you are right about that :)[/quote]

If you think it’s “irrational” to invest in banks - then don’t invest in them. If you think it’s rational, then do so. Either way there is no force; it is a voluntary transaction. You agree so far, right?

Regarding “deposits” argument, that’s even skating on thinner ice my good man. You have a choice in where you want to deposit your money. You even have a choice about whether or not you hold it in a bank. If you disagree with a banks compensation policies, then don’t have a checking or savings account at that bank. You agree so far?

The salaries of bankers is none of your damn business. Please tell me exactly why it’s otherwise. I eagerly await your answer, friend.

[/quote]

I did not say it was irational to invest in banks , I said it is irational to invest for any other reason than to make money. If I am part owner , I should have part say.I agree that depositers should own the bank is not the way that would benafit the management , but the true owners of the bank are the depositers