Obama: Sanction Israel Not Iran

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
21

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]Brett620 wrote:
…maybe I just don’t want to think Mr. Obama would be so misguided.[/quote]

I’ve been watching the administration’s foreign policy closely over the last six years and my opinion is that Obama is fundamentally antagonistic to Israel as a sovereign nation state. He sees the Israeli-Arab conflict as a kind of spearhead of imperialism and colonialism. That’s the lens through which he views the world. Remember he was given a bust of Winston Churchill as a gift after his visit to the UK and then returned it? That’s totally unparalleled in international relations. Who returns a gift as unwanted to the giver? Obama was making a statement. He hates Churchill because Churchill represents everything Obama has set himself against his whole life. This bizarre and unprecedented behaviour is indicative of Obama’s mindset and fundamental worldview.

Edited[/quote]

It’s obama’s world and we just live in it, buy his good graces.

What sanctions is he perusing against Saudi Arabia for any multitude of human rights violations and crimes against humanity within their own borders and beyond? That would be zero.
With friends like obama, who needs enemies.

22

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Impartial, legal experts say it is part of the sovereign territory of Israel(a sovereign nation state). [/quote]

This is simply not true.[/quote]

Actually, yes. Yes it is.

"Stephen Schwebel, who later headed the International Court of Justice in the Hague, wrote in 1970 regarding Israel’s case: “Where the prior holder(Jordan) of territory had seized that territory unlawfully, the state which subsequently takes that territory in the lawful exercise of self-defense(Israel) has, against that prior holder, better title.”

And Jordan isn’t even claiming sovereignty over West Bank.

Here’s an extract by Prof. Julius Stone outlining Israel’s legal right under international law to Judea and Samaria:

[/quote]

Comedy. You found someone who agrees with you.

I see you used the terms Judea and Samaria. This removes any credibility you could have on the topic of the West Bank basically your a Zionist (aka racial supremacist with a strong Nationalist identity) and its really not worth discussing this with you.[/quote]

LOL at “racial supremacist”. I mean, if you were going to troll you should have at least entered subtly. Coming out as strong as you did makes it easy to ignore you as the imbecile you are.

23

[quote]Aragorn wrote:

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Impartial, legal experts say it is part of the sovereign territory of Israel(a sovereign nation state). [/quote]

This is simply not true.[/quote]

Actually, yes. Yes it is.

"Stephen Schwebel, who later headed the International Court of Justice in the Hague, wrote in 1970 regarding Israel’s case: “Where the prior holder(Jordan) of territory had seized that territory unlawfully, the state which subsequently takes that territory in the lawful exercise of self-defense(Israel) has, against that prior holder, better title.”

And Jordan isn’t even claiming sovereignty over West Bank.

Here’s an extract by Prof. Julius Stone outlining Israel’s legal right under international law to Judea and Samaria:

[/quote]

Comedy. You found someone who agrees with you.

I see you used the terms Judea and Samaria. This removes any credibility you could have on the topic of the West Bank basically your a Zionist (aka racial supremacist with a strong Nationalist identity) and its really not worth discussing this with you.[/quote]

LOL at “racial supremacist”. I mean, if you were going to troll you should have at least entered subtly. Coming out as strong as you did makes it easy to ignore you as the imbecile you are.[/quote]

I’m ignoring TheThirdIdiot because I’ve noticed before that he’s an idiot.

You seem capable of some critical thinking so…

Can you please explain to me the difference between Zionism and Nationalist racial supremacism? (And I won’t accept that adhering to a particular religion or claiming a certain rather nebulous ethnic descent is enough.)

24

[quote]pat wrote:
Ug, I wish Biden were president.[/quote]

Cause a Jewish man would ‘do the right thing’ and stand by Israel? Not sure how long this idea will hold. Jewish people are fast drifting away from supporting Zionism these days.

25

Corrected this for you:

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

I’m ignoring TheThirdIdiot because he just proved me to be completely wrong on my nonsense about Judea and Samaria and, being a liberal, consider facts to be anathema to my world view and unfair. I shall henceforth attempt to belittle someone who has greater knowledge by calling him names. Later, I will call him a racist baby-killer.

[/quote]

26

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
Ug, I wish Biden were president.[/quote]

Cause a Jewish man would ‘do the right thing’ and stand by Israel? Not sure how long this idea will hold. Jewish people are fast drifting away from supporting Zionism these days.[/quote]

Biden is Jewish? Someone tell his Priest!

27

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]Brett620 wrote:
…maybe I just don’t want to think Mr. Obama would be so misguided.[/quote]

I’ve been watching the administration’s foreign policy closely over the last six years and my opinion is that Obama is fundamentally antagonistic to Israel as a sovereign nation state. He sees the Israeli-Arab conflict as a kind of spearhead of imperialism and colonialism. That’s the lens through which he views the world. Remember he was given a bust of Winston Churchill as a gift after his visit to the UK and then returned it? That’s totally unparalleled in international relations. Who returns a gift as unwanted to the giver? Obama was making a statement. He hates Churchill because Churchill represents everything Obama has set himself against his whole life. This bizarre and unprecedented behaviour is indicative of Obama’s mindset and fundamental worldview.

Edited[/quote]

It’s obama’s world and we just live in it, buy his good graces.

What sanctions is he perusing against Saudi Arabia for any multitude of human rights violations and crimes against humanity within their own borders and beyond? That would be zero.
With friends like obama, who needs enemies.[/quote]

To be fair, you can’t blame Obama for the US’s contradictory relationship with the Saudis. It’s a very difficult situation as we have to rely upon the Saudis to a certain extent even as elements of the regime works against us.

28

[quote]pat wrote:
It’s obama’s world and we just live in it, buy his good graces.

What sanctions is he perusing against Saudi Arabia for any multitude of human rights violations and crimes against humanity within their own borders and beyond? That would be zero.
With friends like obama, who needs enemies.[/quote]

Dude, we’ve been allies with the Saudis for a long time even though they’re assholes who’ll betray us if things turn south. And I very much doubt that the top dogs in the government fail to realize this.

I have no idea how this has anything to do with Obama.

29

[quote]magick wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
It’s obama’s world and we just live in it, buy his good graces.

What sanctions is he perusing against Saudi Arabia for any multitude of human rights violations and crimes against humanity within their own borders and beyond? That would be zero.
With friends like obama, who needs enemies.[/quote]

Dude, we’ve been allies with the Saudis for a long time even though they’re assholes who’ll betray us if things turn south. And I very much doubt that the top dogs in the government fail to realize this.

I have no idea how this has anything to do with Obama.[/quote]

Yep. Obama’s mistake vis-a-vis the Saudis is failing to back pro-Western factions in Saudi Arabia. The Saudis financed the military coup in Egypt whereas Obama condemned it having backed the Muslim Brotherhood. When 30 million+ Egyptians took to the streets they weren’t just protesting the MB. They were protesting against Obama and his support of the MB. Indeed, Obama should correctly be viewed as more radical and anti-Western than much of the Saudi elite.

30

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Yep. Obama’s mistake vis-a-vis the Saudis is failing to back pro-Western factions in Saudi Arabia. The Saudis financed the military coup in Egypt whereas Obama condemned it having backed the Muslim Brotherhood. When 30 million+ Egyptians took to the streets they weren’t just protesting the MB. They were protesting against Obama and his support of the MB. Indeed, Obama should correctly be viewed as more radical and anti-Western than much of the Saudi elite.[/quote]

More like him and many Democrats were naive and thought the Arab Spring would actually lead to democratic institutions, which supposedly means pro-western/pro-democratic ideals. As if those are ever so easy. The U.S., supposedly the birthplace of modern democracy, had to wrestle with the shit for close to a 100 years and even then fought an incredibly bloody civil war to work shit out.

Attempts at democracy doesn’t mean the people we like get into power. The Cold War presidents knew this and decided winning the Cold War>more “democracy”. I would imagine Obama thought this was dumb and chose “democracy” over geopolitics. He got boned over that decision imo.

Really though, I view this as a major failure at looking how political ideology works. We’ve been so conditioned to think communism/dictatorship/anything besides democracy=bad, democracy=good that we literally think it’s true. So if a government faces a coup that installs democracy, it MUST be good. If a tyrant comes into power, it MUST be bad.

But that’s too simplistic and really dumb. Red China helped us out a lot by scaring the shit out of the U.S.S.R (IIRC) as one silly example. Geopolitics>political ideology.

And S. Korea modernized and became an industrial powerhouse thanks to the iron-fist of a tyrant who overthrew the elected government and took control for close to 20 years. Funny how that works.

31

^^ I don’t think Obama backed the MB out of a naive commitment to democratic peace theory. I think he backed them because he is ideologically supportive of them; at least more so than he is of the secular, military elite in Egypt.

32

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:
Corrected this for you:

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

I’m ignoring TheThirdIdiot because he just proved me to be completely wrong on my nonsense about Judea and Samaria and, being a liberal, consider facts to be anathema to my world view and unfair. I shall henceforth attempt to belittle someone who has greater knowledge by calling him names. Later, I will call him a racist baby-killer.

[/quote]

[/quote]

Perhaps EvenIfItsSushi Calls Spain “Al-Aldalus” or at least “The Caliphate of Cordoba.”

If so, then he is at least intellectually consistent in the "once-conquered-by-Islam, always “Dar-al-Islam” and can call Judea and Samaria the “West Bank” if he wishes, no matter how brief the invasion of Jordan and resulting expulsion of the native Jewish peoples.

If does not call Spain “Al-Aldalus,” and he imposes a double standard on Jewish people, well, then, we all know what he is.

33

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
^^ I don’t think Obama backed the MB out of a naive commitment to democratic peace theory. I think he backed them because he is ideologically supportive of them; at least more so than he is of the secular, military elite in Egypt.[/quote]

The belief among my Egyptian friends is that Obama is a a radical Muslim.

I disagree. I think he is an atheist with a Muslim mindset of being anti-West.

34

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
^^ I don’t think Obama backed the MB out of a naive commitment to democratic peace theory. I think he backed them because he is ideologically supportive of them; at least more so than he is of the secular, military elite in Egypt.[/quote]

The belief among my Egyptian friends is that Obama is a a radical Muslim.

I disagree. I think he is an atheist with a Muslim mindset of being anti-West.[/quote]

Yep. There’s really no mystery about Obama. His entire life he’s been involved in hard left activism. Although, I’m curious about his brother Malik. It’s a shame the media doesn’t do its job and look into that guy; see what he’s up to; see how close he is to the president. Interesting Lois Learner personally signed Malik Obama’s 501(c)(3) approval. Of course I’m not suggesting that the President would use the IRS for improper purposes or anything. /sarcasm

Walid Shoebat is not the most reliable of sources but even without his speculation the actual facts look pretty disturbing.

35

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
^^ I don’t think Obama backed the MB out of a naive commitment to democratic peace theory. I think he backed them because he is ideologically supportive of them; at least more so than he is of the secular, military elite in Egypt.[/quote]

The belief among my Egyptian friends is that Obama is a a radical Muslim.

I disagree. I think he is an atheist with a Muslim mindset of being anti-West.[/quote]

Yep. There’s really no mystery about Obama. His entire life he’s been involved in hard left activism. Although, I’m curious about his brother Malik. It’s a shame the media doesn’t do its job and look into that guy; see what he’s up to; see how close he is to the president. Interesting Lois Learner personally signed Malik Obama’s 501(c)(3) approval. Of course I’m not suggesting that the President would use the IRS for improper purposes or anything. /sarcasm

Walid Shoebat is not the most reliable of sources but even without his speculation the actual facts look pretty disturbing.
[/quote]

Malik is a hard core Hamas/Muslim Brotherhood guy. I think more for personal profit than religious, but same effect.

The picture above is Malik with MB and Hamas guys. His scarf is the Hamas slogan, which calls for the destruction of Israel and the murder of the Jewish people.

36

Malik has had twelve wives. His last one, number twelve, was underage when he married her:

[quote] UKDaily Mail wrote:
‘Marrying him has been the biggest mistake of my life. He beats me, but mostly he’s just nasty and quarrelsome.’ She is not the first spouse to accuse him of abuse…

They were best man at each other’s weddings and remain in regular contact…

‘I see my brother privately at least once a year, when I go to visit him in the White House and say hello…’

He complains that he is maligned and misunderstood because he is a Muslim and a black man…

‘Having a famous brother has made me a target of hatred, racism and bigotry against my religion,’ he says.

[/quote]

It’s incredible that the media just ignore all this stuff. They should have investigative journalists all over this guy. Find out about his connections to the Sudanese government; look at the accusations against him in Egypt; and look into this “Barack Obama Foundation” of his.

37

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Malik has had twelve wives. His last one, number twelve, was underage when he married her:

[quote] UKDaily Mail wrote:
‘Marrying him has been the biggest mistake of my life. He beats me, but mostly he’s just nasty and quarrelsome.’ She is not the first spouse to accuse him of abuse…

They were best man at each other’s weddings and remain in regular contact…

‘I see my brother privately at least once a year, when I go to visit him in the White House and say hello…’

He complains that he is maligned and misunderstood because he is a Muslim and a black man…

‘Having a famous brother has made me a target of hatred, racism and bigotry against my religion,’ he says.

[/quote]

It’s incredible that the media just ignore all this stuff. They should have investigative journalists all over this guy. Find out about his connections to the Sudanese government; look at the accusations against him in Egypt; and look into this “Barack Obama Foundation” of his. [/quote]

They wouldn’t want to dig up a link connecting Obama’s family members to Benghazi

38

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
Perhaps EvenIfItsSushi Calls Spain “Al-Aldalus” or at least “The Caliphate of Cordoba.”

If so, then he is at least intellectually consistent in the "once-conquered-by-Islam, always “Dar-al-Islam” and can call Judea and Samaria the “West Bank” if he wishes, no matter how brief the invasion of Jordan and resulting expulsion of the native Jewish peoples.

If does not call Spain “Al-Aldalus,” and he imposes a double standard on Jewish people, well, then, we all know what he is.
[/quote]

This is comedy. Where do you get this stuff?

39

[quote]Aragorn wrote:

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:

[quote]EvenIfItsSushi wrote:

[quote]SexMachine wrote:
Impartial, legal experts say it is part of the sovereign territory of Israel(a sovereign nation state). [/quote]

This is simply not true.[/quote]

Actually, yes. Yes it is.

"Stephen Schwebel, who later headed the International Court of Justice in the Hague, wrote in 1970 regarding Israel’s case: “Where the prior holder(Jordan) of territory had seized that territory unlawfully, the state which subsequently takes that territory in the lawful exercise of self-defense(Israel) has, against that prior holder, better title.”

And Jordan isn’t even claiming sovereignty over West Bank.

Here’s an extract by Prof. Julius Stone outlining Israel’s legal right under international law to Judea and Samaria:

[/quote]

Comedy. You found someone who agrees with you.

I see you used the terms Judea and Samaria. This removes any credibility you could have on the topic of the West Bank basically your a Zionist (aka racial supremacist with a strong Nationalist identity) and its really not worth discussing this with you.[/quote]

LOL at “racial supremacist”. I mean, if you were going to troll you should have at least entered subtly. Coming out as strong as you did makes it easy to ignore you as the imbecile you are.[/quote]

What is the definition of Zionism?

40

^^ Not far off I would say.