Precisely!
[quote=“zeb1, post:80, topic:231623”]
“…He’s not at all losing it…”[/quote]
Oh! My bad…
It’s all a game of 4-D chess…
(Dumb-assed Lefties…!)
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What about people like me, who don’t watch ANY of the “Left’s MSM?” The most powerful man on the planet working with the country that fucked around with our election to make sure elections can’t be fucked with anymore doesn’t jive with me, and I don’t even turn on CNN.
To be fair, the left didn’t make Trump reveal classified intel to the Russians while in the oval and force his staff to leak it (to my knowledge). But with them being more powerful than all 3 branches of govt, I guess it’s possible.
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For whatever reason, this brought up a funny memory: when Trump was asked “Who do you talk to for military advice?” back in 2015, his answer was “Well, I watch the shows. I mean, I really see a lot of great — you know, when you watch your show, and all of the other shows, and you have the generals, and you have certain people –.”
I watch the shows. His answer to “Who do you talk to for military advice?” was I watch the shows. The guy according to whom the media cannot be trusted, FakeNews McGee himself, said “I watch the shows” in response to a serious question about where he gets military advice.
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Not at all. I already explained it.
The President determines what is classified and what is not. Therefore, it is impossible for him to do what you say he did. Secondly, do you know exactly what he “leaked”?
It seems that most around here always gave Obama the benefit of the doubt. Even when he was invading our privacy using the NSA. Even when he and his Attorney General were running guns to Mexican thugs…not a peep.
Bare minimum his administration is a sieve and the planet found out he gave Israel’s intel to a foreign hostile nuclear superpower. Causing damage to our global reputation doesn’t change imo.
This doesn’t apply to me, as I promise I was much more vocal than you could have possibly been about Obama’s choices regarding the NSA (and I wasn’t on these boards at the time). Not to make grand assumptions, but tech nerds my age most likely understand the significance of the NSA shit much better than people your age. That and we’ll have to live with the drawbacks much longer.
I promise I have a huge problem with Obama’s NSA approach AND the gun running we failed at in Mexico. Neither of those things has ANY impact on whether or not I think Trump is handling Russia correctly. I try not to subscribe to whataboutism
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Comey sure was…Wow that was shocking that he admitted to being a leaker.
Well, good for you my friend!
Not shocking to me. There’s no real repercussions to being a leaker these days. Not like he had much to lose. Trump can’t exactly try a moral high ground on leaks.
[quote=“pfury, post:87, topic:231623”]
"…I try not to subscribe to whataboutism…[/quote]
Outstanding. pfury!
Please don’t stop!
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In what world was that? I was around here and there were practically e-riot on the gun running and NSA spying, and rightfully so. You have a selective memory, because many of us regular posters were PISSED about both those things.
And let’s take your comment about classified intel at face value for a minute–fine, the POTUS can make a snap call to declassify intel and share it: is it REALLY a smart move to share it with the Russians?? Forget the legal angle. Was it smart at all?? No. No it wasn’t. And it’s even more incredibly stupid to decide to work with the country that just tried to hack both our state polling booths and our nuclear power plants!!
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Yes there was with you and me and many others. But the Obama worshippers either didn’t say a peep or disappeared for several months.
Not good intel. But we don’t know what Trump shared nor do we know why he did it. If it was vital to national security and harms us I say lock Trump up and throw away the key.
All Russian arguments aside how in the world does anyone hack a polling booth? Remember the hanging chad episode during the Bush/Gore election of 2000? Honestly our polling booths are mostly antiquated. If someone were able to figure out how to have a smooth election without dead people voting I would certainly give them much credit.
You have to forgive ol’ Mick, sometimes the dual-personality thing makes it hard to remember which lie you told that day.
And I have to forgive ActivitiesGuy for continuing personal attacks when no such attacks ever add to a discussion.
Yes I do remwmber, and it’s being reported that the Russians failed their attempts. But that doesn’t change the fact that they tried. And the nuclear power issue is a major one on the same page.
Two things:
First, while it is true to say “we don’t know why he did it” that is not a free defense of his actions. We don’t know why Obama tried Fast and Furious and we don’t know why he went with the NSA taps or the Syrian red line, but that didn’t stop anybody from rightfully criticizing the crap out of those bad moved. Nor should it stop anybody concerned here from criticizing what I and many others consider an obvious blunder that severely damages our credibility with other intel communities.
Second, you can say “if it was vital to Nat sec then throw Trump out” and that’s all well and good, but you’re not even willing to consider that, and it’s obvious. You don’t want to know what went down, because you are being too partisan for your own good.
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Indeed. Sort of like Trump talking all day long about the failing Washington Post or New York Times and the fake news they put out. What’s that an article from them that puts me in a positive light? Tweet and link that bad boy it is undoubtedly true!
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Okay, if so that was very bad. But out of curiosity how does anyone hack a town polling booth? Some are actual write in’s other’s are lever handle. Virtually no where in the US (that I know of) do we vote exclusively by computer. I am not trying to win any sort of argument with you on this one. I am really looking for information on how this is even possible. Thanks.
It actually is a defense of his actions. As we all know, like him or hate him, Trump likes gamesmanship. You remember when he said he might have tapes of his discussions with Comey. He said that so that Comey would not lie when he testified before Congress. I’d say that was pretty smart on Trump’s part. So, IF he gave information it was first of all NOT classified as he is the President. Secondly, we really do need to know why. And we are not going to know why at least any time in the near future if he leaked something to the Russians for strategic reasons. Like I said if anything he leaked harms us impeach him and send him to jail.
First of all if you or anyone on the planet can tell me “what went down” I would leap at the opportunity to know what it was. But…how do we find that out? All we can do is accuse him on message boards of some sort of nefarious activity, or we can defend him on the same message boards and say let’s wait until we actually have some information. I choose one you choose the other, neither will get us any close to a real answer–right?
Secondly, we are all partisan P E R I O D. Some around here would attack Trump if the President made it rain dollar bills. So you can drop that nonsense. Secondly, yes I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for now just as Obama supporters gave him the benefit of the doubt. I explained my rational above. But, I also maintain that if he did something wrong he needs to go.
Back to partisanship for a second. Look around and go back several months. Most of these lefty’s had Trump colluding with Russia with ZERO proof. Did you call them out for it? You may have I am simply asking.
Fast forward several months later and the scale of attack has dropped to “well The Russians still tried to interfere and that’s bad enough” Well yes that is bad I agree. But what happened to the Russia/Trump collusion banter that was so prevalent around here? Poor Tyler even bet me that Trump would be impeached over it. Sheesh…wishful thinking all over the place-Why? Because he is on the left. Is he partisan? Yes. Is that bad? No.
That’s called partisanship and quite frankly I don’t blame anyone for speaking out on their political belief… That’s why we have two parties and that’s why we have elections. One side wins and the other side attempts to tear down the side that won. It’s been going on long before I was even born. And it will continue long after I am gone.
When I enter a destroy Trump bashing session I know exactly what will happen. The light goes off in the locker room “Swarm Swarm” LOL Hey…something tells me that there is partisanship going on. AND…I couldn’t care less.
It’s called politics.
Right. I’ll be straight with you I am not sure on the details, so I couldn’t answer that very helpful. I read through the news reports on that in one of my aggregator feeds but didn’t follow up on the details.
There is no way we will ever agree on this so it might be best to just agree to disagree posted haste. I do not in any way see a love of “gamesmanship” as an excuse here. He endangered a source deep within ISIS, he gave information to a hostile power that has tried to meddle, hack, and otherwise interfere with our elections, and on top of that he pissed off a SHITLOAD of people who are not friendly with the Russians and who have access to sources and Intel we really need. It was a terrible move all around and IMO already harmful to our intelligence cooperations and reputation. I already said I granted for the sake of thos argument that his actions were legal so he couldn’t be brought up on charges.
Wrong, because what I was referring to with that comment was the mindset of ATTEMPTING to learn, ascertain, or know more. Not the certainty of any one civilian finding the “truth”. Rather like the scientific method is a mindset–one is not guaranteed of finding the answer and certainly not guaranteed that the answer will be friendly if they find it. However the idea that they should look for it is mindset.
Your posts and attitudes–at least those reflected thru your written words–describe someone who is content to see everything as a harmless game and doesn’t care to dig deep because your preferred candidate is in the white house. That is what I am referring to, and if that is not accurate to what you internally believe it is at the very least quite accurate a description of what you have been writing on this site.
Yes, but not here. Most posts here reference a likelihood but do not state it as “fact” that he did actually collude–this is acceptable. Elsewhere they are not.
You may be content in calling it all a game but I and many others are not. Partisanship is not merely preferring one party’s political philosophy as closer to your values, it is much more along the lines of blatant polarization and inability to consider the other side in good faith.
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Again, if you can show me how we can all learn the truth I am as eager as anyone to know it. Aside from that am I happy that Hillary didn’t win? Yes! If she had won we would have another left wing wacko Judge on the SC. One that would threaten the 2nd amendment. One that would continually side with Gingsburg and the lefties on every issue that they decide. For that one SCJ pick I am glad Trump won. But just because I am not on the “hate Trump train” that has formed on T Nation does not mean that I give him a free pass. Like I said I would love to know what information that he leaked and why he did it. If you know something that I do not please pass it on. Otherwise you are just slinging mud like the rest of them at something that may or may not be dangerous to our nation.
many have a dog in the fight whether you know it or not. For example, trial lawyers usually want to see democrats elected because they do not want tort reform. Teachers unions are partisan toward democrats because republicans have threatened to expand school choice which could lead to breaking the teachers union. Small business people like myself are tired of high taxes and over intrusive regulations so we usually want a republican. These are facts. Many on T Nation are not old enough to have a dog in the fight. When someone is 25 years old they are still trying to figure out which side, or if either side suits them best. That is not an insult I felt the same way back in the day. It is a discovering process.
I have no idea what you do for a living and it is certainly none of my business. But, the less skin that you have in the game the more “non-partisan” you can afford to be. I know that if the tax cuts that Trump proposed actually go through I will be able to give my employees a nice raise. And that is what I will do with all of the money that the tax cuts provide. It helps with retention and seems fair to me.
I do know that there are probably 4-5 repeat posters who are blatantly partisan toward the democrats. I understand that and I assume that they are so for various reasons. One particular poster has admitted that he works at least in part for the government. So, he has a vested interest in seeing that government continue to operate pretty much as it has. I don’t know about the others but they are certainly partisan lefties. If partisanship really bothers you then you need to get busy and start calling them out. I do not mean that in a confrontational manner as I do believe that you happen to be less partisan than most.
But I also have read many of your posts and you are certainly not a lover of Donald Trump and that shows up in much of what you write. So what? I don’t care it’s your right to take him apart any chance you get. And while I strongly dislike Trump’s personality I will forever be happy that Hillary Clinton did not win for the many reasons that I’ve stated in prior posts. And will continue to look at what Trump does, like cutting regulations and appointing conservatives to the SC, hopefully soon cutting taxes. No, I don’t like him not at all. But if he continues to do the right things I will continue to be satisfied with his performance. Even though he has many deep flaws as a human being.
Finally, I do not know anyone in my personal life or on this board who cuts it right down the middle. Most have some sort of bias based on what job they have, or business that they are in, or for some other reason.
Like any other voter I will continue to promote candidates that favor my stake in this life. If that candidate is a republican so be it. But as I said on a different post, if the democrat party suddenly turned back to the party they once were 60 years ago I may very well vote for a democrat.
And the Republicans found 16. I am still gobsmacked. I cannot believe he won.
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